2012 MOT Rules
- Thread starter JamesO
- Start date
Neil Haughey
New member
How exactly is any MoT tester going to know if the ECU program is modified? and I don't just mean on our cars but on any car.
Peter Empson
PCGB Member
Yep, silly and unenforceable, on our cars at least as there's no way short of removing the chip and comparing it on a reader with the original code, which is hardly likely given how long it would take. Cars that have their footwells full of boxes and wiring going in and out of their ECU might get picked on, in which case I'm stuffed [
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This does sound like the start of a Europe wide TUV type standard and whilst this may keep some disasters off the roads it will make modifications far more expensive than they currently are. I for one hope that we don't get such draconian measures.
]This does sound like the start of a Europe wide TUV type standard and whilst this may keep some disasters off the roads it will make modifications far more expensive than they currently are. I for one hope that we don't get such draconian measures.
Suffolk944
Moderator
Lucky my cars totally standard then *cough*
DivineE
New member
Given the almost 100% likelihood that this will come into effect as its 'the EU way' and the obvious inability I'm ever going to be able to disguise the modifications on WUF which doesn't even have the orginal ECU! What the hell am I going to do? I can't imagine any regulatory body certifying a flame spitting, fuel dumping mad science project like WUF. Do I start disguising the car now? Hiding the stuff and putting a dummy standard ECU in the car that can be booted up but doesn't actually connect to the engine? Or will WUF be destined for an off the grid, un-taxed, un-mot'd 'madmax' existance defying the authorities?
Dont worry about it yet, it is mostly internet rumour - look at the last post
It would be difficult to make existing legal cars illegal, if they did you and many others would feel extremely upset - which at minimum would lose the government votes (not that that worries the unelected EU). There will have to be ways around it even if it means an SVA type super MOT - I doubt it will even get to that though, how much many is the tuning industry worth in the UK? How much tax does that generate?
Tony
It would be difficult to make existing legal cars illegal, if they did you and many others would feel extremely upset - which at minimum would lose the government votes (not that that worries the unelected EU). There will have to be ways around it even if it means an SVA type super MOT - I doubt it will even get to that though, how much many is the tuning industry worth in the UK? How much tax does that generate?
Tony
Based on how things have been brought in previously I would have thought that "grandfather rights" might well accrue to work done before the new rules come in. However I agree with Tony that this would be a major vote-loser in the UK where the tuning industry amounts to a lot of jobs (and quite a lot of export work too, I reckon). So maybe it won't happen at all. But to stop it the tuning industry, as well as respectable car clubs, will have lobby carefully. Sections of the press, and many politicians, will find it easy to swallow a spurious EU line that this is all about "protecting the public against dangerous boy racers".
One has to question the reason for this. What is wrong with changing the ECU map? The MOT is a vehicle safety and emissions check; changing the ECU code may change the performance of the vehicle, but won't affect the safety aspects. Checks will remain in place for things like brakes and exhaust emissions, so I question the reasoning behind these (alleged) changes.
Unless it's a means of spotting 'modified' cars that don't have their modifications declared. But this doesn't really work either; there is no means of 'declaring' modifications to the DVLA and no central register for them to be noted on. And, if this is the case, why the hoo-ha about just ECU changes; what about engine swap modifications, different camshafts, cylinder head work etc etc etc?
Don't agree about the vehicle tuning industry being big enough to make this a vote-loser in the UK. UK tuning business is tiny, and even then it's employees will vote for reasons other than the structure of the MOT. It may be a vote-loser for other reasons, but not this one.
Oli.
Unless it's a means of spotting 'modified' cars that don't have their modifications declared. But this doesn't really work either; there is no means of 'declaring' modifications to the DVLA and no central register for them to be noted on. And, if this is the case, why the hoo-ha about just ECU changes; what about engine swap modifications, different camshafts, cylinder head work etc etc etc?
Don't agree about the vehicle tuning industry being big enough to make this a vote-loser in the UK. UK tuning business is tiny, and even then it's employees will vote for reasons other than the structure of the MOT. It may be a vote-loser for other reasons, but not this one.
Oli.
In terms of votes, I was thinking more about the customers than the employees.
You make good points about there being no safety or environmental case for any such restrictions, but sadly politicians often try to restrict our freedoms on spurious grounds. In the end, if something is banned in Germany, and Germany currently being the paymaster of the EU bail-out programme, it is likely to end up being banned everywhere in the EU as the Germans will be the strongest influence on the EU-wide standardisation programme.
You make good points about there being no safety or environmental case for any such restrictions, but sadly politicians often try to restrict our freedoms on spurious grounds. In the end, if something is banned in Germany, and Germany currently being the paymaster of the EU bail-out programme, it is likely to end up being banned everywhere in the EU as the Germans will be the strongest influence on the EU-wide standardisation programme.
LT,
Germany has much more strict rules on all things motoring, especially car modifications. I could believe that such a test will be to ensure that no modifications to a car there can go unnoticed. I think I am right in saying that all modifications to a car are listed by the tester at the time of their annual TUV test (MOT-equivalent), so ensuring that all apparently invisible ECU modifications are tested for and listed as well simply makes things complete.
To introduce such a test here in the UK, when any other modifications are ignored at MOT time would be ridiculous in the extreme. I know this doesn't mean they don't do it, but that doesn't make it any less ridiculous!
Customers instead of employees - maybe, but what proportion of cars on the UK roads are modified? 2%? Less? Assuming it is 2%, that's 2% of car owners, which will be less than 2% of voters. And I doubt that this issue would be the only thing that affects the way that those 2% vote - sure, it will be a factor, but not the only factor.
Not being querrulous, but I think the political angle is over-stated. However I do strongly agree about your 'control' comment - that's much closer to the mark, I suspect.
Oli.
Germany has much more strict rules on all things motoring, especially car modifications. I could believe that such a test will be to ensure that no modifications to a car there can go unnoticed. I think I am right in saying that all modifications to a car are listed by the tester at the time of their annual TUV test (MOT-equivalent), so ensuring that all apparently invisible ECU modifications are tested for and listed as well simply makes things complete.
To introduce such a test here in the UK, when any other modifications are ignored at MOT time would be ridiculous in the extreme. I know this doesn't mean they don't do it, but that doesn't make it any less ridiculous!
Customers instead of employees - maybe, but what proportion of cars on the UK roads are modified? 2%? Less? Assuming it is 2%, that's 2% of car owners, which will be less than 2% of voters. And I doubt that this issue would be the only thing that affects the way that those 2% vote - sure, it will be a factor, but not the only factor.
Not being querrulous, but I think the political angle is over-stated. However I do strongly agree about your 'control' comment - that's much closer to the mark, I suspect.
Oli.
TTM
Well-known member
If security equipments such as brakes, seat belts, lights, etc, are in perfect condition, I don't see any reason a car to be refused unless it's a pimped shed. It all depends on the pragmatism of the MOT tester really...
Bottom line is have a clean car, behave on the road (=don't attract attention, especially of the authorities), don't ever get involved in an accident with severe injuries (otherwise the insurer will have the right not to cover you in case your car is "much" modified) and you should be fine.
Bottom line is have a clean car, behave on the road (=don't attract attention, especially of the authorities), don't ever get involved in an accident with severe injuries (otherwise the insurer will have the right not to cover you in case your car is "much" modified) and you should be fine.
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