964 Cup front damper part numbers?

[BlueNGT]

I am trying find the part number for the front supsension set up of a 964 Cup Car.

I have been told the dampers are Gold in colour and are a motorsport part. Can't find any reference to them on the PET system.

Anybody who knows the number, where to look for it, how much they are or anywhere that has stock of them it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance

 

[chfs911]

Are these them? Almost bought them!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=300013344992&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=020

 

[BlueNGT]

ORIGINAL: chfs911

Are these them? Almost bought them!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=300013344992&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=020

Looks like them!! Cheap too!! Pity its not got part number.

 

[SimonExtreme]

According to a list posted on Rennlist, the part numbers are as follows

Shock absorber - left 964 343 509 70
Shock absorber - Right 964 343 510 70

and in August 2002, Porsche Motorsport were selling them for 679 euros each!

 

[BlueNGT]

Looks like http://www.freisinger-motorsport.de/porsche/?lang=uk&site=parts_specials have got a full set Brand New!!

£2700 + though. I think KW is cheaper than that!?

 

[Manipoe]

Freisinger ones look right although they were originally yellow/gold. The thicker front inserts are correct
Ebay ones look like standard RS units..

Orginally made by Bilstien but no longer available from them or Porsche..

I have a set at home, ill see if I can find some part numbers...

 

[BlueNGT]

ORIGINAL: manipou

Freisinger ones look right although they were originally yellow/gold. The thicker front inserts are correct
Ebay ones look like standard RS units..

Orginally made by Bilstien but no longer available from them or Porsche..

I have a set at home, ill see if I can find some part numbers...

I've heard they are very difficult to get hold of now!!

What are you doing with the set you have at home?

 

[Laurence Gibbs]

are you looking to replace a worn one? are you aware they can be rebuilt by Bilstein? All single tube designs can be rebuilt and revalved. The preverbial janitors brooms. Alternatively purchase new bilstein HD's and revalve to spec.

 

[BlueNGT]

ORIGINAL: Laurence Gibbs

are you looking to replace a worn one? are you aware they can be rebuilt by Bilstein? All single tube designs can be rebuilt and revalved. The preverbial janitors brooms. Alternatively purchase new bilstein HD's and revalve to spec.

My car has done 80k khm's now and I suppose the suspension is now due for a change/refresh, the engine has been rebult top and bottom end so suspension probably needs to follow that route.

The understeer created by the front end feeling light when travelling over uneven surfaces is sometimes unpleasent. The car has been set up and I have adjusted the roll bar settings but still find understeer a problem at times, but the bounce is the alarming thing. Noticed this more when on a trip to the Isle of Man this year!

How much would revalving etc cost usually?

I have been told that the rebound ability of a lowered car is the problem, not enough time for the shock to rebound for the next bump. Clearly this is exaggerated when driving on our fantastic roads.

 

[Keith Calder]

hi simon, handy site for cupcar parts here
http://www.cupcar.net/techlib/92CupParts.htm

 

[BlueNGT]

ORIGINAL: Keith Calder

hi simon, handy site for cupcar parts here
http://www.cupcar.net/techlib/92CupParts.htm

Hi Keith

Am I right with all this rebound stuff on the RS suspension?

Johnny told me a lot of this stuff.

 

[ian cox]

Cup dampers.
Laurence is right.
You can get your current dampers rebuilt/revalved to any setting you like at Bilstein.
I did this with a pair of legs for my '73 RS.
Bilstein UK is based near Leicester and it took around 3 weeks.
the price was much cheaper than buying new legs or inserts.
I am sorry but I cannot find the telephone numberr.
ian

 

[Manipoe]

Keeping mine sorry, I think Parr motorsport had a pair they could get their hands on from the motorsport dept in germany, but this was about 2 years ago..

Bilstein can rebuild shocks as the spare pair I have had new inserts done by bilstien, it was actually quite reasonable at £250 + VAT

Not sure if this can be done from a standard shock or not"¦

Call David Masters at Bilstein UK on 01455 283407

 

[BlueNGT]

Anybody know if these are the same as the Porsche items?

