Still not starting.

[Frenchy]

First of all does anyone on here know if a dodgy KLR ecu would affect my non starting problem ? i have tacho bounce,crank sensors are within resistance range, removed and cleaned them, fitted a DME by pass, also tried a proven DME relay, ECU tested on my other car and is fine, TPS Switch changed,coil changed, distributor and arm checked.
I have put in some fresh fuel, 3 bar fuel pressure shown at fuel rail gauge and plugs are getting wet, i also have a spark when fitting a spare plug to the leads, all ignition relays and fuses swapped out ?

Proving to be a real headache is this one !

 

[bmnelsc]

this is a puzzler. You say you have spark if you put a spare plug into a lead - are you grounding that plug to some bodywork to get a spark? Given that you have isolated (sounds like) every other possibility, do you have a problem with engine ground?

 

[Frenchy]

Cheers Bruce, Yes i have a spark, but come to think off it this was when the plug was held on to the strut brace and not the engine, one to check.

 

[George Elliott]

this is a puzzler.

sure is

We can assume the leads are on the correct terminals of the dizzy...

We had an Earth fault in the last 6 months, the resistance from the inlet manifold to the body was 80ohms.

Cleaning terminals and refitting got it down to 0.4ohms

wish I could help

George
944t

 

[Frenchy]

Yes a real head scratcher George, plug leads are going to be checked along with distributor and king lead they are in the correct order also earths will get a good coat of "looking at" []

 

[peanut]

haven't you got this sorted yet Frenchy?.

Good suggestion by Bruce. Try connecting one of your jump leads between the bodywork and the engine to provide a good tempoary earth to the transmission. Simple and quick.

If you have a good spark at the right time and compression then you just need fuel in the cylinders .

Are you sure that the injectors are being pulsed by the ECU when you turn the engine over ? you should be able to hear them clicking when the engine is turned over

You can buy a noid light on ebay quite cheaply. They just plug into your injector connectors and will confirm the injectors are getting pulsed.

A cheap easy way to prove the injectors are working is to use a PP3 9v battery and flash each injector a few times . You should hear and feel the injector solenoids slamming up and down inside the injectors. This is a quick and dirty way to unstick sticky injectors if they are gunged up with laquer. Don't hold the battery on the injectors , you are just aiming to simulate pulsing by flashing the injector electrical terminals.

Lastly remove the intake hose and try some easy start . If it doesn't cough splutter and fire there is no spark in the cylinders. Don't forget the engine must turn over at least at 200rpm on the starter or the ECU will not ground the DME or pulse the injectors

 

[ChasR]

It sounds like an earthing issue from the above. I guess a quick way to check would be to temporarily fit a jump lead from the engine block (lifting point will be fine) to a negative part of the bodywork.

If your FPR has gone on the blink (unlikely) you could try unplugging one of the injector leads which will override the shutdown of the injector drivers.

Easy Start is a good suggestion, although do not run it with Easy Start for too long!

 

[George Elliott]

Frenchy, you still got this issue? if so snap. My car was running on Saturday, switched off, went out this morning - its gone on strike, zero intention of running.

Took the GTD to work

Symptoms:
Tacho bounce (but variable)
No fuel smell
Turning over normally

Came home,
swapped DME relay - same symptoms
swapped OE Alarm Module - same symptoms
removed Plug lead and fitted slave Plug - no spark

Next check is the resistance on the Hall sensors / flywheel

Sorry you are 220less and the bit of hassle with that, but I am sure Soli knows how lucky he is to have such a fine example.

George
944t

 

[Frenchy]

Cheers All, to be honest the 88 Turbo has been put on the back burner for the last few weeks, i have been fitting new belts and sorting out a few other minor mechanical niggles with a view to prepping the car for sale (220) i had the badge panel repainted due to a couple of marks, sill steps repainted because of a couple of shoe scuffs and got them to make the leading edge of the front wings made good due to stone chipping, they endid up paintng the whole sill sections, the car was totally mint apart from a couple of PU and bonnet stone chips. this car had never been damaged and never welded all the original panels were rust free and immaculate.
Soli was told off for leaving the drivers side door open against next doors pebble dashed gable end []
Hope he gets that habit sorted out !
I have also been getting a new toy, one of those watercooled noisy beetles, so have been busy cleaning interiors, claying and waxing and generally faffing. Tons of torque and loads of creature comforts, feels very direct and solid, new tyres are going to hurt £££
Wheels off for a refurb then some -30 H & R's to go on (stance is not a crime !) along with some subtle wheel spacing []
Over the next few weeks i need to get the 88 Turbo sorted, i have not driven it for 6 months [] i was initially going to sell it to justify the 997................will be with me until summer is out at least and will probably stay if the man maths works out.
997 is fantastic with leather everywhere and gadget city, but the 88 turbo has a solid classic feel about it and still goes like stink if i remember..........Plus Old Porsches Rock []

 

[George Elliott]

Changed the Sensors.

