Purchasing a C4S

[Phil68]

Hi all, I'm new to the forum.

We sold our 2012 Cayman 18 months ago due to a serious health issue, which is now resolved thankfully. We are missing our Porsche and have decided to go for a 911 this time. The 996 C4S is our preferred option after looking into the financial aspect and long term ownership. We have a budget of around £25,000 and looking around it seems like we can get a decent age/mileage/condition C4S for this money. (We did consider going for a 997 Gen2 from an OPC, but after visiting one yesterday we were disappointed at the PCP plans they were offering. On an '09 Carrera at £36,000 they were asking for a £7,000 deposit, over £600 a month for 3 years with a final balloon payment of just £12,000. I thought the final payment was based on the guaranteed future value? £12,000 for a 10 year old 997???). So taking into account depreciation, interest charges etc, we are far better off going for an older vehicle, with the possibility of minimum or no depreciation? A no-brainer really?

My question is mainly where to buy from? The OPC's don't have vehicles this old, so I'm looking at Independent dealers. I looked at one yesterday but it was not a recognised Independent dealer and I didn't get a good vibe from the place. I would consider looking at private sales but I appreciate there are risks involved. I'm guessing you experienced enthusiasts on here will point me towards reputable Independent Porsche specialists, which is probably what I'm swaying towards. However, I've no experience of any of these at all. If I did buy from one of these, is it still necessary to have an independent inspection done, or would the warranty give me a little bit of security?

I have some other questions regarding the vehicle itself if that's ok.
I am not sure about manual or tiptronic. Our Cayman had PDK which was fantastic, but I don't mind manual cars and I'm also thinking ahead a little regarding resale. I guess if the perfect C4S becomes available and it ticks all our boxes, but was tiptronic, I'd probably go for it, but I just wanted to get some opinion on this.

Colour I am sure about, it has to be silver or grey with black interior. Optional extras - again I'm not sure, but I appreciate I'm just going to have to go with whatever it has, when I find a suitable vehicle. (Condition, mileage, history are more important). However, are there any "must haves" on a car like this? I would prefer heated seats, park assist and sports exhaust, but I realise I may not get any of those.

The couple of salesmen I have spoken to so far have all been very dismissive of the IMS and other engine issues, and were keen to tell me that 996 C4S values are increasing rapidly!?

Hopefully we will be able to find a suitable car very soon, we've been bitten by the bug again and there's no stopping us now!!

Thanks for reading and sorry for a long first post.

Phil

 

[Pieman7]

Hi Phil I bought my 2003 c4s in October of last year I paid slightly over 24k for mine it had nay covered 40'000 miles and is in immaculate condition for a 14 year old car. It is a tiptronic and I have no regrets buying instead of a Manuel. 25k should get something fantastic just check all the relevant issues like a independent porsche check, computer read out ,check all tyres have same n rating and as much porsche or indie service and parts history as you can. Ims bearing not a thing to worry about budget in your thoughts around 1500.00 to change if tiptronic is chose. Since I've had it the handling cornering etc is fantastic. Good luck with finding one it took me 5 months but worth the wait let us know how you get on where in the country are you some of the guys can point out good places to look

 

[NickCWebb]

Wherever you get a car from, get an independent inspection carried out, worth the peace of mind for the cost. We used Peter Morgan, very comprehensive report with photos, and can give you ammunition to barter with if anything is found during the inspection.

Where you are based depends on which independent sales specialists would be appropriate, but we have always been prepared to travel (when we sold our Carrera 3.2 and bought our 996 C2 October 2014 we visited four different counties). We eventually sold through 911 Virgin, Tom was excellent and the advert he wrote for our car almost made us wish we hadn't sold her! We bought from Northway, Slate Grey 996 C2 manual coupe with full black leather interior. We wanted manual, as we had been used to that with the 3.2 and just prefer the extra level of control over which gear to use when, probably could get used to driving a Tip in the same way given time, but it is a matter of personal preference. The car had just under 24k miles when we bought it, so very low mileage (it was registered October 2002, so just under 2k miles per annum). We also visited RPM Technik and Paul Stephens.

We negotiated with Northway to replace the IMS bearing before we took the car as part of the major service they were carrying out, even thought the mileage was so low. We split the cost in a way that we were both happy with, and it has taken away some of the anxiety about the well documented engine issues. We are considering going down the Evans waterless coolant and lower temperature thermostat as an extra precaution at the next service (we always go to the wonderful Autostrasse in Coggeshall, despite now living in Buckinghamshire!), but other than that, we just enjoy driving the car. The 3.2 was fun, but in a different (retro, heavier) way.

 

[Phil68]

Thank you both very much for your replies.

We are in Staffordshire, but I don't mind travelling. I get free train travel due to the fact that I drive them for a living, so that's a help!

