Big Black!

[924nutter]

ORIGINAL: John Sims

I'm glad I bought holy discs as the others would weigh more.

Blessed are they who shalt fit the sacred holy disc. These discs were canonised by the right reverend the Wheelarch Bishop of PADington. Thou shalt kneel before the sacred circle and make the holy sacrifice of thine skinned knuckles when removing the cross of the head of the screw from the sacremental hub.

amen[][][]

 

[wjk_glynn]

ORIGINAL: carlmthompson
...So then. Has anyone got one of each type of caliper to photograph? [8|]

See the second page of this thread for comparison photos - http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforums/showthread.php?t=326572

The Rennlister is upgrading his 968 Turbo to 6-piston GT2/GT3 calipers.

Karl.

 

[John Sims]

Big thanks are due to Mr Cannell and his web page - yet again!

Pads arrived from Euro Car Parts - Green Stuffs ordered but Red Stuff Ceramics arrived - Fair enough as I would probably have gone for Red Stuffs through choice. Why order Green Stuffs then? Because that's what they listed and I didn't know how to get the alternate reference - I do now.

Any road up - I tried my new Red Stuff pads in my nice new callipers and they didn't really fit. They were the right length but seemed too short. I then tried the EBC web sites and eventually (with much cross referencing) found a site which gave me the correct pad numbers. This was further confirmed after smurfing http://www.cannell.co.uk/944%20Turbo%20-%2082.htm It transpired that, while Euro Car Parts had sent me pads for what they thought was a 928GTS/911 3.6 Turbo (Big Blacks) they were (believe it of not) for a 928 S4/944 Turbo 90- ie "Medium Blacks" []

Phoned up EuroCP's, told them the error of their ways, and said I wanted DP3997C's not the DP3767C's that they had sent me. Discussion continues:-

ME: Oh and while it says Green Stuffs on your site these were Red Stuffs

ECP: Oh, but we have got DP3997C's

ME: Good, I'll have them, that's what I want.

ECP: They are Green Stuff pads.

ME: No they'll be Red Stuff pads

ECP: No they are Green Stuff​

ME: No they aren't. They are Red Stuff because the reference is DP3997C. If they were Green Stuff the reference would be DP2977.

ECP: Oh. They are going to cost more.

It doesn't inspire confidence does it? I'm just glad I checked the pad in the calliper before everything was unbolted and the new setup was bolted in place.

 

[924nutter]

John, they might want to give you a consideration on the price as it seems to me that they niether supplied the correct pad or material. That is a completely unacceptable situation. I had some alleged 924 turbo pads sent but they were completely the wrong shape, and obviously wrong , but to think that the one's they sent fitted the caliper, (albeit not well enough to the expert eye) I shudder to think what could have happened. I am amazed that you weren't extremely cross.

 

[John Sims]

ORIGINAL: 924nutter

..... I am amazed that you weren't extremely cross.

I like to keep my powder dry in such situations.

While they were in the wrong they did all of the right things to resolve the situation and I don't mind paying the correct price for something over and above what they had originally suggested. IE I am happier paying more for Red Stuff pads than insisting I want Green Stuff at the original price.

They are collecting the original wrong pads and not charging any extra postage - damn right they aren't. []

While it could have been a right pain with the car off the road for the weekend (had I started the job) at the moment it is a case of no harm done.

 

[Fen]

Why are you going with EBC pads at all?

 

[333pg333]

ORIGINAL: Fen

Why are you going with EBC pads at all?

Sorry, but +2?^

 

[John Sims]

ORIGINAL: Fen

Why are you going with EBC pads at all?

In the first instance, because they were listed at , as I thought, the correct size. It was a case of getting the car up and running. I haven't been unhappy with EBC's in the past.

Why?

 

[333pg333]

Not to be disrespectful but I've had greens and yellows, and they're crap compared to others in the market place. If you just want to potter around the village, then fine, otherwise, and especially if you're going to the track you can do much, much better. Fen is a fan of PFC's which seem to have trouble being accepted. I am a convert and can attest to how superior they're are to EBC's. How can I put it? Like getting out of an n/a 924 and getting into a modded 944turbo is about the difference. I'm sure Pagids and others are also very good. Anyway just my 0.02c worth.

 

[John Sims]

Interesting! Perhaps it would be more helpful if you could give some indication why you consider one to be "crap" and the other less so.

 

[sawood12]

I must admit the EBC yellows seem fine on road and have plenty of bite and stopping power and my experience of the reds is that they don't loose performance when hot on track so I've got no reason to assume the yellows will run out of puff on track (we'll see at Bedforn). I've always considered the Performance Friction pads to be a specialist track only pad and because Fen and Patrick are raving on about them so much I am now wondering if they are a suitable all-round pad? I realise they generate alot of dust, which I could live with, but what I couldn't live with is a pad that doesn't work when cold and one that squeals alot (the yellows do squeal but not that much so I can live with it).

So how do the PF pads perform for normal street use and pottering about in traffic?

 

[944Turbo]

and how long do they last?

I also have yellows and am happy with the retardation combined with the big blacks - not tracked them yet and still to fit the rear yellows

 

[944Turbo]

ps didnt find the reds much better than greens, they made lots more dust and wore faster without a corresponding performance improvement.
Tony

 

[Fen]

I hate the greens. I paid twice as much as OE ones for a set for the hearse to try to keep dust down with the 15 spoke alloys and they create black dust these days as well as not being very good pads. I haven't tried any other EBC pads, but a Jaguar test driver I got chatting to at the 'Ring hates them and they have had less than glowing reports from people such as Patrick.

In terms of Performance Friction I don't claim to be the first with these; I bought them on the recommendation of Dave Malings who uses then on hit 944T. He reckons they last better than other pads he has used at the 'Ring (like they were less than half worn after a number of laps that had some other brand ready for replacement). Also Allan at WRC raves about Performance Friction brakes and his is an opinion I value.

I have the 97 compound and when stone cold on a damp Winters day they feel like OK brakes for the first application (no scary moments anyway), then they go astounding from the second application on. My indie after driving my car for the first time said "it drives like an RS, and the brakes are unbelieveable". When presses he thought they were very feelsome, powerful and easily modulated. They didn't even hint at anything but outstanding performance at Oulton even after a 30 minute session.

Things to be aware of is that they are not easy to get at short notice in the UK (perhaps Allan carries stock nowadays?), they are not cheap (£182+VAT+delivery for my Big Black set as I recall), they make lots of dust which is very aggressive not only on the alloys but also down the side of the car and they can squeal with light check-braking round town.