c2 brakes ?

[davepaul993]

hi my c2 will be needing pads all round soon so what is the best for fast road use ? & where do you get them from?
what make, type, colour, is there anything difficult in replacing these?
or are they ok for a diy bod?

dave

 

[Pickled Piper]

The best pads for fast road use are the Porsche original equipment pads. Just as the Engineers at Porsche intended. The cheapest place I found was the Porsche main dealer with the PCGB discount. Apparently you can get them cheaper on the net. However, beware, many places sell Textar pads (OE are also made by Textar) and will insist they are the same as the OE pads. The concensus on Rennlist suggests that they are not identical, with many squeal problems being attributed to the aftermarket Textar pads.

Changing them is very straightforward. There is a DIY article on p-car.com. Also, have a look at Maurice's tech article on calliper backing plates. You will need the sticky pads (spiders) to go on the back of the pads and possibly the pad wear sensor as these often break on removal.

Good luck.

pp

 

[angry]

http://www.design911.co.uk/index.htm?Region=UK use the drop down menu on the left.
Textars£40
Porsche Textars£100[:-]

Personally,i have to disagree about the Textar pads,in my humble opinion i think they are identical.
Ive been using them for the past 3 years on the Ring and trackdays and they are awesome.
I did switch once and paid the extra as Design911 were out of stock on the actual boxed Textars,so i took the Porsche boxed Textars and they felt exactly the same. I most certainly would not pay the £50 extra for them again.
The same wording and part numbers are on the back.
If the Rennlist people are right then i apologise,but i really dont think they are different and it frustrates me that Porsche mark up thier boxed goods like this.

Yes very easy to fit providing as said above everything is free and unsiezed.Should be about 10-15 mins a side.
Dan

 

[Pickled Piper]

ORIGINAL: angry

http://www.design911.co.uk/index.htm?Region=UK use the drop down menu on the left.
Textars£40
Porsche Textars£100[:-]

Personally,i have to disagree about the Textar pads,in my humble opinion i think they are identical.
Ive been using them for the past 3 years on the Ring and trackdays and they are awesome.
I did switch once and paid the extra as Design911 were out of stock on the actual boxed Textars,so i took the Porsche boxed Textars and they felt exactly the same. I most certainly would not pay the £50 extra for them again.
The same wording and part numbers are on the back.
If the Rennlist people are right then i apologise,but i really dont think they are different and it frustrates me that Porsche mark up thier boxed goods like this.

Yes very easy to fit providing as said above everything is free and unsiezed.Should be about 10-15 mins a side.
Dan

Angry, it's good to hear from someone that has used both types of pads extensively. My information is based on posts on Rennlist. I would love it if the aftermarket Textars were the same as the Porsche boxed parts. As an Engineer I need to have some categoric proof. I will try and get in touch with Textar and see if they have a Tech department that can advise.

Incidentally, I have got a set of aftermarket Textars and Porsche boxed Textars. IIRC the markings are different. i will check next time I'm in the garage.

OK, email sent to Textar in Germany. Let's see what they have to say and bottom this one out once and for all.

pp

 

[clyde]

I have Pagid black fast road pads at the front of my C4 (backs don't need doing for a while and have Porsche originals) and I think they're far superior to either Porsche originals or Textar. I've had both originals and Textars on it as well and would agree with angry that there certainly didn't seem like there was any difference between them, at least not none that I could identify.

The Pagids do squeal a little but only very occasionally and probably because I didn't bother with the anti-squeal discs when I fitted them (they make replacement much more of a chore).

The only thing I don't understand is why the Pagids don't make the friction surface of the discs shine, it's more of a matt sheen. The discs where replaced with Porsche ones when I did the pads.

 

[Pickled Piper]

OK, I have it from the horses mouth so to speak. I had a telephone conversation with the Textar technical department in Germany. The Textar Engineer confirmed that the parts supplied by Textar to Porsche for OE fitment are identical to the aftermarket Textar pads. The only difference is in the box and the labelling.

I stand corrected and will put a post on Rennlist to clarify the issue. The Textar aftermarket pads are less then half the price of the Porsche branded parts.

Maurice, you may wish to make this information into a sticky or something similar.

For my next project I will try and find out the difference, if any, between ATE OE and aftermarket brake discs.

pp

 

[burrow01]

ORIGINAL: Pickled Piper

OK, I have it from the horses mouth so to speak. I had a telephone conversation with the Textar technical department in Germany. The Textar Engineer confirmed that the parts supplied by Textar to Porsche for OE fitment are identical to the aftermarket Textar pads. The only difference is in the box and the labelling.

I stand corrected and will put a post on Rennlist to clarify the issue. The Textar aftermarket pads are less then half the price of the Porsche branded parts.

Maurice, you may wish to make this information into a sticky or something similar.

For my next project I will try and find out the difference, if any, between ATE OE and aftermarket brake discs.

pp

Hi,

Well done for that - stops the rumour merry go round. Glad to hear there is no difference - especially as I've just had Textars put onto my car []

Look forward to hearing about the disks - just got Zimmermans on the front, so fingers crossed []

Pete

 

[angry]

Pretty poor that Porsche mark the pads up in price that much isnt it.
Ive been told by a few guys who Race Porsches that Pagid pads are really good,but they do cost a lot more and i really have not had a problem and i dont hang around[8D].But saying that i did have a race Porsche overtake me at the Ring,he took my space under braking into a bend and i had a pedal to the floor moment when he anchored up in front of me.
When i got back to the car park the reason was that there was about 2mm of pad left.
I wil stick with the textars at £40 a pop.
Dan

 

[davepaul993]

its great to here from someone that knows what they are doing, ive only had this my 1st porsche for 3 years so just learning a bit about them ive had a look at the site for the pads do you think i will need new shims, sensors, brake hoses & fluid is dot 4 ok or 5.1 best or what ? & also hand brake shoes mine just rolls a bit on a slope a gentle flat surface ! the cars done nearly 45k what you reacon ?