I have been to one local independent, that was PCT in Coventry, which seemed a reasonable place. Whilst in Coventry I also saw another dealer, JR Motor Company. I didn't call in as it only had one car on the forecourt.
I have seen a C4S for sale at Cridfords in Guildford, which is quite a distance but I may well go and have a look. It doesn't have parking sensors or heated seats though, which are not essential but we would have liked these. But it does have PCM, Bose & Xenons.

I agree regarding the inspection, it's sure to bring something up that I wouldn't have noticed, hopefully nothing too problematic but as you say, something that would enable me to get back at least some of the inspection cost with a bit of haggling.

Once again, thanks for the input, I've only just joined this club after having been in TIPEC previously when we had the Cayman. This forum looks great and I think I'll be spending some time on it.

 

[BELL8]

Shirley's at Meridian are a good dealer to deal with and its on the way to PCT very friendly and helpful I purchased my car from there and would again.
Can give you contact details if you require them

 

[Pieman7]

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/porsche/911-carrera-996/porsche-911-996-carrera-4s-tiptronic-s--full-porsche-opc-service-history--absolutely-stunning/5282957

this little baby came up

 

[Phil68]

Thanks both.

Will pop into Shirley's, it's only 10 miles away!

That black 4S looked nice but it is sold when you go to their website. They certainly know how to prepare, photograph and present their vehicles though, very impressive and something a lot of other dealers could learn from.

 

[wibble]

If you decide to come to Cridfords, then I would suggest also Mortimers in Billingshurst and James Paul at Bucks Green. The latter two rarely get mentioned on forums, yet Mortimers get some cracking cars in stock. James Paul is mainly a BMW indie (and I have bought from them in the past), but also deals with other exotica now. I hasten to add both of these have C4S tips in stock, although outside your budget.

 

[Phil68]

Thanks Tony.

I've heard back from Cridfords and the car has had 8 owners, the last 5 they have dealt with.
I'm a bit uneasy about that, should I be?

 

[BELL8]

If you speak to Carl at Shirley's and tell him what you are looking for he can normal find what you require.

 

[wibble]

Number of owners is not always a bad thing. Some argue that owners put money in to their cars on first few years of ownership, so that could be considered a good thing. On the other hand it may put potential buyers off when you re-sell. If the the car looks good and is fully stamped, then not a problem. Cridfords have a good reputation and guess they offer warranty, my worry is you would need to travel back south to have any issues sorted should that be the case.

Also check Northways in Reading - Ray is worth having a chat too.

 

[N.W.Jones]

Hi Phil
I bought my C4s privately from an ebay advert
No problems, have you tried Top Marques on line this site will have something to satisfy you
I would always go for a tiptronic as you will be always changing gear
Porsche sports exhaust is very desirable and cruise control ( but you can retrofit this for about £350)
I find silver and black boring, mine is speed yellow and fantastic.
IMS I suppose can be an issue but as I understand quite unusual
Look at the exhaust boxes as they can split round the seams
Good luck

 

[Phil68]

Thanks all once again.

Had a very interesting week or so viewing cars. Actually more frustrating than interesting. There are some well dodgy motors about! I've looked at some dealers but they've not been Porsche Specialists. Also looked at private sales but think I'm going to stick to Porsche specialists. It's almost giving me second thoughts after seeing what is available. I understand I'm looking at 12-14 year old cars, but where are all the cherished, well looked after ones???

I've contacted most of the well known Indy's but none of them got any coming in anytime soon. Might have to consider a 997 instead, but then the bore-scoring is a bit off-putting.

Confused and frustrated...

 

[Whiston]

Phil I am selling my 997 soon which is a good one with engine rebuild last year. If you are interested give my a call. 07971179120 mike

 

[James Beaumont]

Hi

I bought my c4s this time last year at 14k in speed yellow black leather all the extras too with 70k on the clock manual, loved every miles I put on her then sold it in November for 22k, great car only sold it when I found 996 turbo.

 

[Pieman7]

I would wait for a decent 996 you won't lose money on one. I hunted high and low and yes it was a pain but I'm glad I did

 

[wibble]

Think I started looking 6 months before I bought. Trawled all the usual motor websites. Even ebay have some gems, but you need to be quick. You also get an idea of the 'dogs' that never sell and seem to be too good to be true. Finally, decided that indie was the route to take with a trade-in and warranty.

 

[kasspa]

Hi Phil,
sent you a PM earlier today

 

[Phil68]

Thanks all. I think I'll just have to keep looking and hopefully find a good one. I'm going to look at one tomorrow at a Porsche Independent. I'm hopeful it's going to be the one but I'm still not 100% comfortable that it's had 8 owners since 2002. However most people keep telling me that's not a problem. I guess if everything else about the car is spot on that's ok. It's got a very good service history and looks good in the photos, but I'll find out myself tomorrow. Fingers crossed.

 

[Phil68]

Hi Phil,
sent you a PM earlier today

Sorry, been really busy today and missed that. I'll take a look now...