advice on a 944 turbo conversion for sale

[cossie connoisseur]

basically ive found a nice 944 turbo that was convirted into an S.

work carried out includes;

new body seals and respray
brand new uprated turbo
new intercooler
refurbed wastegate
new disks and pads
new clutch
new torque convirter
refurbed rear beam
new bushes
968 interior, mint
Porsche S2 alloys
adjustable suspension

car has 160k but full documented history and stakes of invoices. Was rebuilt by lee noble so guess someone will know the car here.......mabie even the current owner

Any help, advice, or yips will be very much appreciated. I want to see the car next week

thanks in advance

Nick

 

[xenon]

Don't know it - is there a link? Sounds nice.

 

[cossie connoisseur]

http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/776049.htm

 

[xenon]

Mmm. []

It says built to full "S" specification, but presumably the output is 220 still? I wonder if it has M030?

 

[djcla]

i just dont understand why you would spend an utter fortune on a car and then sell it for 4k, madness but things change i guess. Insurance may be steep if the turbo has been changed to increase performance and the engine modded etc..worth getting some more detail and phoning for a few insurance companys for quotes i would think.

 

[cossie connoisseur]

with the uprated turbo he says its pushing 247bhp but has not been mapped.

he did say they were koni adjustable suspension

lee noble brought a 944 turbo and a 944 tubro S, the S had a rotton body so was striped and parts used on the turbo which was upgraded into a S with lots of new bits used. The turbo and intercooler are brand new not second hand.

£5000 was spent on the refurb but does not include bits from the turbo S that were used

The S2 alloys are genuine and not copies

 

[edh]

It looks nice - btw those are clubsport rims - not S2 (Design 90 wheels.) These are forged, not cast, slightly lighter and also look better. (and if you don't want them I'd love a second set )
It would be worth checking the spec of the turbo - is it a 26/6 or a 26/8? (the latter will give you more power, but not spool up quite as early)

Bear in mind that the belts are due again, even though it's only done 2k since. If the car has been sitting around, it will have deteriorated a bit - I'd have preferred to see it with 170-175k by now...Check all the electrics carefully.

I wonder why he's selling? If there's no rust (I hope not after the refurb!), and the clutch is OK, I would think that's a pretty good buy.

 

[Fen]

Looks OK from the pics, but it's really hard to tell from a brief description and some photos.

What I would say is: Torque convertor? Really, on a manual? They don't look like 968 seats to me, which may or may not be a concern to you; I'd suggest not as it's just a pattern in the stitching that's different, but they aren't Sport seats. Dunno why of you had 2 cars with intercoolers you'd buy a new one as they don't exact;y wear out.

It does sound cheap, but then it's messed about with so not a "proper" car and that is always going to hurt its value compared with a nice original car. The trouble is if you buy it and then need parts you're going to have potential problems with bits of it possibly being '87 and bits of it being '89, though at least going by the wheels it has either got the later cars suspension fitted in its entirety or it was just new enough to have had the later offsets from new.

On the subject of those wheels they are as Ed describes, but I wouldn't personally want them. Too many (as in more than one wheel that I know of) have sheared spokes on track for me to want to use them at 20 years old.

 

[pauljmcnulty]

ORIGINAL: djcla

i just dont understand why you would spend an utter fortune on a car and then sell it for 4k, madness but things change i guess. Insurance may be steep if the turbo has been changed to increase performance and the engine modded etc..worth getting some more detail and phoning for a few insurance companys for quotes i would think.

Good point about checking the insurance, it's always worth declaring any mods to them or they will wriggle out of paying in the event of a claim.

It seems crazy to spend so much time and effort on a car and then sell, but it goes to show that you never get anything like the value back that you put in. You need to be thinking long-term if you're investing in a car, or you'll be throwing money away. Of course, the new owner is going to be getting the fruits of someone's hard work!

This car came up before, IIRC. It looks good value if it's been properly welded and sprayed - I'd guess they'd have all the receipts and probably pictures of the work?

 

[Diver944]

On the face of it the car seems good but I would want more detailed information..

Is the Turbo a K26/8? Simply bolting the larger Turbo on will not release any more power as the chipset will not dynamically increase the boost. A simple rechip 'could ' see that turbocharger up to 280-290bhp.

Is the reconditioned wastegate simply another factory wastegate? If it is then it won't be able to hold higher boost past about 4000rpm before it bleeds away (I notice there is no boost controller in the engine bay so the factory cycling valve will open the boost early anyway).

History to 2005 means it needs new belts and a good service now, regardless of mileage since all the work.

If the interior is truly mint (side of passenger bolster looks floppy) and the bodywork repairs have been done well then this could be a very sound buy with all the expensive work recently attended to (clutch, sills, brakes and suspension are all expensive)

Love that exterior colour [8D]

 

[swright]

Hello cossie con. Im glad to see you have found your way over here from the 190 forum[]

The best of luck with this one, as i have already said over there[]


Stu.

 

[J.C944TurboMan]

Real nice looking 944 T , if your getting into the 944 scene you should look out on some of the early 944 cars are geting a bit rotten , so have a good poke underneath or get the car on a ramp , check see if there is fresh undersealent hiding any rust .I read online that the 944 250BHP Turbo had different heads with bigger exhaust valves and also the ECU are different , so it's not just a bigger 26/8 Turbo but a full package . The Turbo seats have bigger side bolsters but the seats they have fitted suit the car . My main advise would be to make sure you buy a 944 with good solid foundations as you end up changing or upgrading every part on the car anyway !If your looking to own a nice different Porsche then you should consider the 968 and then put a Turbo on the 3L engine or drop a 250BHP Turbo engine into the 968 and try and create a 968 RS replica ! Know that would be interesting and should hold it's future value as a replica Porsche.

