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Water leak cured - finally

jcslater

New member
Just thought I would post to say I finally have a dry car, despite pouring rain etc. I went through various parts of the car like many people have e.g new door skins, changing window seals, testing the front air intake, drainage channels etc. The cause of the leak - the drivers rubber door seal had gone porous and was wicking water into the car. This seal was changed and finally - no water leak! The car floor has now totally dried in the past 3-4 weeks including all the sponge under the carpet. Makes such a difference in the rain as there is now almost no steaming up, which is great. Anyway just wanted to share this in case others are still puzzling about water leaks.
Thanks.
 
My latest leak was through the rear window - I have now dried out the car and siliconed all round the supposedly bonded window seal. So far no more leaks (touch wood).

But (and its a big but) - I had to lift the rear seats slightly to dry under them - the foam holds several pints of water which could eventually corrode the seat pan. Fortunately I got to mine in time - the paintwork was all still intact.

I wonder how may other 993/964 owners have this problem without even knowing it ?
 
Hi Jonathan,

Glad to hear you have sorted out your leak. I noticed you mention there is almost no steaming up. I have a 1994 993C2 and in the wet weather it steams up terribly. I dont know if this is normal with 993's. Directing the air to the windscreen doesnt seem to help either. Could some of the seals have gone?
Any advice would be welcome.

Maurice, any suggestions?

thanks

Seb
 
Seb - welcome to the soggy world of 993 ownership. First check the sponge soundproofing under the carpets front and rear - if that is wet, that will help you track down the leaks.

Door seals are probably the most common source of water ingress, followed by windows, blocked sunroof drainholes etc...
 
Mark, thanks for that, appreciate it. Looks like I need to do some serious investigation. Aside from that, attempting to defrost the windscreen doesnt seem to work at all. Do you have the same issues?

Thanks,

Seb
 
Hi Seb, like Mark says it is almost certain that you have a source of water retention inside your cabin somewhere making the steam-up worse. The foam under the carpet in the rear holds massive amounts of water, it took me days of using a dehumidifier in the car to finaly dry her out. I would check this out and then look at the common causes as Mark described; door rubbers, door plastic skins, drains etc. Good luck.
 
ORIGINAL: sebrussellsmith

Mark, thanks for that, appreciate it. Looks like I need to do some serious investigation. Aside from that, attempting to defrost the windscreen doesnt seem to work at all. Do you have the same issues?

Thanks,

Seb

Sounds like you may have a seperate heating related issue. The "windscreen demist button" should operate engine heating fan, front cooling fans plus airconditioning at full power. Mine worked OK last time I tried it - it's usually not necessary as the car is now dry. On my 964 pressing the demist button used to blow the fuse so I didn't bother. Maybe you have the same issue. Does your heating work OK normally ? Does your aircon work ? Do your front blowers work ? The answers to those questions may determine where we go from here.
 
I have a water leak on my 993, first seen with windscreen misting up then water in the rear foam.

Any chance of a definitive list to check?

From the posts above I have got:

door rubbers
door plastic skins
sunroof drains
rear windscreen rubber
etc, etc - what should I look at under the headings etc, etc

a list of other areas to check would be really appreciated

Many thanks

John
 
I think you've got it covered. Don't forget the rear window is supposedly bonded, but if it's been replaced at any time, it can be less than waterproof as I discovered. You can lift the rubber trim to pour in water to test. Remove the rear parcel shelf first to check for any water ingress (a fun job in itself, as the seatbelts will need disconnecting.) The final "cure" is to dry everything thoroughly and liberally apply silicone sealant round the window under the trim.

A good way to check the sunroof drain holes is to pour in water and see where it goes !

The above are jobs I prefer to do in summer, as its bloomin' miserable in the winter, and hard to dry anything out.

If the car has been in an accident wihich required removal and refitting of front wings, there is a slight chance water will be coming in the front like it did in my 964. Everytime I parked it outside I got a dose of cold water dumped on my feet. (lovely). I would worry about that after you have eliminated everything else though.

Door rubbers are easy to fit - order new ones from your OPC at £105 each (ouch). I couldn't find them anywhere else. Pull out the old seals and slot in the new ones. It's up to you whether you glue them - I didn't bother and haven't had any problems yet. The pressure of the doors keeps them good and tight (until they wear out).

Door plastic skins are easy to fit although, not cheap for what they are. It's a bit of a fiddle taking the door card off, but most people seem to manage OK. I've had to take door cards off so many 911s it's becoming a bit of a routine. [:'(] The hardest bit is getting the polythene sheet accurately into position before you stick it down. It's very sticky, so be patient. Also, try not to lose any of the screws, although if someones been in before you, chances are some will be missing already. Replacements are easy to get from Porsche, and thankfully, only a few pence each.

Assembly, as they say, is the reverse of removal, and, Hey presto dry car.
 
ORIGINAL: jmspear

I have a water leak on my 993, first seen with windscreen misting up then water in the rear foam.

Any chance of a definitive list to check?

From the posts above I have got:

door rubbers
door plastic skins
sunroof drains
rear windscreen rubber
etc, etc - what should I look at under the headings etc, etc

a list of other areas to check would be really appreciated

Many thanks

John
When you say "rear foam" I assume you mean the carpet underlay?