 

[Pickled Piper]

ORIGINAL: angry

Pretty poor that Porsche mark the pads up in price that much isnt it.

That's quite typical in the industry and not unique to Porsche. I work as an Engineer in the car industry and have regularly seen parts marked up by 10 or 20 times.

pp

 

[jdpef356]

That's quite typical in the industry and not unique to Porsche

I guess it happens in all industires - I once worked in the food sector and jam was made under what we called private label.
Same jam , same pot, same lid just another label - and dont forget the price, Up for Harrods and down for Asda whilst
under its own label it sat somewhere in the middle - but it all came out of the same batch.

John

 

[angry]

ORIGINAL: davepaul993

its great to here from someone that knows what they are doing, ive only had this my 1st porsche for 3 years so just learning a bit about them ive had a look at the site for the pads do you think i will need new shims, sensors, brake hoses & fluid is dot 4 ok or 5.1 best or what ? & also hand brake shoes mine just rolls a bit on a slope a gentle flat surface ! the cars done nearly 45k what you reacon ?

I shouldnt think you will need anything apart from the pads.
You can get a build up of crud under the shims,this will be evident if the old pads are hard to get out and the new ones are even harder to get in.You can try blowing it out with a air line....using break cleaner or if you want you can try undoing the alan heads,taking the shims out and cleaning,but be carefull not to round the alan heads,they are at a funny angle.
If you lived nearer i would gladly give you a hand,but you are a fair way from me.
Mines got 108000 miles and still got the original shims/sensors.
Dan

 

[Pickled Piper]

OK, I'm on a roll now. I just spoke to an Engineer at Zimmerman in Germany. He confirmed that Zimmerman do not make the OE brake discs for the 993. However, the aftermarket brake disc that Zimmerman supply is cast from the same raw material (actually sourced from the same foundry) and machined to the same dimensions as the OE disc. The only difference is in the paint finish to the hub and periphery. The Zimerman discs will show some surface corrosion after a few months. There is absolutely no difference in braking performance.

I asked him about painting the hub of the Zimerman disc to stop it corroding. He confirmed that this is no problem and recommended a high temperature paint or laquer. He also explained that from Jan 2008 the discs will come prepainted to the higher Porsche spec.

I didn't have the nerve to ask him which Company made the OE 993 discs. I'm guessing it may be ATE. However, he did confrim that the OE Porsche 356 discs are Zimmerman as are the rear 928 discs.

Next call will be to ATE

pp

 

[tudorbroach]

Question for Pickled Piper

I was once told by brake specialists B.G. Developments in Bromsgrove (Owner Bob Green is ex Lucas Girling Racing Department and worked with teams at Le Mans during the 1960's and 1970's) that O.E. Porsche discs cross holes are cast in the disc whereas aftermarket discs have the cross holes drilled. Find that a little hard to believe, but have never studied new O.E. and aftermarket discs to compare. However, as an engineer you would understand the benifits of the grain structure if the holes were cast.

If you are in contact with disc manufacturers again could you ask the question.

Regards,

Mark

 

[jdpef356]

OK, I'm on a roll now.

Its good to see your back in the saddle - I missed your posts,dont know about the rest of us, youve really come back with
your tail up - good on ya blue.

John D

 

[Pickled Piper]

ORIGINAL: jdpef356

OK, I'm on a roll now.

Its good to see your back in the saddle - I missed your posts,dont know about the rest of us, youve really come back with
your tail up - good on ya blue.

John D

John D,

Thanks for the comments but I think you are mistaking me for the other Piper. I'm younger, better looking and have a more permanent sun tan!

Taj (pp)

 

[Pickled Piper]

ORIGINAL: tudorbroach

Question for Pickled Piper

I was once told by brake specialists B.G. Developments in Bromsgrove (Owner Bob Green is ex Lucas Girling Racing Department and worked with teams at Le Mans during the 1960's and 1970's) that O.E. Porsche discs cross holes are cast in the disc whereas aftermarket discs have the cross holes drilled. Find that a little hard to believe, but have never studied new O.E. and aftermarket discs to compare. However, as an engineer you would understand the benifits of the grain structure if the holes were cast.

If you are in contact with disc manufacturers again could you ask the question.

Regards,

Mark

Good question. It never occurred to me but will ask next time.

pp

 

[jdpef356]

Thanks for the comments but I think you are mistaking me for the other Piper

Sorry about that muddle (honest Im not pickled - burp) but thanks for your efforts they are being appreciated as Im due to buy some new front pads and discs. Good stuff .

John d

 

[burrow01]

ORIGINAL: MoC2S

ORIGINAL: Pickled Piper


Maurice, you may wish to make this information into a sticky or something similar.

For my next project I will try and find out the difference, if any, between ATE OE and aftermarket brake discs.

pp

Done, PP !

AFAIK the Zimmerman rotors do not have the centre bell of the rotor painted with delightful grey heat proof paint - so they go rusty and look unsightly. Again, Rennlist wisdom talks up negatives, in this case about shorter life under hard use ..

Hard evidence is required to convince me one way or t'other .. []

cheers, Maurice []

My friends Zimmermann bells went rusty, so I'm having mine painted - any specific recommendations for paint?

I've heard about the warping, but we'll see how it goes, I don't do a huge milage so they should last a few years

Cheers

Pete