the last post ? - disgusted

[jacko]

i would like to say that i am totally DISGUSTED with the club and esp the treatment to its members . Fabien was VERY passionate with the club and region he was very supportive,friendly,kind and wanted to assist in many ways -the reason he is not here is partly due to the fact that the board were scared of the proprosed event /concours fabien wanted to lay on for the region being bigger and better than the main event - above all FREE of charge ! why should payed up members have to pay to attend events ? there has been no communication in the porsche post magazine stating all the trouble thats been going on since november ! many members STILL are not sure or know what just has gone on - as for a new r.o. shouldnt there have been a vote or members approached to choose an ro there may have been other people who would have liked a crack of doing the job ! however seems once again that secret plans were in place . there is a post to get behind the new ro and be supportive -well i would have thought the first port of call would have been for the ro to call/gather members around and introduce himself and then explain all this political rubbish that has gone on for a whole 6 months !! im told the new ro has never even been to the venue of the region meet before and now has the task to organise some sort of concours in a matter of weeks - we have all suffered as members and the time limit has been way too long for all the board to organise the region and also to move on from the dissagreement with fab.i hope with a new ro in place remaining members will get what they want and expect from there membership fees - as for me all i ever wanted was a fun porsche ownership experience with like minded people ! - looks like i went to the wrong place - []

 

[Robertb]

Speaking from bitter experience, anyone who steps up to the plate to be an RO is doing everyone a favour as it can be a thankless task. I suspect that if people were asked to put themselves forward, there would not be a flood of nominees.

I for one am pleased that we have a resolution, and the area can move forward.

I agree though, I only met him a couple of times, but Fabien is a great bloke and his leadership will be much missed by the region.

 

[924nutter]

jacko, I am not ignoring you. I scrpited a lovely articluate reply to your post discussing each of your points but I spent so long in the message window my session timed out and I lost the whole of the transcript.

Look in tomorrow and I should have something more to your taste, but I will have to write it up in Word then paste it in or I will be bound to time out again. In the meanwhile there is one obvious error. I have attened the venue before, I attended Sunday. Your informant is perveying you duff gen.

 

[paul kelley]

Hi All

Lets all give John a chance to get his feet under the table. Having run the London Region for about 11years and been on the Board for 5 years I know how hard it can be at times. It is NOT a thankless task, there are a lot of Members out there who are more than willing to give support to an RO in a variety of ways. (there is nothing like seeing 50 plus cars turning up to an event that you have set up)

Just remember that the RO can only be as successful as the Membership support will allow, so get out there ,polish the car and support your RO.

Give John a call with your ideas and perhaps offer to help as well.

Have fun

Paul Kelley

 

[924nutter]

Thanks for that Paul. In my heart I never believed that being R/O was a thankless task. Call me perverse but I derive a great deal of satisfaction from my time spent on the forum, and I do so love a challenge. I am sure I can get something together for the regional event. I am going to give it my best shot.

 

[geoff Ives]

ORIGINAL: jacko

i would like to say that i am totally DISGUSTED with the club and esp the treatment to its members . Fabien was VERY passionate with the club and region he was very supportive,friendly,kind and wanted to assist in many ways -the reason he is not here is partly due to the fact that the board were scared of the proprosed event /concours fabien wanted to lay on for the region being bigger and better than the main event - above all FREE of charge ! why should payed up members have to pay to attend events ? there has been no communication in the porsche post magazine stating all the trouble thats been going on since november ! many members STILL are not sure or know what just has gone on - as for a new r.o. shouldnt there have been a vote or members approached to choose an ro there may have been other people who would have liked a crack of doing the job ! however seems once again that secret plans were in place . there is a post to get behind the new ro and be supportive -well i would have thought the first port of call would have been for the ro to call/gather members around and introduce himself and then explain all this political rubbish that has gone on for a whole 6 months !! im told the new ro has never even been to the venue of the region meet before and now has the task to organise some sort of concours in a matter of weeks - we have all suffered as members and the time limit has been way too long for all the board to organise the region and also to move on from the dissagreement with fab.i hope with a new ro in place remaining members will get what they want and expect from there membership fees - as for me all i ever wanted was a fun porsche ownership experience with like minded people ! - looks like i went to the wrong place - []

Cristopher.
As a person who joined the forum only a month ago, long after Fabiens depature, you seem to have a lot to say and none of it helpful.
I found fabien helpful and conder him to be a friend but however you view it he did let his membership down. He is no longer a member of PCGB as he let his membership lapse months ago therefore he is not an option as R/O.

