Boxster Engine Rebuild Problems, problems, problems....

[boxster2000s]

I have a Boxster 3.2S year 2000 which was seemingly running just fine just after a full service. I left it for 2 weeks as I went on holiday and when I returned it was suddenly idling extremely roughly but I just put this down to it not being run for a couple of weeks so drove off. Within in a matter of minutes the car was engulfed with thick white smoke pouring out the exhaust...And I mean MASSIVE amounts and then the engine tone suddenly dropped to a much deeper tone (similar to a blown exhaust). The engine light came on and it was taken to a 'specialist' who advised something serious had happened and the engine needed to be stripped.

So the engine was sent off to someone he uses and stripped and I was told it basically needed a rebuild (I still have never really had clarification as to what went wrong and why so suddenly), 5 weeks later I have picked the car up and it sounds terrible. It is idling extremely roughly, seems to be lacking a bit of power (although that might be in my head) and seems to be a lot louder in the cabin than it used to be. It still also seems to be a lot deeper than it used to be, again, sounding almost like the exhaust is blowing (which it isn't).

Secondly, the car seems to be pulling all over the place when I turn to the left. It suddenly judders terribly and pulls and pushes all over the place. It was not like this when I handed the car in but the picking up of the car was at the close of business, was very rushed and I didn't get to test drive it, although the guy did mention that my bald tyre seemed to be causing a problem on corners. I do have a tyre that needs renewing but there is no way this amount of judder and problems is being caused by it and it was absolutely fine when I handed it in, infact I had just had the tracking done on it - The steering wheel is now not properly alligned and I'm wondering if maybe they've knocked the wheel or something?

Needless to say that I am taking this straight back, but before I do I wanted to be armed with information, so:

- Any ideas why the engine would be a lower tone than normal, running louder and rough etc as described?
- I paid 4.5k for this rebuild, is that about average/reasonable (providing it was actually done properly!)
- Any ideas what the problem with the steering is, it feels like tracking has been knocked out but something a lot worse than that too.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Black80XSA]

£4.5k seems about right for a rebuild if the original failure was the intermediate shaft issue. This in most cases results in the car dumping its oil all over the road, which you don't mention. Clouds of smoke might have been an oil air separator failure, but this should have been sorted for £500.

The work should be guaranteed for a period, so take it back - you've paid out a lot of money to recieve back your car with more faults than it started with !

You don't mention who the garage / rebuilder was - as i read your thread it almost sounds like a dubious job by a non specialist outlet.

 

[boxster2000s]

Thank you for your reply. It was not the IMS and there was no pool of oil. Just a huge amount of smoke and a sudden gruffness in the engine with the engine light on.

It is a Porsche 'Specialist' who admitted himself he wasn't happy with the rebuild from whoever he outsourced it to as he said it was misfiring, it was therefore sent back again but I believe it's come back wrong again and he's just given up.

Any idea what the steering problem could be?

 

[spyderman]

So why isn't he giving your money back? The job just hasn't been done. Trading Standards your next stop.

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

Huge clouds of white smoke is often caused by a failed air/oil separator, as David says. Tubes inside the AOS split and cause oil mist to enter the inlet manifold. This can contaminate the MAF and/or O2 sensors, causing rough running. The split tubes often produce an odd rasping noise.

As for the wheel alignment, various bits of rear end suspension have to be removed before the engine will come out. I would suggest getting a full alignment check, which should have been done as part of the process, but obviously wasn't.

And once you get it sorted, find a new indy.

 

[boxster2000s]

Would something like the air/oil seperator go instantly? From running fine to terrible?

The work he has charged me for is:

Remove engine, strip and rebuild with new piston rings, big end bearings, front and rear crank seals, new head bolts, oil filter and breather box. In total with labour was £4500.

I am certainly not going to be accepting this work but want to return armed with a bit more knowledge. The engine sounds so much deeper now and I just can't understand why.

I did not realise suspension etc. would be removed to get the engine out. Does this mean wheels etc. were removed? The steering feels to terrible and juddery that I was convinced they had knocked it, I know the geometry would throw things off a bit but would it end up in a steering wheel that shakes all over the place as if one wheel was bent out of shape?

 

[Black80XSA]

No mention of changing the AOS, so if there's no smoke now then perhaps it was something else - i'd certainly hope so givent he work they've completed.

AOS do fail suddenly and dramatically - the internals suddenly split/break due to age/corrosion.

I wonder whether the timing is correct given the possible lack of power and rough running ? I assume you don't have the check engine light illuminated which might indicate incorrect timing or a failed MAF or exhasut oxygen sensor ??

It might be worth having a chat with either Autofarm or Hartech about your original symptoms and the work thats been completed - they are the experts of engine rebuilds, and i'm sure would be happy to discuss what the original failure may have been, whether the work undertaken was required and why the car's not right now.

 

[boxster2000s]

Thanks black80Xsa. I've just phoned the guy ready for an argument but I must admit he was quite accomodating, I taking the car back shortly to be left to have him look over it again. Looks like I'm going to miss the summer at this rate though!

I will have a chat with Autofarm and see. The timing thing is interesting because he did actually mention before that he had to send the engine back because the timing chain was on wrongly - Maybe this still isn't sorted? Would it account for the lower engine tone though, I still just can't work out what this is.

