996 extended porsche warranty - grateful for advice!

[Guest]

Hi all,

Am hoping for a little advice as am at my wits end.

A few years ago I bought a 2000 996 C4 from an OPC. Suffice to say the value dropped like a stone - well - you win some you lose some.
However at a routine service at 29000 miles was told needed complete engine rebuild costing over £9000 due to cracked crankcase. After much haggling Porsche GB agreed to pay half as a gesture of goodwill.
Six months later was able to drive the car again.
1000 miles later having been back to the garage four times for various problems (the OPC admitted to me that this was the first 996 engine they had rebuilt) it now has a cracked cylinder head causing it to break down obviously and me without a car.
It has been there three weeks and they now tell me that they are unable to clean the engine, radiator, cooling system of the mess that has accumulated from this failure and that as they have tried for 2 weeks thay now want to return it in this state to me. Bear in mind that it is under the 111 point check warranty as well as the warrantly from the £9000+ engine rebuild it underwent a few months ago.
I am totally unable to sell the car in this condition as you can imagine.
It is interesting that when I was footing the bill when there was minimal contamination of the radiators (the fault was picked up on routine servicing) I was told that I should replace everything including the radiators. With their warranty they try and clean it, fail and just want to give it back.

I am stunned at the treatment I have had and can't imagine that I am alone in thinking this is entirely inappropriate. Any attempts to reason with Porsche result in me being told it is "driveable" and essentially I should be grateful that they've even spent this long trying (and failing) to sort it out!

Does anyone have any advice as to how to proceed?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Kind regards,

Miles

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

What?? You are saying that it is under Porsche warranty, and they are refusing to fix the car? Engine and cooling system (except expansion tank) are covered under the warranty, and I cannot believe they are washing their hands of the problem. It is also VERY unusual for an OPC to rebuild an engine. They usually fit exchange units, which would be covered in their entirity for 2 years - check the engine number on the bottom of the crankcase.

I would take it up with the warranty department at Reading if I were you.

 

[Guest]

If you took warranty (the 895£ one) after 111 point check I don't understand the goodwill part ?!?. Engine is specifically covered under warranty and from what I've heard Porsche never refused to honor it. Please give more details as to what is going on.

 

[Rodney Naghar]

This doesn't make sense at all.

I assume thre car was not under warranty when the engine needed to be replaced the first time?
I have heard that Porsche are now rebuilding engines rather than providing new ones, however, because you made a contribution for the 1st one and because it is also under warranty it is absolutely covered for this failure.
What doesn't make sense is why they let you have a warranty if the radiators were contaminated and they told you to replace the whole lot (I am assuming that includes hoses and fluids which are all checked in the 111 point inspection)?

Something is amiss here....do you have any more information?
What is the reason they gave you for not replacing/rebuliding the engine the second time? What's the relevance of cleaning out the system, when no amount of cleaning is going to fix a cracked cylinder head?

 

[Guest]

I don't think you have a full extended warranty (?) As league67 says, 895£.

At least that what it sound like anyway.

 

[Guest]

Hi,

Thanks for the replies - your surprise is understandable - I am still.

The engine was not under warranty when it needed rebuilding hence why I had to foot the bill and hence presumably why they suggested renewing everything including hoses, radiators etc.

Having had the engine rebuilt by the OPC I took out the 111 point warranty for as you say £895. Obviously this is still in effect as this happened mere months ago.

To clarify - they have repaired the engine i.e replaced the cracked head gasket which was the differential diagnosis for the original problem less than 1000miles ago interestingly.... they now want to send it back to me "repaired" without replacing the cooling pipes and radiators which was "so essential" to replace when I was footing the bill when the contamination was minimal compared to how it is now. They tell me I should be grateful that they bothered even trying to clean it and grateful that they are not charging me for this "service."

This is at Reading by the way - I insisted that it go there having drawn a blank at the OPC I bought the car from.

Anyone any more thoughts?

Thanks again,

Miles

 

[Guest]

Now I see what you're saying. Shocking.

I can only imagine there must be some clause in the warranty which only guarantees to repair the initial failed item - and not those item(s) which have been affected as a consequence of the initial failure?

And there was me saying it doesn't sound as if you had the full warranty. [:'(]

So if my gearbox fails and somehow causes a type 2 overrun........

Check the wording in your warranty, if there's nothing then I don't know what to suggest other than legal advice.