A few points.
(1) you state the the new R/O has never been to the venue. That is not true. You may not have noticed him as he is a quiet man who works hard for the Club and does not push himself forward.

(2) You suggest a vote for the post of R/O. That isn't the way we do it. The post of R/O is an apointment of the Regional Director in consultation with the Board. The system is that the membership elects the Regional Director and with this mandate he appoints the R/O's.

(2) The time element. Fabien ceased contact with the Club late last year. He didn't even go to his own Christmas event.
There was no correspondence from Fab to the Board. Fab ignored phone messages, emails and letters. The Board at that time decided not to take drastic action as a new Board woud be appointed in March and Fab might well be able to deal with the new R/D.
March... Chris Clark, the new R/D tries to contact Fab with no sucess. His mebership has now lapsed and having been given 3 months grace he hasn't renued. Chris Clark appoints a new R/O.

(3) You state that Board were scared of Fab's event, Rubbish. They simply requested him to present a buiness plan which he did, very well but reluctantly. This is not unusual. I do so every year with the Cotswold Rally and the Manx Tours. It is called business and protects the members interests. Fab thought that he was being picked on, that is not so he was being dealt with even handedly.

I suggest that you put the same effort into supporting you R/O (if in fact you are a R19 member) that you do in being devisive.

Geoff Ives

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

Just a quick point that needs addressing - Fab is still shown as the Moderator of this forum - Shouldn't an administrator give the privilege rights to John?

I have kept well out of these discussions as I haven't attended any regional meetings at Ascot, only some of the regional events. Also, I surmised what Geoff has outlined above - you can't deal with someone who won't (or can't) talk to you. Fab is a lovely bloke, but hopefully we can put all this behind us and move on.

John - to make it some of the meetings is on my 'to do' list, but if I can be of any help give me a shout.

 

[924nutter]

Thanks to you guys for coming out in support. Jacko is entitled to his opinion, and as his R/O (alegedly) I am duty bound to represent his queries to the board, even one such as they who seem hell bent on dragging the region down. I am using the andrgogenous "they" because I have no real name and realised I have made the assumption that Jacko is male. Having said all that, I now notice that Mr Ives has called jacko Christopher.
Geoff you have saved me from typing, then posting a well crafted three page word document, which I only have in note form.
The R/Os manual, which arrived yesterday does say that the outgoing R/O should ideally suggest a successor. Well I would like to think that Fabien would give me his blessing, but at least I was recommended by an active R/O and no-one is going to grumble about a declaration of force-majeure, (o.k. maybe one.) and a further bullet point does suggest that views of regional members can be sought to help the selection process, so we more or less comply there by default.

• The job should be advertised; well perhaps not in so many words, but hands up those of us who didn't realise the R19 R/O role would soon become vacant? Oops, there's that hand again.
• I can find no reference to the aleged need to vote the R/O in.

jacko is correct, yes you read it right, with his good idea about how to communicate this to the region. He is not alone with his suggestion, and I concede that my plan to meet each member as they arrived and explain individually was far too optimistic. This will be addressed at the next meeting. Jacko why did you not take the opportunity to meet the fat guy in the hat. You quote procedure, incorrectly, at us, yet as an unfamiliar member, to the new R/O, who by the way has no way of recognising regional members, I thought you of all people would have button-holed me and demanded political satisfaction. When I asked a small group if anybody had seen jacko, as I was so sure you would turn up, they went so far as to say that you were not at the meeting though you have clearly been because you have sung the praises of the hotel. Please take the opportunity to contact me using the details I have left on the forum.

That I think deals with most of jacko's issues. I have experience of organising twenty year club meetings as ex president of my twenty-year club, I am articulate and capable of dealing and negotiating on behalf of the regioin.

jacko, I believe that your behaviour on this forum is at times unacceptable. This is not a personal attack, you are probaly a nice enough person, and I admire your passion for things that you believe in. I am questioning your general demeanour with regard the club and particularly this region. As duly elected R/O I am charged with behaving courteously towards members, which puts you at a politcal advantage as you can rant on, and I have to accept your crictisms and comments about the shortcomings of the club, the region or someone you have never been formally introduced to and know little about in terms of my club involvement, with a smile and good humour. It is my humble opinion that you do yourself more of a disservice in conducting yourself in this manner, but of course the members opinion on the forum will be the acid test.

 

[Mark_Bennett]

ORIGINAL: Richard Hamilton

Just a quick point that needs addressing - Fab is still shown as the Moderator of this forum - Shouldn't an administrator give the privilege rights to John?

