A modern equivalent?

[Pastry]

Just been reading the pistonheads article on the new improved Nissan 370Z. The Z-Cars were competition for 944s back in the day, alongside RX7s et al. Looking at he 370Zs familiar looking proportions and stance I wade me wonder what the 924/44/68 line could have evolved into, and wether there are any true modern day equivalents?

that not remind you a little of a 944?

 

[Alexw]

I remember looking at the new RX8 and thinking it looked very similar - ~220bhp gearbox in the back, engine front 2+2. Only difference was it had those "suicide" doors. It was very pretty as well, my girlfreinds brother had one. Felt much stiffer and kinda skittish compared to my S2, but that could just be age of the suspension though.

 

[John Sims]

Although missing two seats (well half seats) the Cayman must be the new 944 surely?

A mid range Porsche with excellent dynamics and the potential to be quicker than its 911 sibling but shackled by the marketing men so it didn't exceed its station - 944 or Cayman?

 

[944 man]

Also foolishly referred to as a 'poor mans Porsche' and a 'hairdressers car' by the uninitiated/hard-of-thinking/bandwagon-jumping-gobsh*te, despite being truer to Dr. Porsche's vision of a sports car than anything else theyve made for a good while.....

 

[James_G]

RX-8 has a gearbox in the back? I didn't know that - but it always strikes me as an elegant solution. I drove one around the Millbrook proving ground, including the Alpine circuit and it felt utterly rock solid to me, with fabulous brakes.

I could be tempted but am put off by the characterless engine noise (not unlike the 944 in that respect) and the savage fuel consumption.

 

[944 man]

Ive driven one around Bruntingthorpe (a Prodrive PZ version) and the handling was very impressive. Quick on the straight too, although there was no sign of sixth...[] Imnot sure that it has a transaxle though: the fuel tank is inboard of the rear axle-line and the engine is behind the front, but Im of the opinion that the gearbox is in the middle.....

 

[appletonn]

You are quite right Simon - RX8 does not have a transaxle.

 

[sawood12]

I think that in trying to find a spiritual successor to the 944 then simply looking at cars that handle well is barking up the wrong tree. I guess it's down to personal tastes, but though i've never driven an RX8 or a 350Z (i'm sure they drive brilliantly - but so does a Ford Fiesta these days) I could never live with either. In both cases the interiors are just shocking - gawdy, plasticky, messy, too 'fashionable'. That is so un-Porschelike. Porsche are much more conventional, logical and ordered. They don't conform to fashions or give in to critisism and carry on regardless doing their own thing whether we like it or not. Nothing is there just for the sake of it. It all has purpose and is placed there on purpose. Due to this the only possible stable a modern equivalent can come from is Porsche. Love them or hate them, no other manufacturer can emulate what Porsche do - they wouldn't dare. I think if Porsche were to ever do a smaller 2-door mini-Panamera, prefereably with a dissected v-8 engine then we'll have it. The Cayman is the closest we have at the moment, but a mini-Panamera would be a closer fit I think.

 

[Pastry]

Ergonomically I like the 944 cabin, its on a par with the other German cars I've owned. Better in some ways worse in others. I know the 350z got flak for its cheap plastics the 370 looks better in that respect, but most modern cabins seem cluttered compared to a 944, new porsches included.

For me it was the visual impact of the 370z that evoked the 944. RX8 and Cayman are pretty cars but lack something, agression perhaps.

 

[mikead]

From the angle that the photo is taken in the original post, I'm amazed how well Nissan have managed to create a bang up-to-date version of the original Datsun 240Z.

In contrast, I feel that the Cayman bears little resemblance to the 944, though it does look obviously Porsche.

 

[Gary C]

ORIGINAL: sawood12

Porsche are much more conventional, logical and ordered.

Hah !, took me 5 minutes to find the rear demist switch the other day !, can never remember which of the hidden switches does what under the instruments and the heater controls !!!!

And who puts the variable speed wipers on a completely separate rotary knob !

Logic no, but I do love it.

 

[Neil Haughey]

As you guys know we have an 08 MX-5 and of course we like the RX-8 a lot as well. Surprised about the interior comments tbh, only the seats are not as comfortable as in our cars, a bit harder. In every other respect the interior and over all quality of the modern Mazda's is very impressive, what looks a bit cheap or plasticky seems to last well and ours doesn't squeak or anything like that and is utterly reliable. The fuel consumption etc. on the rotary engine is shocking though, and even the 2 litre lump in our MX-5 is only marginally more economical then my 968. The plus side though is a very sprightly engine. I really like the approach Mazda take, you get really sharp gear changes, responsive engines, really good steering (amazing for a modern car which are usually very numb) all in a bullet proof package. The one thing I really don't like though and was touched on earlier is the suspension tuning, on a bumpy back road my 968 will murder the MX-5 because they have tuned the dampers to work with big wheels but soft springs, hence really jiggly ride and awful traction on bad surfaces. This seems to be a bit of a trait of a lot of modern cars sadly, works great on fast A roads and motorways whilst being comfortable, but is useless on bumpy B roads.

