My New Race Car

[Jamie Summers]

A little O/T, but I've decided to take the plunge and do some racing next year in theTrackday Trophy series with Will Norman, so we've just bought this original 1991 Clio Cup racer.
We had a gentle first run out at Brands last week, and it's a great fun revvy little thing. Clearly lacks Porsche grunt, but hangs on in the corners like a limpit ! It's currently at about 150bhp and should be c.850kg, and the plan is to see if we can liberate a few more ponies which will make it pretty pokey on a power to weight basis. The car hasn't run competitively since the mid 90s, so needs a certain amount of work to pass scrutineering, but it should be a fun project ! What do you think ?????

 

[oldtimer]

Does this mean that you and the 964RS are retired from Track days next year ?
Reference the Clio , a few years ago ( 2008 I think ) I was at Spa and one of my senior daughters ex boyfriends turned up with a hired ( from Nurburgring ) hot Clio , ?172 hp , in place of his 996RS. He took me out for a passenger ride and we got stuck behind Vic in his bluto 993GT2.....Vic just would not let us pass , everytime he blocked in corners then booted the turbo at the corner exits only for us to catch him again in next set of twisties. We were not on slicks , we had ballast (me) , so it was pretty impressive performance from the Clio. I'm sure Vic remembers []

 

[PhilRS]

Had a similar experience years ago when I could not shake a Clio Cup and then a Mini Cup at Spa. I also watched a Lupo Cup race at Spa. These guys were mad and sooo fast. Shows you how dated our chassis are.

 

[h_____]

Excellent!!! More people on the slippery slope......

Looks like a lovely little car. I bet its a real hoot to drive. Whats the MSV format for TDT next year? A few more pictures please. Will it be competitive in the series do you think?

 

[Hacki]

Had my Clio experience in Oschersleben 2006 - fast cars for sure and it looked like a lot of fun.

Enjoy and def. a great way of (prob) affordable racing.


Rgds,

Hacki

 

[Melv]

Yay!![]

 

[Jamie Summers]

Don't really know too much about the car yet, but having jumped straight in it we were running c.62.5 secs around Brands Indy (just counting elephants, of course, no timing !!!). Bear in mind that I could barely reach the wheel and pedals (seat fixed in position), the car has not had a setup in who knows how long, we were on road Toyos, had no idea how sound the brakes were, and have limited FWD track experience, I don't think that was a bad start ! I would expect that with some R888s, a set up, proper seating position and a bit more wheel-time we'll get that down to 57-58 secs which would put us squarly mid-field going by this season's qualifying and race lap times.
It is certainly not as quick as the current Clio Cup car, but that has the advantage of 200+bhp, a sequential box and slicks ! I hope we can get up to 180bhp, but will be on R888s and standard 5 speed box - nevertheless, I expect it would take a well driven 911 to pull away round a twisty circuit like Brands. At Silverstone or Snetterton there wouldn't be much contest !
Not 100% sure on the TDT format for next season, but it should be 5 or 6 rounds at the MSV circuits. 30 mins qualifying followed by a 45 minute race with compulsory 2.5 min pit stop (two driver team). The classes are run on power (measured at the wheels) to weight, with a max of 200bhp/tonne. I suspect we will be in the 3rd of 4 classes, but hopefully competitive within it.
Need to get my ARDS test done and make sure the car is up to current MSA standards, which will take a bit of work. It's certainly no garage queen, it has seen plenty of action with all sorts of scars and dings to show for it, but all four wheels are pointing in vaguely the same direction, and as a genuine factory racecar it should have some provenance, and provide a good platform to build on. It's a lot of fun to drive, and insanely quick through the corners. It will take a while to get to grips with the correct driving technique which, if in a 911, would see you stuffed in a barrier somewhere - you really need to drive it like a hooligan !
This won't be the end of trackdays in the RS, but I suspect they may become a bit fewer and further between - I certainly plan to do the Oulton RS day.
That's the only decent pic I've got for now, but I'll update as we get the car up to scratch ......

