Menu toggle

Thoughts on oil breathers and catch cans

T3rra

New member
I'm thinking about running one, just to monitor where my oil use is going, and keep the intake cleaner.

What's people's thoughts? Vent to atompshire you lose the pressure needed to maintain seals e.c.t.

I was wondering if a small water/ air separator would work? Don't hold much but quite easy to find space, most likely not need any form off brackets e.c.t as there so small/ light

 
you need to keep it plumbed into the intake, don't vent to atmosphere. The hard part is finding a decent location for it. Maybe where the charcoal canister is?
 
That's why I'm thinking a small water / air seprater would be good.


http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/sn95-cobras-24/628462-diy-oil-separator-catch-can-w-pics-write-up.html

Here's some DIY
 
This thread reminds me I bought Ed's old catch can and should get around to fitting it I suppose ;)
 
At what stage does this become important?

Is it dependant on the amount of stress on the engine/components? Driving style? (DD Vs regular spirited driving for long stretches Vs track day) Or is it useful to have once your car has specific modifications?
 
Really complicated subject where the deeper you go into it, the more complicated it gets.

The standard crankcase breather/fire trap arrangement is a bit inadequate, as is the plumbing for the breathers.

But, the higher the combustion chamber, the higher the volume of combustion gasses which can pass through the gaps in the piston rings and even past the rings seal against the bore.

The piston ring to bore seal, is not made by the spring tension of the piston ring, but mostly through the difference between the pressure above the ring, and the pressure bellow the ring, spreading the piston ring out, and therefore applying more pressure to seal it against the bore.

If you produce more blow by gasses per second, than the standard breather system can handle, you end up with the pressure bellow the piston rings increasing, and therefore providing less pressure differential between above and bellow the piston ring, therefore less force to seal the ring. Which then provides more blow by gasses, which in turn cause more crankcase pressure, which then cascades into an ever worsening situation, even over the course of a few split seconds.

The standard breather also is routed into the intake air stream, which has another hazard, which is not as simple as it sounds on first glance, which is that the blowby gasses contain oil vapour, hydrocarbons, carbon monoxide and carbon dioxide, which will be a volume of gas, which is not normal air, as assumed by the ECU, or measured by the MAF or airflow meter, which will mess with not only the mixture at a time when it needs to be spot on while under boost, but also will alter the dynamics of the air fuel mix in a number of ways.. some of which beneficial to knock reduction (detonation avoidance) as well as detrimental to knock reduction in ways which can not be measured or assumed.

As well as this, the oil vapour can condense in the inter-cooler, which is not good for its thermal efficiency, but also not good for combustion as those droplets of oil get as far as the intake manifold, reaching the cylinders in different quantities per cylinder due to mass differences.

The other problem, which can raise its head as an indicator that the car's crankcase breathing has become compromised, is that oil seals and gaskets can start leaking, as they will be experiencing pressures which they are not designed to handle.

So, what is the solution...?

The fire trap can be modified to improve its ability to seperate oil and gas.

The breather hoses can be routed to a catch can to collect the gasses, promote drop out of oil from the air stream, and then ventilated to either free air (not ideal but cheap and easy) or can be routed to another source of evacuation, which would ideally be at an air pressure lower than atmospheric... Once source is back to the intake pre turbo.. but not ideal for combustion as mentioned above, or to another source.. Some people use a vacuum pump for this, some people use something else.. In the past I have used an exhaust venturi, but it does take a lot of experience and development to know where to put it, and to make sure the exhaust is of suitable type.

You can litterally spend thousands on a breather system, or you can spend less than £100 on it... You spend your money and take your choices, but in the end, it depends on the budget and on your requirements.

Typically, somewhere past 340 BHP the original breather system no longer copes well, but to be honest, all 944's could do with an improved system and it also depends on the engine and its condition.

One additional variable is the state of tune... The more suitable the state of ignition timing and fuel quantity, the less blowby gasses you will experience.. If the tune is bad, the volume of blowby will be greater, this has a lot to do with flame propagation speed, which can bring on an entirely new set of variables and dynamics to the mix.

Really, whatever solution you need is going to be unique to your car, its state of tune (performance level) and how it has been tuned.
 
Thanks for the input Jon. If you vent to air do you lose some off the perssure required to seat seal e.c.t

Is a catch can without a breather better ?

I'm getting a catch can just not sure which, can the catch can just be pumped back in to the intake, reducing oil but prob not the other gasses as there gasses not a liquid.

Is blow by increased with pressure, running 1.3 over 1.2 bar see a larger oil
Consumption via blow by? And would the issue worsen the higher the boost pressure.
 
just to monitor where my oil use is going,

I learned after many years of wondering why my intake hard pipes, I/C, Throttle body were moist with engine oil, that the reason was the Plain Bearing KKK turbo.

I still have a LR Catch can on the shelf, as Jon says, it creates more questions the deeper you dig.

Simon SPS told me the car he sold me would not use oil. It has a standard Crankcase breather setup.

I found it difficult to believe, but now there is zero oil usage between 6000 mile intervals. All my 951's used to use 1L / 1000 miles.

I cannot say if its just the bearing seal or the Perfect Bore block but its great not to have to keep dipping the oil.
 
Due to size and easy off fitting viewing I'm think one off these

http://oilcatchtank.com/

Could prob make it for less. Shame they don't do a slightly larger size
I'm a little conserned the wire filter? Could that not end up in the intake turbo e.c.t
 

Posts made and opinions expressed are those of the individual forum members

Use of the Forum is subject to the Terms and Conditions

Disclaimer

The opinions expressed on this site are not necessarily those of the Club, who shall have no liability in respect of them or the accuracy of the content. The Club assumes no responsibility for any effects arising from errors or omissions.

Porsche Club Great Britain gives no warranties, guarantees or assurances and makes no representations or recommendations regarding any goods or services advertised on this site. It is the responsibility of visitors to satisfy themselves that goods and/or services supplied by any advertiser are bona fide and in no instance can the Porsche Club Great Britain be held responsible.

When responding to advertisements please ensure that you satisfy yourself of any applicable call charges on numbers not prefixed by usual "landline" STD Codes. Information can be obtained from the operator or the white pages. Before giving out ANY information regarding cars, or any other items for sale, please satisfy yourself that any potential purchaser is bona fide.

Directors of the Board of Porsche Club GB, Club Office Staff, Register Secretaries and Regional Organisers are often requested by Club members to provide information on matters connected with their cars and other matters referred to in the Club Rules. Such information, advice and assistance provided by such persons is given in good faith and is based on the personal experience and knowledge of the individual concerned.

Neither Porsche Club GB, nor any of the aforementioned, shall be under any liability in respect of any such information, advice or assistance given to members. Members are advised to consult qualified specialists for information, advice and assistance on matters connected with their cars at all times.

Back
Top