Hopefully done now... My first one so fingers crossed! [8|]

 

[924nutter]

ORIGINAL: Mark Bennett

ORIGINAL: Richard Hamilton

Just a quick point that needs addressing - Fab is still shown as the Moderator of this forum - Shouldn't an administrator give the privilege rights to John?

Hopefully done now... My first one so fingers crossed! [8|]

Yo buddy! Everything comes to those who wait. Ooh! Ooh! Can I be on top of Helen in being one of a select few to moderate two fora?[] Don't tell me, Helen has been there, done that too[&:]

 

[James_M]

I've not been a member of PCGB or the forum for all that long and I've not met Fabien so I can't comment on past goings on in R19.

All I would say is that having met John and other R19 members half a dozen times now, I am very much enjoying my PCGB and R19 membership. If I get to 50% of the regional meets over a year I'll be doing well so I'm reluctant to suggest ideas for the future fomat of the monthly and quarterly meets. Wrt the annual event though, as someone who drives his Porsche everyday (and uses it to transport tools and things for work!) I'm less interested in a concours type event than in something that actually involves a drive.

I say more power to your elbow John and perhaps "disgust" should be reserved for issues deserving of it rather than directed towards a bunch of people who like to get together and talk about cars.

James

 

[Guest]

As a member of R19 for about 1.5 yrs now, I wanted to say that I can see the frustration on all sides. I don't think I have had value for money in the last 18 months, but with new leadership, I sincerely hope that there is a new energy.

Jacko is right to vent his frustrations, just as others have the right to lend support. As an ex-RO from TIPEC (for 3yrs), I joined PCGB to get away from politics; poor management, lack of activities and lack of membership support...maybe clubs have this embedded in them, as there are so many passionate people!!? As a Thames Valley RO for TIPEC, I know that to succeed one has to show leadership and take the bull by the horns. I hope John can succeed at this role and unite the members. I personally have met alot of nice people at the meets, and for my wife to ask to come (she never went to the TIPEC meets!), it must be good! She now puts it onto our kitchen calender!
I personally am not interested in concours events, but each to their own. I prefer to go for drives to new parts of the country and even Europe. I have taken the 911 and my Boxster all over Europe!

I look forward to the next meet, and as a polite suggestion, I think John should do a formal intro to himself, and where he wants to take the region. I would be most interested in hearing about him as a person, and what plans he has.

(2) The time element. Fabien ceased contact with the Club late last year. He didn't even go to his own Christmas event.
There was no correspondence from Fab to the Board. Fab ignored phone messages, emails and letters. The Board at that time decided not to take drastic action as a new Board woud be appointed in March and Fab might well be able to deal with the new R/D.
March... Chris Clark, the new R/D tries to contact Fab with no sucess. His mebership has now lapsed and having been given 3 months grace he hasn't renued. Chris Clark appoints a new R/O.

 

[geoff Ives]

ORIGINAL: A Porsche For Life

As a member of R19 for about 1.5 yrs now, I wanted to say that I can see the frustration on all sides. I don't think I have had value for money in the last 18 months, but with new leadership, I sincerely hope that there is a new energy.

Jacko is right to vent his frustrations, just as others have the right to lend support. As an ex-RO from TIPEC (for 3yrs), I joined PCGB to get away from politics; poor management, lack of activities and lack of membership support...maybe clubs have this embedded in them, as there are so many passionate people!!? As a Thames Valley RO for TIPEC, I know that to succeed one has to show leadership and take the bull by the horns. I hope John can succeed at this role and unite the members. I personally have met alot of nice people at the meets, and for my wife to ask to come (she never went to the TIPEC meets!), it must be good! She now puts it onto our kitchen calender!
I personally am not interested in concours events, but each to their own. I prefer to go for drives to new parts of the country and even Europe. I have taken the 911 and my Boxster all over Europe!

I look forward to the next meet, and as a polite suggestion, I think John should do a formal intro to himself, and where he wants to take the region. I would be most interested in hearing about him as a person, and what plans he has.

(2) The time element. Fabien ceased contact with the Club late last year. He didn't even go to his own Christmas event.
There was no correspondence from Fab to the Board. Fab ignored phone messages, emails and letters. The Board at that time decided not to take drastic action as a new Board woud be appointed in March and Fab might well be able to deal with the new R/D.
March... Chris Clark, the new R/D tries to contact Fab with no sucess. His mebership has now lapsed and having been given 3 months grace he hasn't renued. Chris Clark appoints a new R/O.

John
With your experience as a TPEC Regional Organiser may I suggest that you contact JB and offer him you help and support. I am sure that it will be appreciated.

