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991 gen 2

cymro

PCGB Member
Member
I was yesterday given a Porsche 991S cab to test drive from PC Cardiff. Briefly my conclusion from the drive comparing to my GTS was,
even with the sport exhaust on it was too quiet, missing the exhaust noise of the GTS. I found with the sport exhaust turned off on my GTS, it was just so loud as the new turbo engine with the SPE turned on.

The acceleration was very quickly, I was very impressed with the overtaking mode for the 20seconds duration. The sport plus mode is a lot more timid than on my GTS.

My final verdict is, I prefer my 4GTS and a more enjoyable car to drive.
huw

 
Hi Huw, interesting about the sound of the car with PSE but not surprised.
I've got a drive on Tuesday will see how I find it and make the same comparison to my GTS and post my thoughts here.
Adrian


 
Big launch at PC Swindon last night, with Chris Craft and Peter Lovett in attendance. More about the launch of the new dealership than the 991.2. Booked in for a test drive to add to the debate here. Quite looking forward to it tbh.
 
I think I might let some of the early adopters work a few bugs out of this new turbo motor. One thing that caught my attention was that the rear spoiler is not an aerofoil as such but more of an airdam. I also understand that one of the reasons for changing the slats to a vertical orientation was to encourage more air to enter the intercoolers. There is plenty of heat rejection needed to cool the charge air and absent the classic turbo intakes it is not entirely clear to me how that is achieved. More than happy to be proved wrong.
 
Fortunate to have a drive of the new 991.2 with Adrian aka 'big cat' today we did some roads we used on the Cotswold tour.
Sure Adrian will put his thoughts on the forum later, but my impressions were -some nice features boost /overtake button
was nice, performance a slight improvement from my memory over my old 4S with power kit, but negatives were
very tame in normal with slight turbo lag ?needs sports mode on to give any real go with negative effects on mpg.
Steering seemed light and unconnected ,with lack of feedback to me anyway ??
disappointed with sports exhaust, difficult to know if it was on or off imo ,that was suprising as it's something I do miss.
Really missed the security and grip of 4wd. Need to try the 4S to compare.
Nice car ,bit unfair to compare with my turbo S I suppose, but left me a bit unimpressed tbo.
just my thoughts ??


 
So as Stokey said we both shared a drive of the new 991.2 , a C2S Cabriolet today, my comparison is against my 991 C2 GTS Coupe which I took delivery of exactly 1 year ago to the day.

First thing to say is it is a very nice package and what follows may seem overly negative but if you were coming from a 997 or earlier, or a 991 without the power kit then this 991.2 would be a good choice but I think it would have to be the 4WD as with the increase in available torque at lower revs, we both thought at times the car felt a bit "on the ragged edge" on the roads we were driving

The first thing I noticed both as a passenger with John and then as the driver was the sound or rather the lack of it, sure there were some nice "pops and bangs" on the overrun, and there is some reasonable exhaust "noise" but it was nothing like the low down "growl" of the GTS and that's compared to the standard exhaust note. Turning on the Sports Exhaust in the GTS and there is no comparison at all, in fact as John said it was difficult to detect much difference with SE on or off in the 991.2.

In "Normal" mode I felt there was some Turbo lag when flooring the accelerator say at 40mph so the way around that was to use Sport Mode all the time but compared to my GTS I didn't feel it was any quicker, yes on paper it may well be (and it's very marginal) but there wasn't anything there that made me feel I must have one of these. Once in Sport Mode then yes it will deliver a lot of instant torque at low revs and the engine will certainly rev all the way to 7000 but when I got back into my GTS for the drive home my car felt just as quick on the proviso that I keep the revs up.

As John said we drove part of the route we used on the Cotswold tour and more recently the afternoon drive at the register Christmas party, so twisty wet roads, not great surfaces but the car did feel a bit skittish with a lot less weight and "feel" to the front end, by comparison I think my 2WD GTS felt much more "planted" on the same stretch of road with a nicer "weightier" and precise feel to the steering.

The standard steel brakes were excellent, I thought they needed less foot pressure than my own GTS to pull up quickly.

I like the new PCM, it's a very crisp display and does look a bit more up to date, it does seem to require more use of the touch screen rather than direct access to menus via buttons like on the current PCM but it's a big improvement which is great because that's what I'm getting on my Macan GTS.[:D]

If I was choosing my 911 today, as I was in October 2014, and with the GTS still available then I would do a back to back test drive of both cars and based on my experience today it would be the GTS that I would order.

