Confused !

[Guest]

Hi all, I am a newbie, and came onto the site to ask some questions about the 997. I have a Subaru Wr1 , which is my fourth scooby. I am seriously thinking of changing the car. I have test driven the M3 CSL and took out a 997s .

I have now had some figures on the 997 with 20k monthly cost £660 4 yrs, this is ok for me and therefore is affordable.

However went to see the dealer Saturady, after taking the CSL out again , as I wanted to have another go with the SMG gearbox. The CSL is a great car, but for some reason does not seem that quick, although looking at the speedo I was hitting 130 easily. Wanted to ask the dealer what are my options on a porsche at a cost of say 70k. I was taken out in the 996tt, and whilst I could not really get to grips with it, it was clear that these are seriously quick. They also have the turbo push that I have got used to with the scoobys.

Should I decide to go with the porsche, should it be the 997s, new , my spec and wait until Oct . Or should I find a really good 996tt. Is there anything I should be careful about, consider. What about residuals when the 997 turbo comes out. Just how good are the 996tt, anyone got any links to video clips etc.

Went bak to

 

[Guest]

The M3 does not subjectively seem as fast as it is, since the power delivery is smooth, compared to a turbo car.
Since there is no drama and not sucha pronounced difference between on and off boost, it doesn't feel as exciting.

I expect the same will be true of a normally aspirated 997. I know for the 996 I missed the fun of having turbo power, and swapped the C4S for a TT.

The TT is quite quick, but not much different in performance terms to a 993TT, although I believe the power delivery is different. In X50 guise (factory upgrade), the 996TT is about the same performance as a 959.

As far as residuals, the 996 maybe slightly affected, but I think the residuals are not as strong as they once were. There are too many of them about now. However, if you are buying 2nd hand, then the biggest chunk has already been taken out of the price.
I am not sure that the 997TT will make that much difference to the depreciation curve. I expect Porsche to use the opportunity to put the cost up, and I reckon it will be around 100K for a new one, excluding options (I could be wrong).
They are planning to announce it around the October/November I think, which would mean they will start shipping around Easter 2006. I expect there will not be many of them to go around, so the immediate affect will be muted.
I expect that the 997TT will not make that much of a leap forward in terms of performance. Maybe I am wrong, but I expect around 450 bhp, active damping, round lights, and some styling changes.
I'm interested in the 998, but that is probably 7 years away.

Which would be the most sensible purchase, 997 C2S or 996TT, for your 70K.
Depends on what you are looking for. The Turbo will be more to insure, use more fuel, use more tyres, cost more to maintain, but it is not massively more. Over 3 years you will probably lose a similar amount on each in depreciation.

Which will give you the most fun - depends on what you are looking for. The driving experience is different, but you may find you miss the turbos excitement if you go for the 997. The 997 is the newer car, will have the manufacturers warranty, so will be covered for longer.

There is nothing particular to consider for the TT. It seems to be pretty strong. However, I have not seen one do 100K miles yet, so we'll see.
How good are they - depends. For road driving, I would say they are right up there. All the magazines still rate it as the car to beat dynamically, although the Aston DB9 beats it for ambiance and styling, and the Gallardo beats it for drama and visual impression. The SL55 is not my cup of tea, and in general it doesn't seem to considered a competitor. The 360 Modena is not the same animal and goes up against the GT3.

Top Gear and Car rated it as the best car in the world (as long as you don't want to take too much luggage). For getting 1 or 2 people from A to B, quickly in all weathers, with every day usability, it is hard to beat.

If you want the best track car from Porsche, then the GT3 is the thing to go for.

Ultimately it depends on your own impressions though, not what other people tell you.
I think you head is telling you 997, but your heart is saying 996TT.
I can't help you decide, but I know that "head" based decisions always leave you wanting more.

 

[Guest]

Personally you should do a back to back test of the 997 and 996 TT I think then you will know whether the head or heart wins.

 

[Guest]

Thanks Stuart & Uppy.

Stuart I have notice that you post alot on the site, and I thank you for your usual input, which I believe to unbiased , open and fair reflection upon the subject matter you are discussing.

Heart and Mind, always difficult to decide. I know I want to change the existing car, but having had so much fun with Subaru's over the last 5 years , I need to ensure I make the obvious right choice of car. Subaru are bringing out a 400bhp version to rival the MR Evo 400, and I would poss wait for this, however the new designer IMHO is making the new versions of the subaru range look ugly, so I have decided to move away now and hope to get a good price on my limited car.

