moving from 993 to 944T ?

[333pg333]

Funny that this is the only forum that I've seen S2s compared to the turbo model.
If you're an accountant who wants to be a bit daring get the S2. If you want to live a little, get the turbo. Spending some money on it to upgrade certain things is a given and therefore I consider it a 'real world' comparison. There's not much that you can do with an S2 except count all the extra money in your bank account.[]

 

[sawood12]

It's strange that the N/A route was chosen by Porsche to take their transaxel car forward in the form of the 968 - well by forward I really mean the same but looking different. I wonder if they ever did a 968 turbo if that model would have survived a bit longer than it did.

I've never driven a 993 - would love to. From what I gather the 993 brakes better than the 944 and has much better traction. I think to get the best out of a 993 you would have to change your driving style drastically and develop faith that the light feeling front end will actually bite when you turn the wheel. It may not feel as accelarative or exhilarating as the 944 turbo, but I bet it can be just as much fun if not more to drive.

I don't accept the arguments that turbo lag hinders the performance of the 944 turbo's. It is there and it is consistent and as a driver you are aware of it and it is quite easy and doesn't take long to adapt. Just as in an S2 you have to keep the revs high to get the best out of it, in the turbo you soon learn to keep the revs right to make sure you are always in the boost zone. For me it's not an issue - and it is really easy to control the boost as it is coming in allowing you to feather the boost in mid-corner. With a bit of well practiced and deft throttle control you can bring the boost in gently so it doesn't upset the balance of the car.

 

[appletonn]

Scott, I agree that the turbo lag just requires you to adapt your driving style and plan ahead, which we should be doing anyway [], but I would still say that it is easier to modulate the power delivery in a N/A car such as the S2 as the power and torque arrives in a more linear fashion and especially in the wet, the Turbo could catch out the unwary[&:]

Both great handling cars, just with very different power deliveries.[]

 

[DivineE]

On a very twisty road I think I would prefer to be in the 944 S2 over a turbo. Truth be told I'd actually have the 2.5 lux 8v because its so much easier to drive you don't have to think to drive it on the edge and it makes a good noise (with a sports exhaust). Overall though you cannot escape the lack of pace in the n/a 944's compared to modern machinery and I quickly tired of being chased by rep mobiles like 325's and failing to lose them. A modified turbo (especially with a little extra capacity which really helps smooth out the power delivery) has that wonderful cheeky grin syndrome where you just know the explosive capacity under your right foot and sit in waiting for the right moment to unleash the power and launch off toward the horizon leaving said rep mobile wondering what the hell happened as you vanish off into the distance. I LOVE that feeling! Most recently when I was overtaken on a country lane by the new Jag XF 4.2 V8.. my partner complained she got whip lash as I floored the throttle in 3rd so hard he looked like he'd hit a wall as I passed him. Soo soo good!

Regards,

Ben

 

[James_G]

ORIGINAL: 333pg333

If you're an accountant who wants to be a bit daring get the S2. If you want to live a little, get the turbo. Spending some money on it to upgrade certain things is a given and therefore I consider it a 'real world' comparison. There's not much that you can do with an S2 except count all the extra money in your bank account.[]

I have to agree with this one, but with the extra money I saved from not buying a Turbo I am spending on driver tuition and track days, which with any luck will make me quite a bit faster. Whether that will make me faster round a track than a Turbo and it's non trained driver - well, only time will tell.

 

[appletonn]

ORIGINAL: James_G

ORIGINAL: 333pg333

If you're an accountant who wants to be a bit daring get the S2. If you want to live a little, get the turbo. Spending some money on it to upgrade certain things is a given and therefore I consider it a 'real world' comparison. There's not much that you can do with an S2 except count all the extra money in your bank account.[]

I have to agree with this one, but with the extra money I saved from not buying a Turbo I am spending on driver tuition and track days, which with any luck will make me quite a bit faster. Whether that will make me faster round a track than a Turbo and it's non trained driver - well, only time will tell.

