996 Engine Failure - Big End - Replacement options?

[simon_rogers]

My 2000 C2 suddenly developed a knocking noise from the engine. I stopped and got RAC to take it to Steve Bull Specialist Cars in Devizes, who service it and who I bought it from 2 years and 10,000m ago. They found metal filings in the oil, not a good sign. So have taken engine out and stripped it down. Phone call from them today and one of the big end bearings has gone and damaged the crank beyond repair and metal contamination has damaged other parts of engine. Head seems ok. They are saying rebuild cost circa £12-13k with all the parts needed. Option to buy short block engine from Porsche which would be about £15k (all figures are installed cost and includes work to date).

This is all pretty horrendous. The car's probably worth about £15k! It's well looked after example with great service history and I've spent £5k on it since buying it. Can't believe only option is to sink another huge sum in, but car is pretty worthless right now.

Anybody got any experience of a similar situation or advice? Feeling pretty fed up :-(

Thanks

SIMON

 

[Rodney Naghar]

Very sorry to hear that Simon.
You could try buying a used engine for £5kish from a breaker or ebay and fitting that instead.
Give Baz at Hartech a call, he could have cheaper options for you (he's the number 1 rebuilder of these engines). Or just sell as is and move on

 

[gedburke3]

Hi Simon,
I'm gutted for you.
I have a 98 coupe and although I get it serviced every year at Porsche I can't help but worry that this will happen to me.
I couldn't afford to get an engine replacement.
I hope that you manage to find an affordable solution.
Regards
Gerry

 

[mok924lux]

Simon,

That's very upsetting - the same happened to me almost four years ago.
Mine is a 3.4 (tip) and I chose to replace the engine.
The short block was about £5000 (but I got a decent discount and I believe they have gone up in price).
The labour and the bits one should replace added another £2500.
My local indie tells me he did a 3.6 in summer 2019 and it was around £9K. He estimates about £8.5K for a 3.4.
Hope that helps.

 

[simon_rogers]

Thanks Rodney, Steve Bull had actually spoken to Hartech about them doing the rebuild, it's a massive bill compared to the value of the car, but a second hand engine could end up failing itself and still cost circa £8k. Car is not worth much as it is ... No good options here. :-(

 

[simon_rogers]

Thanks for the advice.. and sympathy, it's sad to hear same has happened to other people. I thought with FSH and IMS and RMS replaced I would have been ok. Big end going seems like just bad luck. I will have to drill down into the quote I have been given (and pray that I win the lottery). How's the car with the new engine?

 

[simon_rogers]

Thanks Gerry, yeah it's pretty rough, just bad luck they say - no idea why the big end failed. I've got another 3 years loan to pay on the car let alone trying to find cost of new engine!

 

[wibble]

Sorry to hear this news Simon. Big end bearings could be down to poor oil maintenance, driven hard from cold, redlining for prolonged periods in its previous ownership. Without the metal contamination, I believe it is not possible to fit oversize bearings due to the extremely thin hardening layer of the journels - so options are limited. Hartech are specialists on the m96 engine though, their reputation will help strengthen resale value later, if it was a keeper.

Difficult decisions, but I would try and keep the car if at all possible. If it's any consolation I had intermix issues over 2 years ago and repaired it myself. Now enjoy the 996 as intended. I am currently rebuilding another failed engine.

 

[simon_rogers]

Thanks Tony, yeah its a bit of mystery. It has been maintained by Steve Bull Specialist cars since 2012, I bought it through them 2 years ago and they've maintained it. Had major service last October. I'm always careful to not rev until warm. I've done 10,000 miles in 2 years and use it regularly. I guess it could have been over-revved by a previous owner. Hard to tell.

Glad you got yours up and running. I'm afraid and engine re-build is beyond me.

Think I'll have to find a low cost way to get it re-built or find a reconditioned engine. Someone told me about AMS Porsche https://www.amsporsche.com Has anyone had any experience of them?

