Electronic Boost Controllers

[mike220]

So, preparing to finally get my DPW installed over xmas/January. I have a manual boost controller here from the states (when I ordered my silicon vac tubing)but the question is, how much better js an ebc ? Car has / will have : dpw/3 bar fpr/rogue a-tune/exhaust and is running a 26/6. Currently got a cone filter but I have a standard airbox and new filter which is going to go on (saves pulling hot air in).

So will something like this (to keep a little retro, dont want loads of flashing lights etc.) :

http://pages.ebay.com/motors/link/?nav=item.view&id=121013885197

Be much better than a mbc ?

Thoughts please folks.

Cheers,

Mike

 

[944 man]

Massively better. A Dawes or other MBC controls the signal pressure which is set, whereas an EBC varies the signal pressure to maintain a boost target.

 

[mike220]

Will one such as the link do what I need ? Cost wise it's within budget and I have a friend in USA who's coming over for Xmas so delivery is OK. I'm sure there may be better out there but I can't afford £3-400 right now with Xmas in the way. Cheers Simon, Mike

 

[944 man]

Yes, I think so. The Greddy EBCs are easier to set up than the A'PEXi products too, which are notoriously difficult.

 

[Diver944]

I believe Tony Foote has that Greddy and found it very easy to setup and reliably maintain whatever boost you want. I had the next version up which had the LCD screen and lots of other functions but it was a bit of a pig to setup initially. Worked perfect once done though. I like the sizing of the Greddy units, they are tiny cigarette sized boxes so can be hidden away discretely unlike some other EBCs which are huge with all sorts of flashing gizmos [:'(]

 

[mike220]

Thanks guys. Yes that's my thinking aswell Paul, I don't want some huge box covered in flashing lights and sirens - a simple neat item that does the job will do me fine. Off a shopping I go then.................cheers boys Mike []

 

[MarkK]

My Greddy is in the glovebox,tidy,out of the way,fit and forget.

 

[ChasR]

The Gizzmo Boost control may be worth considering as well. It is said to be very good VFM.

 

[George Elliott]

It won't make any positive difference to your performance because it does nothing more than a MBC

 

[944 man]

Of course it does!

 

[George Elliott]

Naaaah []

 

[Indi9xx]

MBC's, low tech, easy to fit, easy to set up and much better than a Boost Improver or cycling valve and standard wastegate. EBC's, not seriously hard to install as long as you are ok with electricals, can be a bit fiddly to set up with gains and damping figures to play with, which can be hard to get your head around. GReddy is easier to set up, Apexi is wonderful if you are a bit of a nerdy gadget freak like me who likes to have control of millions of settings. I am also convinced the Apexi eventually provides the best boost control, but has a noisier solenoid.

 

[George Elliott]

Seriously, if you read up on pneumatic regulators from Norgren or a company like SMC Pneumatics, and study the product data for these regulators, they are bullet-proof repeatable, simple and reliable. Or, alternatively, pls tell me how much will my 0-100 time reduce if I fit a bling box [][]

 

[Frenchy]

What George has said !

 

[Indi9xx]

I absolutely agree that an MBC is bullet proof, we have customers with ones we fitted over 15 years ago which are still going strong and only known a couple to fail. I think it was Collin Chapman who used to say "Lighten and then simplify" as the mantra for lotus, and there is a lot to be said for that, as with complexity there is always the introduction of reliability issues.. I even remember there are equations for this. However, an EBC will tend to be able to hold boost further than a MBC, as it can be dynamic rather than static, but also can be tuned using damping to stop any boost ripple as can be seen on lots of MBC dyno charts as well as boost overshoot. But then again, boost overshoot is another thing altogether and can be quite desirable if tuned right, as any engine is detonation tolerant to overboost in short durations, which can give a short and useful boost in torque at the moment of overshoot. But that is possibly better tuned using some other devices plumbed into the same circuit. Rather than an MBC, we did some experiments with using a variable pressure blow off (almost the opposite to a regulator) and a regulator as an MBC, which had some interesting results, especially in theory, but we did not pursue them far enough to reap decent results. Although we did manage to test some outrageously complicated plumbing with various valves!

 

[Frenchy]

"Simple is Efficient"..................Henry Ford

 

[944 man]

ORIGINAL: George Elliott Or, alternatively, pls tell me how much will my 0-100 time reduce if I fit a bling box [][]

As well as maintaining a boost target, an electronic boost controller may be progrmmable allowing different boost profiles in different gears.

 

[Eldavo]

Just to be a pedantic oaf, the original quote was "simplicate and add more lightness" by William Bushnell Stout. Colin Chapman nicked it and dropped the "more", the simplicate got changed over the years through various tellings to the more well known "simplify". As you were gentlemen

 

[T3rra]

Iv got an Apexi. It's still needs a bit tweak now and then even in self learn mode. I cut the inside top off the cubby hole out just behind the lip and halfway back between the lip And rubber. Apexi fits in the cubby hole and lives in the glove box when not in use or under passengers floor mat. Apexi is readable so u don't need standalone gauge. I'm running barks ecu and can mointer every off android app on a smart phone, which sits in a dash vent holder, placed on the right off the dash. Easy mointer, and put away. Not sure if the greedy or other ebcs or mbc hold boost when it tries to drop off, but on the Apexi I increased the duty cycle after 4.5 k so I can hold 1.3 nearly to red line rather then dropping to 1 bar on a fixed duty setting if you really want to get the most from your engine I would recommend http://www.augmentautomotive.co.uk/augtronic Iv gone thought the tuning softwear with Tom over the last few nights updated the close loop settings and de bugging a connection on the throttle poison Sensor. I would recommend aumotive route to anyone going stand alone. Sent Tom the data log from a drive he checked it made the adjustment to suit my preferences and I just updated the ecu. It all makes for a clean install and great uk product support. I really wouldn't know where to start with my own tune, so would off end up with just chip sets

 

[George Elliott]

an electronic boost controller may be progrmmable allowing different boost profiles

fair point Simon, a genuine benefit provided the Engine Management is clever enough to manage overboost such as on a 997TT or gear related boost limits. I voted MBC as my Engine Management is similarly basic. If Santa brings me an Augment ECU like T3rra runs, I would agree I need a solenoid operated boost control. George 944t