Geoff Ives. Cotswold Region R/O ( and a Tipec member [])

 

[924nutter]

You are not alone in your suggestion that I should do some formal introductions, and your suggestion is well met. I am particularly appreciative of the idea that I should include some personal background. As you can see from this extact from a previous post, "He is not alone with his suggestion, and I concede that my plan to meet each member as they arrived and explain individually was far too optimistic. This will be addressed at the next meeting." I am acutely aware of how much of a failure to communicate this was. As the laughing gnome can assert, earlier today I contacted both his lordship and our R/D to ask it it was acceptable to allocate some region funds to make it; a) more sociable and b)entice some fence sitters into actually attending. The region will be led in the direction that the consensus of opinion wants me to lead it within reason. I think we have had plenty of opportunity to sit and talk as a region; you are the second of two responses to requests for suggestions to indicate that your preference is toward actually driving our cars, and that is something I have taken on board but that is too few to indicate a pressing need. By the time of the May meeting, I had been in "office" for four days. Information is trickling in through the letterbox. I have just recieved the full list of club officials, and have greeting letters to new members to get in the post,
but apart form the R/Os manual, that's all I have to work with at the moment.
Look in again soon for more from the horizontally challenged, non-female, wearing a suitably emblazoned, cranial embellishment device, and definitely not the fat guy in the hat!

 

[craig2105]

Hi John. Yes - more driving events please!!! Beautiful to look at; great to talk about; sublime to drive. What a Porsche is all about in my opinion...

Cheers, Craig

 

[924nutter]

[

ORIGINAL: A Porsche For Life

As a member of R19 for about 1.5 yrs now, I wanted to say that I can see the frustration on all sides. I don't think I have had value for money in the last 18 months, but with new leadership, I sincerely hope that there is a new energy......


I look forward to the next meet, and as a polite suggestion, I think John should do a formal intro to himself, and where he wants to take the region. I would be most interested in hearing about him as a person, and what plans he has.

Well, very soon I hope to be able to demonstrate how much new energy there is. Be patient, I am making progress.
In the mean time I recommend that region 19 members make sure of attending the June meeting where it is hoped that the regional director will be on hand to formally introduce me, and where I will be be happy to give an outline profile of myself as a person. I see being a facilitator of members wishes as the most important regional role, closely followed by being their first and in some cases the only point of contact with the club. As we are such a large region, it is my intention at some point to try to form a four person comittee, consisting of myself, Leslie Kett and two others. Also I want to get an opinion about joint track-days from the driving enthusiast among us. Back in the days of Duncan Smith, we had a joint track day with another region. Now then, there's some food for thought, which should make for an interesting meeting in June.

 

[Guest]

Hi,
Speaking with my wife (as I often do!!) she says that she likes to attend, because other women attend, and she has someone to talk to. I think there is a balance about having a nice lazy Sunday, and having some drives. I think there is room for both, and the drives could be a quarterly treat! Also know from my TIPEC days, that members need at least 3 months to plan for anything! but you will certainly get a small core of people who turn up for everything and anything...the challenge is to get the fence sitters to participate. As RO, one has to be all things to all people, and bringing in the people on the margins...its these (large majority) that can make a club day something special. If I can be of assistance, I will, and pass on some things I did in the Thames Valley for TIPEC that were successful. One thing - the Beaulieu Motor museum has an annual autojumble - that was always a good place to go for a drive, lunch and have a look around!
Rgds, John.

ORIGINAL: 924nutter

You are not alone in your suggestion that I should do some formal introductions, and your suggestion is well met. I am particularly appreciative of the idea that I should include some personal background. As you can see from this extact from a previous post, "He is not alone with his suggestion, and I concede that my plan to meet each member as they arrived and explain individually was far too optimistic. This will be addressed at the next meeting." I am acutely aware of how much of a failure to communicate this was. As the laughing gnome can assert, earlier today I contacted both his lordship and our R/D to ask it it was acceptable to allocate some region funds to make it; a) more sociable and b)entice some fence sitters into actually attending. The region will be led in the direction that the consensus of opinion wants me to lead it within reason. I think we have had plenty of opportunity to sit and talk as a region; you are the second of two responses to requests for suggestions to indicate that your preference is toward actually driving our cars, and that is something I have taken on board but that is too few to indicate a pressing need. By the time of the May meeting, I had been in "office" for four days. Information is trickling in through the letterbox. I have just recieved the full list of club officials, and have greeting letters to new members to get in the post,
but apart form the R/Os manual, that's all I have to work with at the moment.
Look in again soon for more from the horizontally challenged, non-female, wearing a suitably emblazoned, cranial embellishment device, and definitely not the fat guy in the hat!

 

[924nutter]

Come to the meeting in June and pipe up.