 

[Neil Haughey]

Forgot to add, look under the skin of MX-5 and RX-8. Proper sports car suspension double wishbones and multi-links, also they put a lovely looking alloy brace to connect up the back axle and engine/gearbox to keep the whole lot really tight. It looks like a work of art but sadly you can only see it from under the car.

IMHO RX-8 is nearer to a modern 944 then the Nissan, but I still wouldn't have one, ruined by the engine.

In the pork stable no doubt Cayman looks a lot like our car in the pecking order and I bet a fair few of us have been keeping one eye on the prices hoping to see them in reach one day.

 

[Pastry]

the OH fancies an MX-5 .. would make my car the practical one tho :/

did consider it when shopping for an inexpensive fun 2nd car.

perhpas porsche will make a short wheelbase 2 seater panamera ;D

 

[pauljmcnulty]

Simple.

There's only one modern equivalent. Has to be front-engined, but high-torque, so RX8 is out. As is any mid-engined car because they are poorly packaged.

Has to have parts sharing, or major brand economics. A 944 isn't a TVR. []

Interior is irrelevant. The most iconic sports car of the last century had floor-mounted pedals and switches scattered over several counties. Sure, the sunroof tends to open where you thought you were wiping the rear window. Not a major problem.

Must be practicle, a 944 can fit a three-door filing cabinet in the back even though the boot is compromised by the gearbox.

So......

350Z it is then. After all, the 200SX was a cheap 944 turbo and the 300ZX was a lardy S2 copy. [8|]

 

[Alexw]

ORIGINAL: appletonn

You are quite right Simon - RX8 does not have a transaxle.

I should stop these Whiskey Diets if thats the case.......

 

[sawood12]

ORIGINAL: Pastry

the OH fancies an MX-5 .. would make my car the practical one tho :/

did consider it when shopping for an inexpensive fun 2nd car.

perhpas porsche will make a short wheelbase 2 seater panamera ;D

They've got to build this! Just needs a bit more glass at the rear and pop up headlights!!

Just a quick note to Gary - the interior of the 944 is very nicely laid out with all the switches at hand and in logical, easy to find places!! Wiper timing knob is still separate though.

No doubt about it, Jap cars are very good but I think they lack something that European cars have. Can't really describe it but in my mind European cars are somehow organic wheras jap cars are synthetic, so for me a Jap car can never be an equivalent to a Porsche. Look at the GT-R vs 997 Turbo thing. Yes they may have finally got the better of the 997 turbo, but give me the Porsche any day.

 

[TTM]

ORIGINAL: sawood12
They've got to build this! Just needs a bit more glass at the rear and pop up headlights!!

Agreed - shave away the ugly rear ramp reminiscent of the ghastly 911-whatever cabrios and it would look great.

To me the 944 is foremost a "shooting break" and only a few cars were made on this concept.
I never looked at a Cayman up close but I doubt it would have enough luggage capacity and anyway it just doesn't have the look.

 

[Neil Haughey]

ORIGINAL: pauljmcnulty


Must be practicle, a 944 can fit a three-door filing cabinet in the back even though the boot is compromised by the gearbox.

So......

350Z it is then

..and that is why I discounted the 350Z, not a remotely practical car, surprisingly little boot and stowage space. They are also very heavy which is why even with 300 horses they are not that fast. Nice sound though.

 

[Neil Haughey]

ORIGINAL: sawood12

No doubt about it, Jap cars are very good but I think they lack something that European cars have.  Can't really describe it but in my mind European cars are somehow organic wheras jap cars are synthetic, so for me a Jap car can never be an equivalent to a Porsche.  Look at the GT-R vs 997 Turbo thing.  Yes they may have finally got the better of the 997 turbo, but give me the Porsche any day.

I wouldn't tar all jap cars with the same brush, if anything Porsche apart the Japanese have been making vastly more driver oriented cars then the Europeans have of late. Take an MX-5 or RX-8 out on an extended test drive then make your mind up, far more involving to drive then 99% of the products available these days and an older MX-5 is about as an involving little car to drive as anyone has made, ever, period. You can't say an Audi has soul surely, or a VW stirs your loins, even the fast ones are utterly boring tainted with understeer tanks to drive. The only problem with the GT-R is that is ugly and seems to be fragile (built down to cost maybe?) saying its synthetic feeling is not backed up by a single test review or even those on PH that have driven them, in fact the reviews I have read say the complete opposite.