Having read my post again, it probably seems negative, in reality I think the new 991.2 is a very nice and capable car but although Porsche have tried to get the sound right, the use of turbos has made that very difficult and it just doesn't make the growl with that rising crescendo of exhaust and intake noise as you rev it like the NA GTS engine. As for the car we drove and it's very light steering, feeling skittish, I think the 4WD would be a better bet but I'd have to try it to see.
 
Thanks Adrian and John, very interesting in your thoughts. I would have also liked to have driven the all wheel drive version to compare to the GTS. huw
 
Hmmmm, so is it possible to feel disappointed with a new 911? I genuinely came with an open mind for my test drive today and wanted to like the new engine, knowing that this was the main change to the 991.2 from my old C2S. I was hoping that the reports (which have in the main been very positive) would be correct. But I came away with a feeling that the turbo engine has lost the aural and sensual rush that the S engine had. The torque is obviously there, but just seems a linear surge of power, missing that sense of occasion you get from the NA engine as it gains revs, and then steps up to another level as it spins past 5,500 rpm with a banshee howl. The car came with sports exhaust but was much quieter than before, and the difference with and without the exhaust button pressed was marginal. One or two pops on the overrun, but not that naughty note it's predecessor boasts. The brakes felt marginally stronger (and are apparently upgraded) and the steering seemed the same to me. Unlike Adrian, I didn't find the car felt skittish and the roads were damp, maybe he's used to the wider track and tyres on his GTS. On the plus side, the steering wheel finally gives multi function option with paddles, and the Apple Carplay I'm sure is great, not that I tried it out. The new door handles felt somehow cheap, but the rear valance with sports exhaust is visually great.

So no, I didn't rush to sign on the dotted line. I'm going to have to think long and hard on my next car I can see. Suggestions on a postcard...
 
pwebb said:
Hmmmm, so is it possible to feel disappointed with a new 911? I genuinely came with an open mind for my test drive today and wanted to like the new engine, knowing that this was the main change to the 991.2 from my old C2S. I was hoping that the reports (which have in the main been very positive) would be correct. But I came away with a feeling that the turbo engine has lost the aural and sensual rush that the S engine had. The torque is obviously there, but just seems a linear surge of power, missing that sense of occasion you get from the NA engine as it gains revs, and then steps up to another level as it spins past 5,500 rpm with a banshee howl. The car came with sports exhaust but was much quieter than before, and the difference with and without the exhaust button pressed was marginal. One or two pops on the overrun, but not that naughty note it's predecessor boasts. The brakes felt marginally stronger (and are apparently upgraded) and the steering seemed the same to me. Unlike Adrian, I didn't find the car felt skittish and the roads were damp, maybe he's used to the wider track and tyres on his GTS. On the plus side, the steering wheel finally gives multi function option with paddles, and the Apple Carplay I'm sure is great, not that I tried it out. The new door handles felt somehow cheap, but the rear valance with sports exhaust is visually great.

So no, I didn't rush to sign on the dotted line. I'm going to have to think long and hard on my next car I can see. Suggestions on a postcard...
If you want a good all rounder with a fantastic soundtrack, more performance than the outgoing S, and one that will keep up with a 991.2 then a Carrera GTS with Ceramic Brakes, PDCC and a few other options will come in under ÂŁ110K on the other hand if you want a bit more manual involvement wait for the 911R but if you miss out the GTS will probably be no longer be available. OR if it's more track day focused and you don't mind slipping around in the wet on mountain passes :ROFLMAO:a GT3 but you will have to pay a lot for one of those.
 
The 991 R looks a non starter - only 19 cars for the UK - and dealers are holding dozens of LOI for GT3.2. Bummer.
 
Took my GTS out today in the rain (shock horror!) and it just confirmed that had I waited another 12 months I would still have gone for the GTS over a similar specced up 991.2 C2S but maybe a 4WD version with Ceramic Brakes.
 
The logical choice would be new-
If you want a soundtrack got to be a GTS ?? in 2 or 4wd I would go 4wd as you have the wide body already .
If you can live with the exhaust note and want the new model fine ,but would have to be 4wd for me ??
Now nearly new is another matter! there are a few tasty 991,s and I like the idea of somebody taking the first year loss.lol
I know you are not a big turbo fan Peter but I would have a road test ,you never know ????
 
