V8 (LS1) Conversions

[zcacogp]

Chaps,

I'll start by saying, loud and clear, that I am NOT planning on doing one of these ... but it interests me. What does anyone know about the V8 engine conversion for 944's? I believe it takes an LS1 engine, which is some bit of American iron, and offers much more power than even a turbo, but with very little weight penalty and better fuel efficiency. And, of course, a lovely V8 burble (which even the most ardent enthusiast would admit would sound better than the stock 4-pot in the 944).

Has anyone seen one of these transplants 'in the tin'? Has anyone driven one? Does anyone own one? Can anyone show me some pictures of one? ]

Thanks!


Oli.

 

[stevep2000]

Try this - http://www.renegadehybrids.com/944/LS-1/Pictures/Pic02.jpg

More info -
http://www.renegadehybrids.com/indexx.html#

 

[944turboS]

Fen over to you.

 

[charles.y]

Do they have a supercharge version of the V8?[]

 

[Diver944]

ORIGINAL: zcacogp

better fuel efficiency.

I agree with everything apart from fuel effeciency. The beauty of the Turbo is that when you are poottling or cruising along 'off boost' you are driving a 2.5 litred car. With the Ls1 conversion you are always going to have 5.7 litres under your right foot, with the accompanying thirst for fuel [] Obviously full boost is a different matter []

I've yet to see an LS1 conversion but there are several videos knocking around Utube, or Google that have awesome sounding 944s with V8 engines. There is a chap on Pistonheads who has done several 944 V8 conversions, but he doesn't post very often so you may have to search back a bit. Speak to Andy and Roger at Promax who were planning on doing one a while back. They have lots of LS1experience and even have a Turbocharged one in their Holden pickup that pushes out circa 600bhp! [8D]

 

[944turboS]

There is a chap on Pistonheads who has done several 944 V8 conversions, but he doesn't post very often so you may have to search back a bit.

I think he uses Rover V8s

 

[maverick996]

Anyone got any idea how much it would cost to do this conversion??

 

[Fen]

Theere is a lot of difference between fitting the LS1 or LS6 and the LT1. An LT1 would be quite easy whereas I don't believe there is a running LS1 RHD car yet. Mine was going to be the first, but then I bought the 964 with the budget I had got together for it so it will be a few months more before I have mine done.

Benefits are as said but without fuel economy (let's face it, you don't run a 5.7 or 6.0 litre car for the mpg benefit) plus the engine is totally unstressed while making as much power as a pretty well wrung-out 2.5 turbo lump and even a big capacity version of the turbo would struggle to beat a mildly tuned V8. Not for the purists, but then I like it all the more for that reason.

 

[mik_ok]

ORIGINAL: Fen

Not for the purists, but then I like it all the more for that reason.

That's one of the things I like about the concept too. []

MPG would be interesting ~ I'm not convinced that a low compression ratio turbo is much more efficient at part throttle openings than a bigger high-compression N/A engine. But then that is based on 0.0% empirical evidence, and probably doesn't account for a 140% increase in capacity [&:]

 

[wizard]

Are these new V8's engine managment systems able to switch off several of the cylinders to improve fuel efficiency?

 

[wjk_glynn]

ORIGINAL: wizard

Are these new V8's engine managment systems able to switch off several of the cylinders to improve fuel efficiency?

I think the only current V-8 engine with that engine management feature (marketed as "multi-displacement") is the 5.7-liter "Hemi" from Daimler-Chrysler. Their 6-liter SRT engine does not.

Karl.

 

[wjk_glynn]

ORIGINAL: maverick996

Anyone got any idea how much it would cost to do this conversion??

Renegade's kit pricing is available here: http://www.renegadehybrids.com/944/LS-1/LS-1.html

You'll still need a donor engine. Used LS-1 engines with about 30K miles on them run about $3K (including ECU, engine harness, etc) in the US. You can buy a new LS-1 crate engine (without ECU, etc.) for about $5K.

Then there's the labour costs to install all that stuff...

Karl.

PS - Here's another thread on this subject: http://www.968uk.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2761

 

[zcacogp]

What's the difference between the LS1 and the LT1 engines? And why would the fitting of one be much easier than the other?

And has anyone actually seen one of these/been in one of these/driven one of these or owned one of these?

I wouldn't consider doing the swap on my S2, as it would seem to be an expensive and almost sinful thing to do to a reasonable car in reasonable nick. However, it could be a good way to breathe new (high-speed) life into something with a blown-up engine - perhaps a lux with good bodywork and a well cared for interior, or maybe an S or S2 suffering from a broken cambelt and bent valves.


Oli.

 

[944turboS]

However, it could be a good way to breathe new (high-speed) life into something with a blown-up engine - perhaps a lux with good bodywork and a well cared for interior, or maybe an S or S2 suffering from a broken cambelt and bent valves.

Or

'90 944 Turbo, Glacier blue, "infinite capacity" mod

 

[wjk_glynn]

ORIGINAL: zcacogp

What's the difference between the LS1 and the LT1 engines?

Weight.

The LT1 is an old iron-block design and is heavy. The LS1 is aluminium-alloy and is is supposedly only a little bit heavier than the 968 3.0-liter mill.
Other differences between them include the heads and main-bolt design.

Here's a forum site dedicated to the LS-1: http://www.ls1tech.com

ORIGINAL: zcacogp

And why would the fitting of one be much easier than the other?

Dunno. I'd be very curious to know because I know both LT-1 and LS-1 engines have been successfully installed in both 944 and 968 cars. It must be something specific to RHD cars.

ORIGINAL: zcacogp

And has anyone actually seen one of these/been in one of these/driven one of these or owned one of these?

Never seen a 944/968, but have seen 3 or 4 914s with V-8s installed. Very popular track day machines and seriously quick.

Karl.

 

[zcacogp]

Helpful replies all - thanks.

Something to ponder on in a spare five minutes ... I'd still like to see oen of these engines fitted to a car, to see what's involved. But I guess it's all theoretical at this stage.

I did wonder that the 'infinite capacity' mod was referring to! I guess I now know ...


Oli.

 

[wjk_glynn]

Just as an FYI... the following are forum boards dedicated to installing V-8 engines in Porsches:

http://www.pors-chev.com/

http://www.560sec.com/bulletinboard/

Karl.

 

[Fen]

"Infinite capacity mod" refers to the hole in both sides of #4 cylinder. Ultimately it will probably be a 6.0 litre, though I might end up going 5.7 depending on advice of the engine builder. It will be a custom engine built from brand new parts to my spec

The LS-1 has a different sump and different engine mounts and it is because of those changes that it doesn't fit RHD using the Renegade kit. The LT-1 is symmetrical and the LS-1 is not. Other changes around iron vs. alloy etc. are as stated above, but not the reason it won't drop in so easily.

Renegade also drop the V8 into the back of 911's.