Sorted []

Running better than ever (one sensor was shabby looking)

George
944t

 

[Frenchy]

So you got them out George i managed to remove mine but some of the other guys have had to break them to get them out,mine looked fine when taken out and the resistance was in range, i checked them back to the ECU pins.
Not really been near it for a couple of weeks, may have a good going over it on Monday, i need it sorted now.
I will be certainly starting with earthing.
Cheers Jim.

 

[George Elliott]

I did Frenchy,
Mind you, there was no danger of them falling out. [8|]
In addition I took the replacement set out of another car - 1989, original and they are pristine. All because I could not be bothered to wait for new and then find they were not the problem. (And I knew they were good)

Mine checked out :
600 - 1600 ohms and >1M ohm
600 - 1600 ohms and 955k ohms (Slightly Out of Spec)

Also changed ECU, Coil, King Lead, Checked Various Connections. (all changes reversed before next change)

The Sensor Bracket is not a robust item, but I was patient with it all.

Reset the 0.8mm Gap on the Bracket with a slave sensor

Your car is different to mine as you have a spark......strange

Good luck with yours.

George
944t

 

[Frenchy]

George where did you take your measurements for the crank sensors ?

 

[ChasR]

I assume this is fixed now? If so, what was the culprit in the end?

 

[Frenchy]

Chas, running like clocwork, starts on the button and drives faultlessly, "wood for the trees" i had gotten myself looking into the problem way to deep, changing coils and ECU's etc.
Very basic in the end, some slight corrosion on the HT pin of the distributor cap the cylinder pins on the dizzy were nice and shiny ?
2 mins with a fibreglass contact cleaner and as good as new.
Fitted a new rotor arm and dizzy cap along with plugs, some fresh oil and a filter.....................jobs a good un []

 

[944 man]

Wow. I was just coming to suggest using plug lamps to ensure that you are actually getting a proper spark.

 

[Frenchy]

Thing that threw me and had me digging deeper was it did fire up on the odd occasion and was absolutely fine for a couple of minutes then hesitate and stop, absolutely fine when it did run.
I had exhausted all avenues and started from scrtach noticing that the spark was quite weak instead of being a nice blue / white it was orange which had me thinking i had an earth fault.

 

[Diver944]

Drive it regularly Jim, it'll stop these niggling little problems rearing their head.

Go on, you know you want to [8D][]

 

[George Elliott]

George where did you take your measurements for the crank sensors ?

Jim, just picking this up now, sorry I missed it.

The measurement went like this:
Google it and found a diagram which assured me there are sufficient teeth on the ring that it would be impossible to miss and do a set between two teeth.
Then cut the wires off an old sensor
Superglue a 0.8mm washer on the end. (Approx 9mm Dia)
Clean the sensor bracket so the sensors are a light slide fit in the two bores.
Fit the sensor to the rear hole and nip the retaining bolt
Fit the sensor bracket, noting the NSF bolt is the pivot and located on a dowel ring around the M8 thread, and the other bolt operates in the slot on the bracket allowing adjustment
Lift the bracket and sensor to max clearance
finger tighten the pivot bolt
finger tighten the locking bolt
ease the bracket / sensor down until it touches the tooth
nip the locking bolt maintaining the touch on the ring / tooth
Nip the pivot bolt
Release the bolt holding the sensor in the bracket
check it will slide back into the bracket and seat properly. (If it will not seat the bracket has moved)
Because of the RH thd any movement is likely to be clockwise and therefore will reduce the 0.8mm clearance gap

Thats the bracket set - jobs a good 'un []

Then fit both new sensors carefully and nip the two sensor retaining bolts

Hope that helps and glad you do not need it now.

Final point, there is not much room, and my bracket bolts were torqued like the crank pulley [8|]

George
944t