 

[T200]

Hi, Sorry to hear ebout your troubles this might not be much good now but it may help you understand how your engine should have been rebuilt, and what would have been removed from the car during the rebuild
http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=glenn986s&view=videos

http://986fix.com/main.php

Hope this is of help and you get it all resolved soon

Chris

 

[boxster2000s]

Thanks T200, I'm going to give them a little watch now!

 

[johnk]

there doesn't seem to be a mention of a new int shaft either on your list, strange for that price really..

what they may have done is not timed it correctly , if they are not familiar with the porsche engine they could get it totally wrong as what you basically have to do is time it up as though you were timing 2 engines up.

if they have not done it as so by locking the end of the cams and getting the engine crank in certain positions then tightening cam pulley and retiming back to OT to put slack on right side of chain and so on.. would be a bit worried like stated if its come back worse than it went, are they specialists that have rebuilt it?

 

[boxster2000s]

Ok, so I've take then car back. The steering rack apparently had a lose bolt in which has been tightened and accounted for the steering problem. It wasn't like that before so I can only assume it was them!

However, he has now said to me that the rough idle etc. he believes is caused by dodgy coils and that they should be replaced but he wants to charge me for them. Do I need to? Should an engine rebuilt not surely include everything required to get the engine running properly again or is it acceptable that £4500 has paid for a basic rebuild and if it needs more tweaks after that then it's my problem?

 

[kitchens]

Sorry to hear all your problems ..noticed you are a new member pity in hindsight you did not come on here for advice before you went down the route you have taken .I would be paying a visit to trading standards ,this garage must face up to the fact they have not done the job correctly and should be fixing it at there cost ,hope things get sorted soon

 

[johnk]

is your engine light on with the current fault?
as the coil packs would throw up misfires fault into ecu

 

[boxster2000s]

There's no engine light and when he plus it into the diagnostics no error code is coming up apparently but he still believes it could be dodgy coil.

This is the problem, no engine light or error code yet it is obvious to anyone that something isn't right. It idles like an old bus. Any ideas? And should I be paying more money not to correct this?

 

[KC986]

this may not be of much help but, when a couple of coil packs failed on my 986, no check engine light came on until the problem became quite serious. I had taken the car to my Indy a week before the car realised there was a problem.

 

[barrysmith]

Sorry to say but its sound like Bob Hope and no hope, I would take it to the OPC and ask,

and then look at legal proceeding. It might be a Porsche but at the end of the day its an Engine and your repairer doesn't appear to have a clue.

 

[Mark_Bennett]

I think you need to be asking why all the work was done. These engines don't generally need all the piston rings, bearings and seals replacing - they don't just wear out. They run for a long time.
Something may fail now and again - but it is usually catastrophic if it it something mechanical.

 

[boxster2000s]

The car has done around 95k miles so don't know if that makes any of the work more neccessary. I'm tempted to believe that replacing the coils may help but now I seriously wonder what work was actually required although the car has been in and our now for over 6 weeks and when I've gone past to check it has been up on ramps etc. so I do believe that the work has actually been done but I just don't know whether I should be paying for the coil packs.

The argument from him is that the 4.5k was to strip and rebuild the engine and carry out the work as listed above as that was thought to be what would solve the problem. However, now that hasn't completely sorted it out the extra work (e.g. coils) is optional and therefore would be at my cost?

I have had an engine rebuild before and never been in this situation. The engine was rebuilt and ran fine so that was the end of that. In this case I don't really know where the buck lays?

This is a Porsche specialist but not a big company, just one main owner and a couple of helpers in a small garage. He is a previous Porsche racer and enthusiast and one of the guys that helps him used to work at Porsche so I felt confident in giving him the work. However, now it all just seems a complete hash.

Would it be as simple as just the coils - At the moment the idle is terribly rough and shakes the car but also I still have the problem that the whole engine tone seems deeper and gruffer (in a bad way) so there's a lot more cabin noise (sounds a bit like a young boy racer exhaust system) and just seems to be a bit more 'tappy' etc. and not as much top end power. Could all this be solved with a coil?

 

[Andrew Killington]

"Within in a matter of minutes the car was engulfed with thick white smoke pouring out the exhaust...And I mean MASSIVE amounts and then the engine tone suddenly dropped to a much deeper tone (similar to a blown exhaust). The engine light came on and it was taken to a 'specialist' who advised something serious had happened and the engine needed to be stripped.

So the engine was sent off to someone he uses and stripped and I was told it basically needed a rebuild (I still have never really had clarification as to what went wrong and why so suddenly), 5 weeks later I have picked the car up and it sounds terrible. It is idling extremely roughly, seems to be lacking a bit of power (although that might be in my head) and seems to be a lot louder in the cabin than it used to be. It still also seems to be a lot deeper than it used to be, again, sounding almost like the exhaust is blowing (which it isn't)".

Sorry to hear about your car; I think you should start by seeking to establish the facts of what was fixed and why and get this in writing. It seems that the car went off to an unknown third party with who knows what experience of these engines. I would be looking to start building my case and obtaining some legal advice (through Trading Standards or Citizens advice first perhaps). Before I went for the new coils I would consider having the car inspected by a recommended Independent.
You need to try and get the facts and understand your options.
Andrew