If yes then there was a post on here more than a year ago about covers on the front of the sills (back of front wheel arch) - can get dislodged or damaged - lets water into sill and this can let water into the space inside the cross member under the seats. This has gaps at the back which then let water into the rear floor area.

I had this happen to me when I drove through a deep flood (I won't be doing that again in a hurry - took me ages to get it dry). Fairly sure that was cause because only saw it immediately after that journey and only location of water was exactly as the other post had described.
 
ORIGINAL: marke2

I had this happen to me when I drove through a deep flood

These cars are not good in deep water (over 6 inches). There are all sorts of areas underneath they can leak. (e.g. front footwells.) I have a snorkel equiped diesel Landrover Defender with raised breathers for deep wading - anything up to five feet is fine, if you don't mind a wet bottom.

The moral is - if it looks too deep for a 993, it probably is. The engine will keep running, though, as the air intake is nice and high. That is, if the HT circuit dosn't give up first. Hmm I feel someone could do an interesting experiment.
 
Thanks Guys,

Yes I did mean the carpet underlay and I probably have a number of problems:

1) Condensation as described above over the last few years
2) Damp carpets as symptons described above over the last few years
3) With the last floods in Cheltenham yes I ended up with water OVER the sills and up to bottom of doors and had to reverse out of a flood very quickly with high revs to keep water from coming back up the exhausts - very scary, this definitely led to serious internal carpet wetting, but this is now dried out and the issue I want to address is the reoccurring 1) and 2)

Great list many thanks

Think I will have to wait for a dryish day to find the leak and then let the car dry out in my barn with carpets out, this was how I dried it out after driving through flooding, you couldn't get dehumidifiers at the time beacuse of all the flooded houses.

Cheers

John
 
Mark, many thanks for all your help, sorry I have been offline for a while.

Guess I was slightly exaggerating. The demist button makes all the right noises (very noisy) and all the fans do work including heating but man is it slow to demist! But it does work after a VERY long time! Probably used to the modern technology of the Audi family car which demists the moment you press the button. As I keep on saying for the 993 nothing's perfect! Although maybe it should be! The worst thing of it all is recently I have been considering selling it as I have numerous corrosion issues on the sills, front wheel arch etc. - it all adds up. Not to mention all the other work that needs doing - front wishbones rear bumper supports etc. - the usual.

What to do???
 
Sorry to hear about your demisting woes, Seb.

993 demisting works OK on light condensation, if the aircon is working (that will dehumidify the air), and if all the fans are working OK, and water isn't sitting in the system somewhere. It will struggle with heavy condensation, but then so will most cars.

The fact that you have heavy condensation, suggests water is leaking into the car somewhere. I strongly suspect your sponge carpet underlay is soaked, which is where the condensation is coming from. Have you checked under your carpets ? Do you have a cab, coupe or targa ?

These cars have now reached an age where is would be preferable to garage them, if at all possible.

993 jobs mount up if you don't keep on top of them. Rust spots, suspension issues, we've all had them. - You just have to decide - "am I committed to keeping this car", in which case it's going to cost me ££££s to put it right, or "would I be better off selling it" ? Only you can decide. If you decide the first route you need a fairly deep wallet and an understanding other half.

Vintage 993 ownership is not a cheap proposition, but at least you can spread the cost with a certain amount of programming in jobs.

 
Mark, I hear you - to answer your question, it is a coupe.

Garaging is out of the question as I dont have one.

Well I guess I have January to decide (house extensions and all that). I suppose the key question is if I could keep a Porsche, would I be better of selling the 993 and getting something more modern which will not have half the issues an older car has and therefore presumably be cheaper to run???

On your point of spreading the jobs needed, is it likely that once I remedy one rust area then another one may sprout its ugly head! Anyway I thought 911's didnt rust!

 

911s rust - they are made of steel, galvanising helps protect them, but sooner or later they rust. When people say 911s don't rust, what they mean is "911s can take longer to rust than some cheaper cars because they are galvanised". Porsche introduced galvanising before it became the industry norm, in the 1970s. 911s therefore gained a good reputation for being rust proof in the 80s and 90s. However, after 15 to 20 years even a well looked after galvanised 911 will start to rust. Galvanising is good, but it does not prevent rust completely. Rust eventually starts where the paint is chipped, the body flexes and the salt gets in.

993s/964s have one or two favourite rust spots - front and rear windows, front wheel arches etc. Older 911s are famous for rusting in kidney bowls, sills, wings, almost anywhere in fact. They are hideously time consuming and expensive to repair properly, which is why you see so few on the road, and why good ones fetch huge prices.

But hey, lets look on the bright side. If you keep an eye on any emerging rust, attend to it in time and are prepared to spend what it costs to keep the car perfect, there is no reason why you can't go on to enjoy the car for many years like I have.

The way I look at it, the car costs me ?x? thousand pounds a year to maintain in tip top condition - for that, I get to drive one of the quickest, best looking cars ever made, with virtually zero depreciation. Not that I'm biased or anything, but then I've always been a bit of a 911 nut.


 

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