Well, you'll certainly have loads of fun finding out![]

 

[333pg333]

You don't have to be trained to be fast but I'm guessing that it is going to help 90%+ of people to get some seat time v's more hp. I remember the first time I saw an open wheeler car change up to 3rd gear through a corner instead of leaving it in 2nd. Obviously this had a LOT to do with traction and driver talent but it opened my eyes and showed just how much more corner speed you could carry by knowing a few more things and diving in so to speak.
As for turbo v's S2 in twisties, I'll take my car against the S2 thanks all the same.[]

 

[TK2015]

ORIGINAL: appletonn

Scott, I agree that the turbo lag just requires you to adapt your driving style and plan ahead, which we should be doing anyway [], but I would still say that it is easier to modulate the power delivery in a N/A car such as the S2 as the power and torque arrives in a more linear fashion and especially in the wet, the Turbo could catch out the unwary[&:]

Or even in the dry []

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh-2-7OA4Rk

 

[DivineE]

^^^ Not how to drive a turbo! let it get totally off boost mid bend then floor it from low revs out of the bend??! Well yes if you want to exit sideways but seriously what was he expecting?

Regards,

Ben

 

[Hilux]

Hilux I suspect your car is chipped because having owned both an S2 and a 250T the power delivery is there from 2k with the S2 and Morris description is spot on.

I dont mean to argue one car over the other, far from it. Simply add to the discussion.

My car is not chipped, at least I dont believe it is as it only puts out the factory figures. I consider most people do not consider the longer 5th gear ratio in a 250 turbo either.

 

[sawood12]

ORIGINAL: TK

ORIGINAL: appletonn

Scott, I agree that the turbo lag just requires you to adapt your driving style and plan ahead, which we should be doing anyway [], but I would still say that it is easier to modulate the power delivery in a N/A car such as the S2 as the power and torque arrives in a more linear fashion and especially in the wet, the Turbo could catch out the unwary[&:]

Or even in the dry []


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh-2-7OA4Rk

He was just about breaking every rule in the book of 'How to drive a rear wheel drive car'. The most valuable lesson i've leaned so far about drivng a RWD car, especially when you are on a spirited drive, is alway to drive the car round the bend - that means get all your braking and downshifting over and done with before you turn in, then get on the throttle and feather it as you drive round the bend. The last thing you do is to turn in on a bend with your foot off the throttle - and even worse than that, enter the bend with your foot off the throttle then apply throttle mid corner - or enter the bend with the foot on the throttle and lift off mid bend. These cars need balancing on the throttle round a bend (and that goes for the N/A cars too). It's old school, but it's part of what makes these cars so compelling to drive.

I agree with the comment before about driving the car though - all the HP in the world is not going to make you the best driver in the world and the really fast guys on track days are not the guys in the fastest or most powerful cars, but the guys who know how to drive them. However for me it is about fun as well and there is something appealing and satisfying about modifying a car - making your own stamp on the car - and just enjoying it. I don't see the appeal in driving a stripped out Fiesta track slag - i'd much rather be in my 944.

 

[333pg333]

Well there is trail braking, suspension and tyre combo, + driver experience to be considered too. That said, he got caught out nicely on that clip didn't he?

 

[Diver944]

I think he was trying to get the tail out on purpose and just got it completely wrong. He floored it well before the car was straight and was dialling in the opposite lock quite early so I think he was prepared........just not enough []

 

[TK2015]

I put the clip up to show what happens when you get it wrong. I was, indeed, trying to get the tail out - but c*&ked it up spectacularly [].

The reason that I attend track days (and take all the tuition going) is that it allows me to try different things out with minimal risk of damage or injury, i.e. what happens if...

Be warned, more c*&kups likely at Bruntigthorpe on 26th []

Anyway, I'm glad that the clip's providing a good level of amusement !

 

[Diver944]

You'll have even more room at Bruntingthorpe, just don't hit the jumbo jet on the infield []

Rockingham doesn't seem to have much runoff before you get to the barriers, but at least that hairpin is pretty slow and wide. It would look pretty cool to drift right round it but I know I haven't got the talent [&o]