Road Tyre Recommendations to Survive Track Use

Guest · May 30, 2006

I recently replaced my front tyres with Toyo T1-Rs and then did a track day at Croft a week, or so, ago. Now I have 'knackered' my front tyres - Dave from Redline Racing told me that they look the same as when their race cars wet tyres have been run in the dry. I presume that this means that they have overheated. Having done one track day I'm keen to have another go, but don't want to be replacing front tyres after each day out. But I don't think that it will be worth buying some tyres solely for track day use, since I don't think that I would do much more than two, or maybe three track days per year. Does anyone have a recommendation for a road tyre (this is my daily driver) that will at least survive a track day, even if it doesn't give the ultimate level of grip that a focussed track tyre would?

Secondly, would you recommend replacing the oil after each track day, or just every 6,000 miles/annually?
Cheers,

Graham

edh · May 30, 2006

When you say you've knackered them - what exactly have you done? Is there any tread left? I'd be very suprised if they were scrap.

I've done 3 days so far on my T1-R's & there's plenty of tread left. The front outer shoulders are a bit worn, so I'm going to swap the tyres over onto the other wheels.

If you want tyres that last on track days, you caould always use P6000's - they never wear out

As for oil, firstly I'd recommend a good synthetic for track use - keeps oil pressures up when hot. I don't see any reason to change it after every track day, but if you're using the car hard, maybe reduce your oil change intervals to 3k

Guest · May 30, 2006

OK - I'll concede that perhaps 'knackered' is overstating the case rather. The thing I noticed during the course of the track day itself was that the outer shoulders were wearing, but not to too great a degree. But the tread block across the width of the tyre have worn on the outside edge, leading to almost a 'stepped' cross-section, on the left hand tyre. I suspect, but don't know, that it may be that it is this wear pattern which is now giving me vibration at high speeds and also pronounced vibration on heavy braking from high speed. I noticed this effect as the day wore on at Croft when braking hard for Sunny In and Tower Bend in particular. I don't get this effect under normal daily driving conditions unless I'm braking really hard for a roundabout at the end of a dual-carriageway, or similar. The tyre wear pattern may be something to do with my driving style and that I'm going into corners too fast (on a track only - of course), leading to understeer, and I would be better off, both in terms of speed and tyre wear, following the 'slow in, fast out' edict.

Redline Racing's tyre supplier is suggesting Continental Contact Sport - any thoughts, or comments on these?

Chris Goodman · May 30, 2006

suspect the braking symptoms are glazed / overheated pads or warped discs rather than the tyres. Very important to stay off the brakes during your cooling-off lap - you do do a cooling off lap don't you?? If you've got plenty pad material left, try putting a file or similar across them to break up the glaze / high spots and bed them in again.

Guest · May 30, 2006

I don't think that there's anything wrong with the tyres. It sounds like you're getting them very hot. Either the setup of the car, or possibly your driving style is making them overheat.

Think back to the film Days Of Thunder. Tom Cruise can't get his tyres to last a race, then he gets told to drive a bit more smoothly, and all of a sudden he's winning.

I'm not suggesting that you're short like Tom Cruise, but perhaps some of the other areas could be similar [

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edh · May 30, 2006

Of course massive understeer will kill your tyres - it's a common mistake to get corner entry speeds too high at first ( I still do it

)

You might also have been running them at very high pressures? - normal road pressures are no good as they'll go much higher on track

Were the tyres very squeally? - I've found that knocking a few psi often helps - maybe down to 30-32 psi (hot) all round for your car

(I also happen to know James has some P6000's he'd love to get rid of - if you want some really hard wearing tyres

)

Guest · May 30, 2006

Tell me about it. I've been trying to kill those damned tyres since I got the car. They're imortal!

I run at 30psi all round on my car, and that seems about right. I usually spend the first couple of sessions just getting the pressures correct. Then the rest of the day blaming the P6000s for my poor performance.

Actually, maybe I'll get another set of them for track days.... [

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sawood12 · May 30, 2006

Maybe tyre pressures are too low if you are getting what appears to be excess scrubbing on the shoulders (edges?) of the tyres. Perhaps try a PSI or two more next time. My Conti's looked untouched after my Donington outing but I think I was being a bit of a wimp.

Peter Empson · May 30, 2006

To be honest (depending upon the degree) this sounds fairly normal to me, I use T1-R's too, they're quite soft and will wear in this manner with circuit use. Personaly I get 3-6 track days plus a decent number of road miles on mine.

The conti-sports I had before (which I didn't get on with to be honest) were much harder and didn't suffer the wear but weren't anywhere near as much fun either.

My tyres look pretty knackered on the edges after a couple of track days (enough to have been pulled over by a passing police car) but they're still perfectly legal if the wear is just to the shoulder.

You might consider going for a slightly more track biassed setup with a bit more negative camber (as I do) which should help, but it will still happen.

The vibration you're experiencing might just be bits of melted tyre stuck to the tread that will wear off after a few miles, I certainly pick this up on cooling down laps. Alternatively it might be a brake disc issue (some call it warping but I'm not so sure, might be hot pad leaving deposits on disc etc) but I know the feeling.

Best regards,
Peter.

Diver944 · May 31, 2006

In the long run I found it was much cheaper to get a second set of scruffy wheels and buy proper track tyres. As Peter said, even they will show a feathered edge after heavy and prolonged cornering and this can only be addressed if you run extreme camber on track so that the tyre is flat on the road when cornering. This will then hamper your road setup and cause excess wear to teh inside of the tyre [8|]

I use hard compound full race slicks on track and they last an absolute age. My rears have done 12 trackdays now and are still only half worn. The fronts only last 6 days because they were down to the canvas on the outer edge - yet still plenty of rubber on the centre and inside edge

Adjustable camber plates are next on my shopping list