 

[944Turbo]

if you read it on the web must be true - however I think you will find all 944ts had the same size valves.
Tony


ps my 944 is worth £40k please let it be known on as many forums as poss cheers

 

[cossie connoisseur]

well as far as it goes lee noble contacted one of the 'experts' on 944's (infact i think he was one of the designers) and the mods are what was recomended by him.

they have all paperwork from 1986 including the work done at noble.

will ask about the turbo and wastegate

thanks for the feedback

 

[Fen]

I know you think this is personal, but it isn't; it's just nobody else submits utter nonsense every second time they click the OK button.

ORIGINAL: J.C944TurboMan
the 944 250BHP Turbo had different heads with bigger exhaust valves and also the ECU are different , so it's not just a bigger 26/8 Turbo but a full package . The Turbo seats have bigger side bolsters but the seats they have fitted suit the car

All utter rubbish with the exception that some early 220 ECUs had a different number of pins internally, but they are still externally the same.

Also

ORIGINAL: J.C944TurboMan
If your looking to own a nice different Porsche then you should consider the 968 and then put a Turbo on the 3L engine or drop a 250BHP Turbo engine into the 968 and try and create a 968 RS replica ! Know that would be interesting and should hold it's future value as a replica Porsche.

How random is that? The OP is asking for advice on a specific 944T that is finished and ready to use. Why on earth would you think he wants to get into fitting a turbo to a 968 or fitting a 250 Turbo engine in a 968?

 

[J.C944TurboMan]

Have a read of this info I found online and then again tell me I am uttering total nonsense ! Mr Fen ! As for the 968 with a Turbo engine , this would have been an intresting project and all I was advising this person who is looking to spend a lot of £££ on a 944 Turbo was if he had considered a 968 Turbo S or RS version replica , that was all . After all Mr Fen the UK still benefits from freedom of speach and postings , so again I am strongly advising you to back of ! If you have nothing positive to contribute then chop your fingers off or better still stick them up your back side instead of using the PC !
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Pit/4786/Data.html
[font=arial,helvetica][size=+1]2. Engine[/size]
The major focus of the performance features of the Turbo S is the M 44/52 engine. It was produced with and without a catalytic converter (without, available only in certain markets). The engine characteristics are summarized below.

[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1][/size]




[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Model[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Displ.[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]cc[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Stroke[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]mm[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Bore[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]mm[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Compr.[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Ratio[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]SAE Power[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1](@rpm)[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Torque[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1](@rpm)[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Max[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]rpm[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]Max[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]boost[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1][/size]

[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]944 Turbo[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]2479[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]78.9[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]100[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]8.0:1[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]217 HP[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]243 ft-lb (3500)[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]6500[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1][/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1][/size]

[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]944 Turbo S[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]2479[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]78.9[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica]135[/size]136
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]8.0:1[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]247 HP (6000)[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]250 ft-lb (4000)[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]6500±20[/size]
[font=arial,helvetica][size=-1]1.82 bar[/size]

Other detailed changes include:

• New turbocharger. Modified turbine vanes.
• Modified DME mapping of fuel and ignition curves and handling of knock sensor and oxygen sensor input.
• Cooling system changes to accomodate surrounding body side member reinforements.
• Slightly larger exhaust valves, still sodium (natrium) cooled. Permits better running behavior at full load.

 

[pauly]

[8|][8|][8|].

 

[pauljmcnulty]

Have a read of this info I found online and then again tell me I am uttering total nonsense ! Mr Fen ! As for the 968 with a Turbo engine , this would have been an intresting project and all I was advising this person who is looking to spend a lot of £££ on a 944 Turbo was if he had considered a 968 Turbo S or RS version replica , that was all . After all Mr Fen the UK still benefits from freedom of speach and postings , so again I am strongly advising you to back of ! If you have nothing positive to contribute then chop your fingers off or better still stick them up your back side instead of using the PC !

Hi Juan,

Fen's been contributing to this forum for many years, and has owned all the 944 variants over many tens of thousands of miles. He's helped hundreds of people with his advice here, you could learn so much from him if you just sat back and listened! [&:]

There's no such thing as totally free speech, hence Gary Glitter and the BNP aren't appearing on this forum any time soon. A reminder of the forum guidelines below:

6 Please do not be critical of other members' posts or start threads designed to be critical of others; if you are
unhappy with another post or with the conduct of a member please use the "˜Report Abuse'* option.

1 Posts that are inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening,
rude, mean, nasty, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise against any reasonable standard of behaviour are
not permitted. Such posts will be deleted without warning.

2 The Moderator's decision on what contravenes Rule One is final.

Please try and keep it courteous and polite? We're all mature adults here, or adults at least....[&:]

Thanks

 

[jackregan]

Good point well made Paul M, I was looking forward to the BNP posting here lol

 

[TTM]

Those are 944 inner door panels. 968 ones are strengthened so that when you rest your elbow at the top they won't bulge after 15 years and induce constant wind noise in the door unless the window is just a tiny bit lowered ... [8|]

Still, it looks nice ; a smart colour combination.