CSL is at the back of my mind as dealers are now looking at doing some deals, poss now get the car from 48k down to 45k, 1600 miles 4 months old. But I feel the turbo effect in the 996 is calling for me. I am only considering dealer purchase for piece of mind and finance options, or would a true specialist be as good, any experience ? Off the Porscge site there is are a few examples, one is at Tonbridge, £67495 Arctic Silver reg 09/02, graphite grey interior 7k miles, options looks ok as well, I am thinking the lower the mileage should hopefully be a better buy, I understand that this is not always the case.

Thanks once again for you input, it is appreciated when people take time to read and reply.

 

[Guest]

Bought mine from a Porsche Specialist in fact it's my third from Paragon slightly dearer but generally excellent condition. Infact mine as 23k on it but is in mint condition. Has the balance of the Porsche Warranty which could be extended but it's covered by their own warranty for a year (has a per claim limit) but I may extended the Porsche one for piece of mind. If Paragon had a TT it would be cheaper than a main dealer but not as cheap as non-specialist. I like the independant specialists as they are generally more passionate about the cars and generally the staff own cars from the marque they sell.

 

[Guest]

400 bhp from 2 litres is too much IMO. The delivery become increasingly biased to the top end and full boost, with bu99er all torque when off boost. In real world driving I reckon it will likely be too peaky.
If it is like the Evo, then the engine internals are getting more race orientated and increasing expensive (titanium con rods are not cheap), not to mention increasingly highly stressed. Whilst this is OK for limited mileage track oriented cars, everyday useable cars, should nto be so stressed, at least not if you want sensible running costs.

CSL is not worth the extra money over the standard car. This is why the dealers can't shift them.

I wouldn't get a car with very low mileage, since it is likely to have spent a lot of time standing, then no doubt driven quite hard. I would say look for something that has been used more regularly.
Official Porsche Centre will probably have better warranty terms. Additionally to extend the warranty they will need to see it. Costs are higher at an OPC though.
I don't know that there is that much to choose, since the specialists do know what they are talking about and half their staff seem to come from Porsche anyway. Finance terms are likely to be be just as important in the process I would guess.

There aren't that many options to worry about though, since most stuff comes as standard. Over the last year -18 months everything has been on them. Before that some items were optional.
I would get Bose, sat nav and sunroof. Most of the rest should be there. Sports seats or comfort seats are a matter of choice, but try both. I would not go for the ruched leather, unless that really does it for you.
Personally I like the heated seats, but I don't know how many people went for it.
The aero kit is not worth the hassle IMO, since you are likely to ground the front.
Lowered suspension might look good, but compromises the practicality, hardens the ride and reduces the ground clearance.
I like the X50 (engine upgrade) option, but there are not that many around, and I think it was only offered from 2 years ago.
If buying from OPC, the car will be unmodified, since they don't touch non-standard, the independents will have tweaked versions. Look out for non standard exhausts, unless this is what you are after.

 

[sniper]

Millie, I was in a simialr position 2 years ago. Had an evo 7, eventually went for a 993 TT.

I personally wouldnt buy another evo/sccoby. They are superb cars - no doubt, but in terms of driving dynamics and performance a turbo porker or 997 is a much better car. Far more style and build quality to match.

I lost £15k on the evo in 18 months - have probably only lost £8-10K on the porker in 2years. Running costs are similar - expect £600-800 for a annual service, 20mpg and insurance is surprisingly reasonable, I pay half what I did on the evo.

I would go for a 996 TT - bags of performance - considerably quicker than a evo/scooby - even a 350BHP modded one. Depreciation wont be that great and its a porsche - although sad you will suddenly find you have a few more friends and the ladies love them! ( if that matters).

Regards, Andrew

 

[Guest]

Hi Andy.

Never had an Evo, took one out for the day as a test, great cars but I felt to harsh for every day, but have great respect for them.

Caught between the Porsche 996tt and 997 and the M3CSL, have you ever had a go in one of these ? Been out in the scooby today, as it has been a nice dry day and it still puts s big smile on my face, but I think its time to move on. Paid 30K as it is a WR1 limited edition, should lose about 2/3k selling private another rason to chnage before the big drop happens on its residual.

Thanks for your opinions.

 

[sniper]

Had a 997 carrera for 4 days while the cayenne was being fixed after a minor scrape.

Very nice car - but tiptronic gearbox - not to my liking. Was very quick mind and sounded superb - better than my 993 tt with sport silencers. Great build quality too.

The M3 CSL doesnt do too much for me Im afraid - I could never justify the premium increase over a standard M3 - very similar perfomance but I know the CSL is far more track orientated - plus I dont think it is a "special" car when compared to porker turbos etc. As you say they are going for £45K ish at the moment - so not a bad buy.

My advice would be to get a 996 TT - best car for the money by a long shot.