Porsche 964 Cup "" Bilstein references are
V36-59118H0 and V36-59117H0

 

[colt]

interesting disscusion this.I am in the middle of a freshen up of an 92 rs and was trying to get some new dampers for it.rear are standard rs ,but low and behold front units are the proverbial cup ones ,fitted i guess for their superior anti flex properties due to that monster diameter piston tube! of course that is really the outside of the damper as it is bolted into the leg upside down! I think i will have to get them rebuilt as the replacement cost is too much.of note the ebay items were correct but he had unbolted the cartridges from the strut housings,the thin end being inside the strut casing and retained by the bolt protruding from the bottom of the unit. pt numbers for the "cup" units are 964 343 509 70 (l/h) and 964 343 510 70 (r/h) other nos on them are 612 04891 tl (l/h) and 612 04891 tr (r/h)
worthy to note is that the strut case is smaller on the cup struts so you could not fit the cartridges to an ordinary strut,on the ones i am dealing with the adjusting collar is too big for the strut case and has a smaller correct diameter ring alloy welded too it! are yours the same?
If the damping rates are not too different, then fitting the std rs r/w/u (right way up) is the obvious soloution ,other than the struts all you need is two new height adjusting collars of the correct dia and some new bellows for the thiner piston rod diameter. and as far as i know the only thing you might be giving away is a bit of ridigity gained from the big (hollow) piston tubes of the cup type.
btw i was trying to buy these cup struts today at my opc and they called germany with my part numbers (got from the shocks) who said they had never issed these numbers! it was suggested they were fakes!!. I said after removing them from the car and cleaning them up on the bench, absolutly no way ,they were complete with factory ant rust wax the porsche pt number the vp in the triangle genuine parts crest. definately fitted from new!
i was wondering what i was going to do when i stumbled across this thread, how fortunate or me and the owner!!

regards christian

 

[BlueNGT]

Christian

I started a similar thread over on Rennlist titled '964 Cup shocks'.

The Cup shocks seem impossible to get hold of now so I would agree that rebuilding is the way forward. I have a couple of friends who work for Porsche and have assked if they can ask around to see if they can find any.

Failing that I believe the 993 RS front struts offer a solution to the bounce experienced on the front end on road driving and should also be fine on track. Waiting for a price on those.

The other alternative is replacing with alternatives like K&W but that is going to cost much more than the 993 RS alternative.

 

[SimonExtreme]

ORIGINAL: colt
btw i was trying to buy these cup struts today at my opc and they called germany with my part numbers (got from the shocks) who said they had never issed these numbers! it was suggested they were fakes!!. I said after removing them from the car and cleaning them up on the bench, absolutly no way ,they were complete with factory ant rust wax the porsche pt number the vp in the triangle genuine parts crest. definately fitted from new!

I suspect that the issue is that the number quoted is a motorsport part and IIRC, these are dealt wioth seperately from normal parts. So, if your opc enquired through normal channels I am not suprised at the response. I would recommend getting in touch directly with the motorsports division.

 

[BlueNGT]

ORIGINAL: SimonExtreme

ORIGINAL: colt
btw i was trying to buy these cup struts today at my opc and they called germany with my part numbers (got from the shocks) who said they had never issed these numbers! it was suggested they were fakes!!. I said after removing them from the car and cleaning them up on the bench, absolutly no way ,they were complete with factory ant rust wax the porsche pt number the vp in the triangle genuine parts crest. definately fitted from new!

I suspect that the issue is that the number quoted is a motorsport part and IIRC, these are dealt wioth seperately from normal parts. So, if your opc enquired through normal channels I am not suprised at the response. I would recommend getting in touch directly with the motorsports division.

Cannot find any way of contacting Motorsport division?

 

[Laurence Gibbs]

One thing to remember if you change back to standard RS parts is that the top cup monoballs may not fit the standard RS dampers (not sure of this) I think the top rod diameter is different ??? You will be looking at doubling your costs if this is the case. I am sure if you get in touch with bilstein directly (you can email them and they speak perfect english) they will have a replacement damper if you really need one. imho the last thing you want on a road driven RS is a stiffer front (not everyone will agree)[].

 

[BlueNGT]

ORIGINAL: Laurence Gibbs

One thing to remember if you change back to standard RS parts is that the top cup monoballs may not fit the standard RS dampers (not sure of this) I think the top rod diameter is different ??? You will be looking at doubling your costs if this is the case. I am sure if you get in touch with bilstein directly (you can email them and they speak perfect english) they will have a replacement damper if you really need one. imho the last thing you want on a road driven RS is a stiffer front (not everyone will agree)[].

I am also trying to price 993RS front shocks.

This has always been mentioned as a fix for softening the front slightly but still be suitable on track!?