 

[Craiglm68]

Probably a bit far away from you, but Eddie from SilverTune near Bournemouth might be worth a call. He's well respected down here, small operation, well known for his work on lots of older and not so old 911's (he works on my 987), I've seen him working on a number of engines in his workshop, he's got a good knowledge of the other respected Porsche indies on the coast too.

 

[wibble]

You might be lucky to find a 2nd hand engine. I would be dubious of so called reconditioned engines on a popular bidding website without warranty. You could try calling some indies or scrapyards and possibly hear the engine running. Unfortunately, labour on removing and refitting adds to costs. It would be at least a days work (in my case a couple of weekends)

Is this a C2 manual and do you mind me asking full mileage of the car?

 

[JohnCRS]

I believe that Baz at Hartech can give you a write up on why this happens. Basically bore scoring. They have developed a solution that addresses the inherent faults with improved cylinder liners and other mods. There Is less chance of it happening again compared to a second hand unit or a rebuild to original spec.

 

[Zeusy]

Hello Simon.

Angus at AMS does very good work. A friend of mine was in a similar 'fix it or scrap it' situation and Angus sorted his car out for him at very reasonable cost. On the strength of this work I had him strip and rebuild the engine and gearbox from a donor car I bought for my track car project - the cost including lightweight flywheel deep sump IMS upgrade new water pump piston rings and shells timing chains tensioners etc etc and the gearbox refurb was less than £8K. My engine is a 3.4 and was a good running 55000 miler to begin with so admittedly there were no repairs or other issues involved.
If you invest the money and get the repair work done right then you would be very unlucky if you ever had to do it again. My advice is if you can store your car somewhere dry and secure then hang on to it for now and wait until you are able to sort it - if you sell it as it is you will have nothing. It took me 2 years to find the right engine for mine but one did eventually turn up.
Absolutely no disrespect to anyone at all but some garages and breakers are just like vultures and will only offer you pennies to take your car off your hands. If you do decide to keep it and get it sorted out later on then make sure you get all and I mean absolutely all of the parts that have been removed - including all of the damaged ones! The trouble with buying a used car is you don't know what it has done or what has been done to it, if you rebuild one you know exactly what work has been carried out and why and who did it.

Don't let it break your heart - try and be positive. A well sorted sweet running 996 is a really great car to own. []

I hope this helps.

P.s. Remember to sorn your car and to claim a refund for your road tax ASAP before the end of the month,

Regards.

Zeusy.

 

[simon_rogers]

Thanks for the reply and advice Zeusy. Hadn’t even thought about SORN that’s a very good point.


it’s such difficult position. Scrapping feels horrendous. It’s a car with good history. I spent £3k at service last October. New coffins arms front suspension mounts, disc and pads, major service. Plus I still have a car loan to finish off paying for it! I’ve already incurred cost for engine to be removed and stripped down so selling it for scrap would leave me with nothing but still big debt, which would be hard to swallow. But putting more money in is a big step (when you haven’t got it!). Saw an article in GT Porsche about Hartech and their work. Spoke to Grant there yesterday, and he really seems to know his stuff. They are seeing quite a lot of crank shaft bearing failures around the 100,000 mile mark. (Mines done £109k) which is the worst possible type of engine failure. I think Crankshaft Failure not talked about much, so much focus on the IMS I thought I would be safe having had that upgraded before I bought it.

Hartech do an oversized engine rebuild to take 3.4 out to 3.7 and improve the cylinder liners and IMS. Sounds like a positive outcome to end up with an improved car not just sinking £k’s into just getting back to standard. But it’s more money and you’d have to keep the car forever to justify it (if I could find the money!). No good options but grateful for encouragement and advice on here.


Thanks

 

[Zeusy]

Hi Simon.

It seems like you have already had some good work done on the your motor so all the more reason to try and keep it 'on ice' for later - its a manual C2 and personally I would hang on to it for as long as it takes to sort it. If you do decide to keep it speak to your insurer and see if you can get a refund from them and then ask them about insuring it whilst its in storage - they usually charge anywhere between £50 and £70 per year.

Best regards.

Zeusy.