Lack of a loud exhaust note seems to be the focus here , but of course you are comparing apples with pairs, normally aspirated as opposed to turbo, which as we all know, is quieter and less intrusive, but nevertheless provides considerable extra bang per buck. Personally, I can do without the rorty exhaust, having been subjected to them for most of my adult life, so I'm glad of a quiet life nowadays. It also avoids undue attention too at critical times when maybe, you least require it! [;)]

As regards feeling "on the ragged edge", do you think maybe this was due to the car being brand new as opposed to a well "bedded in" GTS used as comparison? The suspension would not yet have settled in and the tyres probably still have mould releasing agent and high spots - just a thought. [8|] Porsche's usual development is forward, so it's difficult to accept it has just produced a car inferior in term of handling and road holding to the earlier model.

The turbo lag is worrying because Porsche have been at some pains to eliminate this with their recirculating exhaust system and semi-open trailing throttle. It appears from what's been said, this may have failed to produce the desired result. The observation on steering is also worrying. I have long been a critic of the electric steering system which I considered is slow to react and lacks feel for the road surface, so it's painful to think this has not improved with the new model.

It's interesting to hear the comments and thanks for posting.

Regards,

Clive.
 
Lancerlot said:
[8|] Porsche's usual development is forward, so it's difficult to accept it has just produced a car inferior in term of handling and road holding to the earlier model.


I didn't feel that at all Clive, the handling felt very similar to me and was very much apples with apples as I was in a C2S coupe, as I had before. I understand where Porsche are coming from with the smaller turbo engine, no different from many other manufacturers. With the Boxster and Cayman going to 4 cylinder turbos it won't be long before the same appears in the next Gen 991 (with some form of hybrid). It's just that for me, the 3litre turbo doesn't offer enough extra over the previous 3.8 NA to excite me. I totally understand where you're coming from Adrian, the GTS looks good in comparison.
 
went out as a passenger in the new 991.2s today and I must say I was impressed!the soundtrack is most defiantly there and imo better than a non pse 997.2 .personally I think Porsche are on to a winner as punters have chased a 911 turbo for 30 years as a premium car and here we have one as a mainstream model albeit a smaller turbo but the upside is a more linear power delivery.i was smitten and I don't even like 991s or turbos!!





 
My first drive in the 991.2S today on a whole mix of roads including urban, dual carriageway and fast winding B roads. 2WD and pdk, so reserving final judgment on handling etc until I can do a direct comparison with my current 4S manual. That aside, main difference was the exhaust note, as others are saying. In normal mode and auto, makes a very quiet and civilised urban cruiser. Even with sports exhaust on, sport plus and in manual mode it doesn't quite have the fizz of the current car, although with windows down you get the new turbo whistle, which no doubt in time will give this car it's own character. However, being a fully paid up member of the 10% club, my next challenge is going to be to track down a demonstrator with manual box...
 
AB2012 said:
My first drive in the 991.2S today on a whole mix of roads including urban, dual carriageway and fast winding B roads. 2WD and pdk, so reserving final judgment on handling etc until I can do a direct comparison with my current 4S manual. That aside, main difference was the exhaust note, as others are saying. In normal mode and auto, makes a very quiet and civilised urban cruiser. Even with sports exhaust on, sport plus and in manual mode it doesn't quite have the fizz of the current car, although with windows down you get the new turbo whistle, which no doubt in time will give this car it's own character. However, being a fully paid up member of the 10% club, my next challenge is going to be to track down a demonstrator with manual box...


 
Having just taken delivery of probably the last 991GTs pdk pdcc
to leave the production line of 2015 I was naturally anxious to drive the Gen.2S Coupe. My first impression was that there was no apparent turbo lag, the car taking off like a rocket with quite unusual linear acceleration, with country roads being wet and greasy, not really a day for exploring cornering performance. I prefer the progressive build up of torque with the GTs I believe more pleasurable to drive with our crowded roads.
Enjoy your Gen. 2 12 months waiting list I understand !!
Happy Christmas
John


 
I had an hour in a gen 2 S today and drove on a mix of roads
the performance very much reminded me of the first time I went out in 997 turbo PDK
much quicker early on than the previous 991S
sports exhaust note crackling fun
the turbo 991 gen 2 is going to be too scary for my abilities I think!!!
altogether great car and I felt the feel through steering pretty good
still can't decide if I should go for a gts gen 1(theyve got one ready for January if I want it)
or go gen2 S
both great cars IMO
 

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