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964 Turbo 3.3 or 3.6? Is there really that much difference?

nick3814

New member
Hi folks, as I gradually get more and more obsessed with this particular 911 I wonder what the difference between these models really is, and is the 3.6 worth the premium?

Don't get me wrong I know the 3.6 is an awsome motor but when you look at the current market you could almost buy two 3.3s for the price of a 3.6! Going by the figures there doesn't appear to be a massive difference in performance, what are the differences apart from the 3.6 being a much rarer animal?

Cheers[;)]
 
Nick,

As I know you're aware on paper there maybe little difference between the two (see a selection of data below), however as in the case of many things you pay for exclusivity.

3.3 model circa 3660nr made, 3.6 model circa 1100nr. Personally I don't think you can better the 3.6 but I have to concede that the 3.3 makes much more sense for a cost conscious buyer, and in time good ones have to represent a sound investment.

Model 3.6 Turbo




Year:
1993-4

Layout:
Rear-engined Rear Wheel Drive

Engine Type:
M64 / 50

Engine Weight:
276 kgs

Engine:
Flat-6, SOHC, 2 valves per cylinder Turbo, Intercooler KE-Jetronic

Capacity:
3600 cc

Bore / Stroke:
100 x 76.4 mm

Power:
265 Kw

Power:
360 hp @ 5500rpm

Torque:
383 lb ft

Transmission:
5M

Suspension:
-

Dimensions:
Length: 4275 mm
Width: 1775 mm
Height: 1290 mm
Wheelbase: 2272 mm
Front track: 1442 mm
Rear track: 1506 mm

Tyres:
Front: 225/40ZR18
Rear: 265/35ZR18

Wheels:
Front: 8Jx18 H2
Rear: 10Jx18 H2

Weight:
1470 kg

Top Speed:
179 mph

0-60 mph:
4.5 sec

0-100 mph:
9.5 sec

Model 3.3 Turbo




Year:
1991-2

Layout:
Rear-engined Rear Wheel Drive

Engine:
Flat-6, SOHC, 2 valves per cylinder Turbo, Intercooler KE-Jetronic

Capacity:
3299 cc

Bore / Stroke:
97 x 74.4 mm

Power:
320 hp

Torque:
322 lb ft

Transmission:
5M

Suspension:
-

Dimensions:
Length: - as above
Width: -
Height: -
Wheelbase: - as above

Tyres:
Front: -
Rear: -

Weight:
1470 kg

Top Speed:
167 mph

0-60 mph:
4.7 sec

0-100 mph:
11.1 sec

Go on do it, you know it makes sense [;)]
 
Nick,

This has been discussed many times on Pistonheads and on Rennlist - Rennlist really is the best place to research these cars. As Andy says, you primarily pay a premium for the exclusivity of the 3.6 but also the extra power and looks (mainly the Speedlines). 3.6's are increasingly seen as collector's cars and as such will only rise in value - you will be lucky to find a reasonable one for less than £40k, and for a good one nearer £50k now. Reasonable 3.3's start at around £20-22k and rise up to c.£30k for areally good one. The 3.3 won't lose any value if properly maintained, the 3.6 will only increase in value.

Both are esaily tuned - remove the cats, replace the headers and up the boost (not beyond 1bar) and you incresae both the power and the torque - c.360bhp on a 3.3. Add a larger turbocharger and that will give you even more power (c.380bhp+ on a 3.3) although the peak will be higher up the rev range. That lot will cost you around £4k. So, for c.£28k (less if you buy one with those mods) you will get a 3.3 that out-performs a standard 3.6. Add a set of replica Speedlines for £1.5k including tyres and for £5k you have a car that is only the true enthusiast would be able to tell wasn't a 3.6.

However, these cars are much more expensive to maintain than a SC or 3.2 - think £3k a year minimum on servicing and maintenance, and the upgrading/modifying bug is very easy to catch! I have owned my Zermat Silver car for 3.5 years (see the picture below) and I have spent c.£18k including a top-end rebuild due to a broken head stud (95% maintenance; my upgrades replaced worn-out OE items); the blue car next to it has had £30k spent on it in the last 5 years (£20k maintenance - including £10k on a top-end; and £10k on upgrades) and I know another owner who spent £40k+ on his over 3.5 years (probably 50% maintenance, no top-end; 50% upgrades). Head studs breaking are a very common, seemingly age rather than mileage-related, problem and asa result many people look for cars with a top-end rebuild, especially if they are planning on increasing the power - therefore you need to buy on condition not mileage.

That red car that Josh has just bought was a prime example of the right car with the right mods at a good price. I guarantee it won't be cheap to maintain, but it will more than offset this with the lack of depreciation and the enjoyment he'll get from it each and every drive! Personally, I have also made some very good friends as a result of owning my car - so it has been more than worth it!

DSC00256.JPG


Cheers,

Tim.
 
Thanks for the input lads. Its going to be a couple of years yet before I'm ready to take the plunge so research is definately the name of the game at the moment, going to try and build up as much knowledge as possible, already registered on Rennlist and reading the forum with interest (are the american turbos any different to ours?) and when the day finally comes it will be a 3.3 I'll be in the market for as I fear a 3.6 will always be a little bit out of reach! But I don't mind as its the shape and look of these 911s that I love so much, especially with Speedlines or Veloce wheels, again I don't mind, and I'm pretty sure the standard performance will be sufficient [:D], the SC still puts a smile on my face every time I hit the loud pedal.

Thanks again for the input and whilst I'm on could you recommend any publications that are worth a read on the 964 turbo re ownership and what to look out for?

Cheers
 
"Thanks again for the input and whilst I'm on could you recommend any publications that are worth a read on the 964 turbo re ownership and what to look out for? "

As the man said, rennlist is the best resource for these car, period.

 
ORIGINAL: Zermatt Turbo

Personally, I have also made some very good friends as a result of owning my car - so it has been more than worth it!

Cheers,

Tim.

On only my second day of ownership I slotted into a space in Battersea Park car park and the guy next to me commented on the car. 2 sentences later and he offered me his parking ticket as he was leaving and had bought a full day pass. A saving of £2 for me! This car is already starting to pay for itself...
 
Nick, as a good law abiding citizen you will be in a constant dilemma when that boost kicks in, you know it
doesnt make sense on uk roads [>:] - thats why you should have one at least once in your Porsche life [:D]
I dont think it matters so much which one you get so much as finding a good one of either , then it will be a sound
investment, as you know from my experience. Have a look on my website for more differences between the
two stock for stock, and apart from Rennlist , get a copy of Adrian Streathers book and have a look at his
website ;there is a great downloadable pdf on the turbo technology etc.
 

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