40 minute races for German Cars

[Andy97]

The CSCC are to build on the success of their "Future Classics" series for Pre-1990 Sports, Saloons & GT Cars and introduce a new series for 2011. The series, to be known as "Deutsche Marque" will be for Post-1990 German car makes and will feature 3 classes: A - Up to 2499cc, B - 2500cc to 2999cc and up to 1999cc Turbocharged cars and C - Over 3000cc.

The series has come about due to the large demand that the club has had for post 1990 cars to be able to race in the existing "Future Classics" series, the majority of requests being from German car owners. It wasn't possible to add a newer class into FC as the grids were already full so a new series has been created.

The usual CSCC stipulations of standard size and shape body shell, no sequential gear boxes, original engines to type and List 1A or 1B tyres will be maintained. Races will run over 40 minutes with a compulsory pit stop for one or two drivers.

CSCC hope to attract owners of the larger engined VW Golfs, Ventos, Corrados & Beetles etc. along with Porsche 968s, 993s, 996s, Boxsters, Audi TT & A4s etc, BMW 3 & 5 series and similar Mercedes (although Porsche GT3s won't be allowed....too quick!). The club will display a "Deutsche Marque" car on its stand at the Autosport International show in January and further details of the series will be available on the CSCC Website shortly.



Germans cars from before 1990 can, of course, race in the CSCC's existing Tin Tops, Future Classics & Swinging Sixties series.

 

[spyderman]

Wonder what affect this will have on the BRSCC Porsche Championship that Boxsters started in this year?

 

[Andy97]

Hopefully attract a few more people to build thenm, as there will be more than one place to race them?

 

[Mark_Bennett]

Great. Just what everyone needs, another series to dilute the number of entrants.
Too many series = small grids = no sponsorship = another failure.

 

[Neil Haughey]

Not sure what you are getting at Mark. I have raced with CSCC and will probably do some PCGB club championship races at some point. CSCC offer superb VFM, a very friendly atmosphere as for the regulars its more like racing your mate than something deadly serious, and of course the car sharing option. Lastly of course there is the variety, in Future Classics for example we have had a clio or alfa sud at one of the grid and 600 Bhp 70's GT monsters at the other end, yet the lap times are surprisingly close (9 seconds from first to last at Silverstone national for example).

The grids have also been very well filled. 37 cars at Silverstone in Future Classics ISTR and many of those Porsches.

With the number of BMWs around I will be very surprised if this doesn't prove to be another success.

The point ultimately for those looking to race a Porsche is that CSCC provides something very different to PCGB or the 924 boys. They don't run championships only series, both Pete Morris and Cieran Brewer as examples have done both PCGB club championship and CSCC Future Classics this year.

 

[Steve Brookes]

ORIGINAL: Mark Bennett

Great. Just what everyone needs, another series to dilute the number of entrants.
Too many series = small grids = no sponsorship = another failure.

From what I've seen at the CSCC races I've been to, they are the ones that seem to be doing things right. Good value for the competitors and they make entering them an easy process. From a spectator point of view it's great to see lots of different models in the same race. Almost like a mini Le Mans []

 

[Mark_Bennett]

OK, fair enough, it's a different sort of event then.

I'm just fed up with there being so many different championships for almost identical cars which means the potential field is split amongst the various meetings/venues. The drivers generally don't have the money to do more than one type even if they can run the same car in the different guises required, and the dates don't clash. This doesn't give value for money to the spectator, looks poor when you have small fields.
Think of all the different GT championships there are - it dilutes the field. Don't get me started on single seaters []

 

[Andy97]

ORIGINAL: Mark Bennett

OK, fair enough, it's a different sort of event then.

I'm just fed up with there being so many different championships for almost identical cars which means the potential field is split amongst the various meetings/venues. The drivers generally don't have the money to do more than one type even if they can run the same car in the different guises required, and the dates don't clash. This doesn't give value for money to the spectator, looks poor when you have small fields.
Think of all the different GT championships there are - it dilutes the field. Don't get me started on single seaters []

Mark, I understand your points but this is a series that has been asked for by a number of competitors from both the Porsche & BMW racing worlds, who couldn't get in to either the CSCC's existing Tin Tops or Future Classics series because, either their cars were too new (FC) or because they were too greater capacity (TT).

Add in a few VWs, Audis & Opels & there shou be an ecletic field.

CSCC has a good history of developing competitor focused series that often are over subscribed. On the occasions when CSCC initiatives have failed (eg Formula Free single seaters) they have quickly been canned.

Not many other clubs offer 40 min races (although a couple have now copied the concept!) so CSCC is genuinely offering something that Competitors have asked for, which is VFM, which is a different concept to many & which has grown out of an existing series that is sometimes over subscribed.

 

[Mark_Bennett]

OK - If people are asking for it great. It just looked at first like it was just another "look - they have a series growing in popularity - we've got to set one up the same" sort of thing.

Now I need to go and have a rant at the MSA who approve all the darn-near identical single seater series []

 

[Neil Haughey]

ORIGINAL: Mark Bennett

Now I need to go and have a rant at the MSA who approve all the darn-near identical single seater series []

Confuses me no end. I gave up trying to understand how they all fit together. Another thing which follows on from what Andy said is to do with race duration. Now 40 minutes for me as a rookie is pretty tough but 10 to 15 minutes way to short, yet it is surprising how many races are just that, short manic sprints, probably to fit them all in to the schedule.

 

[Andy97]

The CSCC Deutsche Marque series has changed for 2013 and is now called "Modern Classics". It is now open to any car upto model year 2000 and all those cars from the previous Deutsche Marques series as they have "grandfather rights". I am going to be the co-ordinator.

The class splits have been designed to be different to those in the sister CSCC Future Classics series to try to attract other cars out that may fall in between the FC class limits. Eg a 2.5 litre 944 would be in the 2 litre to 3 litre FC class (against 944 S2 etc) and might not be competitive but in the Modern Classics series it would be at the top of the 1800 to 2500 cc class and would be a good contender.

The classes are:

Upto 1600cc
1601-1799cc
1800-2499cc
2500-3199cc
3200cc+

Turbo cars are welcome up to a max of 2 litre and have an equivelancy of 1.7 applied

All BMW 3 litre cars go in to the above 3.2 litre class

4WD turbo cars have their own additional class.

A 2.5 Boxster would be a good contender in the 1800-2500cc class whilst a 3.2 litre Boxster would be a great car for the 2.5 to 3.2 litre class.

Any questions, just ask or have a look at the CSCC web site.

 

[Andy97]

We have a couple of 3.2 Boxsters registered for the series amongst the Ferraris, BMWs, Ginettas, Mazdas and even BMW Mini. (not all in the same class of course!)

 

[spyderman]

ORIGINAL: Andy97
We have a couple of 3.2 Boxsters registered for the series amongst the Ferraris, BMWs, Ginettas, Mazdas and even BMW Mini.

Both guys are from my team last year. Will try to come to the first race. Might have a fling with this series myself one day - next year perhaps. I've done 40-odd minute stints in tuition and didn't have any problems.

Chris.

 

[Andy97]

ORIGINAL: spyderman

ORIGINAL: Andy97
We have a couple of 3.2 Boxsters registered for the series amongst the Ferraris, BMWs, Ginettas, Mazdas and even BMW Mini.

Both guys are from my team last year. Will try to come to the first race. Might have a fling with this series myself one day - next year perhaps. I've done 40-odd minute stints in tuition and didn't have any problems.

Chris.

Chris, you would be very welcome. We do one off "taster" races where you do not have to register for the series. Or maybe you could get a shared drive with one of the other guys.