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

Diesel130 recently had a radiator replaced under warranty, so they are covered: http://www.porscheclubgbforum.com/fb.asp?m=294659

What you are saying seems strange to me. As I see it, there was a cracked crankcase which occurred before you took out the warranty. They rebuilt the engine at a cost of £9000, when the cost of a replacement unit is around £8000 (http://www.porscheclubgbforum.com/fb.asp?m=255742) which would have a 2 year warranty. Somehow the cracked crankcase "contaminated" the cooling system. How? With oil? And they can't clean it out?

So although recommending that you have new radiators and associated pipework, they send you on your way. Then, the car passes the 111-point check, and they happily take your £895 without telling you that they are excluding the "contaminated" cooling system. The latest episode was a cracked cylinder head, which they have fixed under warranty, but they are unable to clean the cooling system.

Have I got this right, or am I missing something? If I am correct, I think you have been treated dreadfully. I would have a word with the warranty department at Porsche CARS at Reading - not Reading OPC.

 

[Guest]

Hi,

Thanks again for the replies. I think I' m not being very clear for which I apologise - it's just having spent so much time dealing with it it is all so clear in my mind!

The original problem - i.e the well documented fault of early 996's requiring a full engine rebuild is not really ihe issue although I still think it unacceptable that a car costing this much money needs a full engine rebuild at less than 30000 miles...but that's a story for a different day...!

The point is that having had all this work done at my expense on their instructions...i.e replacing everything including the radiators and cooling system an entirely different problem has now occurred under their 111 point warranty (the cylinder head gasket failure) which has caused far worse contamination than the original problem for which they recommended (was presented to me as a no choice decision) replacing everything. They now tell me that having attempted and failed to clean it they want to return it to me in this state. i.e replaced the head gasket so it's driveable but with the engine bay and cooling system covered in what can only be described as sludge.

Particularly galling is that I'm told I should be grateful they tried in the first place.

In addition the replacement car never turned up leaving me carless.

I simply want to get rid of this car that has cost me so much time and money but any prospective buyer will take one look at the engine and quite rightly run a mile. I know I would.

Thoughts anyone?

Thanks,

Miles

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

Oh, it's dirty on the outside of the engine. I completely misunderstood what you were saying - sorry.

If the OPC can't/won't clean it, phone round a few valeting companies and see what they can do for you. The only thing to be careful of is getting water into the alternator.

 

[Guest]

Hi again,

Yes but I don't see why I should have to pay for this service when in effect I have 2 warranty's on the engine and was told it all needed replacing the first time around. I'm not sure what's different this time around other than the fact that I'm not footing the bill... the damage is worse than before and like I said there's no way I can sell the car in this state.

Do I really have to just grin and bear it? I have to say speaking about this to anyone who isn't affiliated with Porsche thinks the whole sorry story is unbelieveable and bordeline illegal.

I guess you live and learn but it's a shame that a car I've wanted to own my whole life has ended up being such a costly and miserable experience.

Regards,

Miles

 

[Vron]

I would have a quick trip to the solicitors and send a letter out. After what you have spent it will be worth spending a couple of hundred to frighten Porsche Reading into dealing with this properly for you. Don't give in.

 

[Rodney Naghar]

Hmmm..so they asked you to replace the cooling system and radiators the first time round not because of any swarf or oil in the actual system, but because they had a coating of 'sludge' on the outside? Crazy.

As Richard said, if you really want to get rid of the car quickly you can get an engine bay valet done (a quick google search - £20+Vat)....I wouldn't bother getting costly solicitor letters written or more visits to the OPC.

 

[Guest]

Hi all,

The first time round Exeter OPC told me to replace the whole cooling system as it was contaminated with oil. Sounded fair enough.

This time round Reading OPC have merely cleaned it and the engineer assures me that it does not need replacing and can't comment on why Exeter told me to replace it other than that maybe they were too corroded to clean. Does that sound reasonable?

He tells me that they've had it up and down the motorway (lucky them - should have asked them how it drives - it's been so long since I've taken it anywhere but the garage I've forgotten) and no sign of leaking or overheating hence he thinks it has all been cleaned ok. There "probably" isn't any contamination left that will lead to it overheating. Apparently replacing the cooling system is an over repair...

As an aside does anyone know how long a micro fracture in a cylinder head gasket could last...i.e would I be able to drive any miles on it before it failed?

Thanks,

Miles

 

[NXI20]

Sorry to hear about your troubles. I have had oil contamination of the cooling system in one of my other cars due to an oil cooler failure (it was cooled by the water system!) & if that experience is anything to go by, expect to have to change the coolant several times over the next few thousand miles. The water in the header tank will have an oily scum on it for quite some time. This may also make the car harder to sell.