Jamie

 

[pauldishman]

Raced against a few Clios when they joined the Super Coupe Cup in the 90's. Mark Fish used to run them, he may be worth contacting to see if he's got any bits left. I've never seen yours though Jamie, I'd have remembered it as its a similar colour to my old Polo G40[&:]

 

[Jamie Summers]

Was thinking of using Mark Fish - he is still operating and based in Harlow, Essex, so reasonably nearby. He seems to have run quite a lot of early 90s Cups, so should know what he's doing. The TDT regs allow us to go way beyond the spec allowed for the Cup series, so we can look at coilovers, big brakes, more power, solid bushes etc etc which could make for a pretty darn fast car !
I've seen some Youtube footage of the early 90s series, and it's a wonder that there are any cars left with four wheels given the amount of contact and smashes. Worryingly they seem to roll rather easily ........... I've yet to spot my car, but I don't know what livery it raced in, or even if the body colour is original. I've got a fair bit of detective work to do. It would be nice if we could fully re-create the original racing livery, and find out who raced it and how well it did. I suspect Renaultsport might be able to help out a bit if we give them the chassis number.

Jamie

 

[martin964]

sounds like a fun 2012!! look forward to seeing some pics and hearing about how you do in TDT.

 

[h_____]

Great update Jamie, sounds like a good journey you are about to embark on. The 2 driver format should be good, it makes it a lot of fun. We've been doing that in the CSCC this year, and its worked out well, making it sociable and a bit more fun. Despite being very cheap, its provided as much fun as the more series sprint race in the proper car. Sounds like the class structure ensures they make it easy for you to have something to aim for, which is important.

As always keep us posted, I'll be interested to see how you get on.

 

[blaine54]

Jamie,

I've been doing the TDT for a couple of years now. I've had to move over to the team trophy as I've lost the novice cross, but it's been a great learning experience and I've made some good friends on the way. Clio 172's have been a weapon of choice for many, although clio cup cars have been creeping in and to be fair the original concept of track day car/come race car has been lost a little. A very diverse mix of cars and I've raced in an XJS, MGZ and my mark II golf, there's a few 944's a 993 and everything in between.
There's battles all the way down the field and most importantly, very little contact probably as it's a series and most have a track day background (so maybe a bit more mindfull of others). We've the last team trophy race of the year this Saturday at Brands (there will be loads of TDT graduates in there), so if anyone wants to have a look and a chat I'll be in Golf no.54.

This might be of interest as well http://www.clubmsv.co.uk/car-home/club-racing-school.aspx

Neal[]

 

[Jamie Summers]

Thanks Neal,
I was planning on taking the car along to Brands on Saturday to see if I can persuade the scrutineers to take a look at it, to give us some idea of what will need to be done to the car to make it compliant with the regs.
I know what you mean about the ethos of the series having been lost, which is a surprise since it is only 2 seasons old. There looks to be a lot of very quick and well developed metal in the higher classes ! Although my car is technically a factory race car, I don't think it is beyond the spirit of the series, given that it is little more than a 1.8 16v Clio with a rollcage ....... We intend to run it on a very tight budget and will try not to get into an arms race to make it a Class A car !
The racing school thing looks interesting ..........

Jamie

 

[blaine54]

Jamie,

Come and say hello and I'll introduce you to the guys from Bubble and Kick who support the series with tech support. I'm sure they'll be happy to give it a once over []. To be honest the class structure means you get to race against like for like. So if people want to blow a huge budget on a sequential box race car they can, but I do wonder why the bother as they don't really race with anyone. There's a lot more competition mid pack and for me a lot more fun! MSV have been really helpful through the whole process and the race experience days seem to be an extension of the lessons learnt from us lot. One thing I would highly recommend is a test day as race rules apply and you can try out those racing lines and get a feel for overtaking under braking

Hopefully see you Saturday, I think we're on at 12

oh and as for budget...4.5k for the car, another 1.5k for ARDS and gear in year one and then probably no more than 1.5k each per year so pretty cheap motor racing. We've raced at Brands, Outlon, Cadwell, Donnington, Anglesy and Snett and there's talk of Silverstone so some nice circuits as well.

 

[MarkK]

Best of luck with your racing[]

 

[Jamie Summers]

Neal,
Not quite sure of my timing on Saturday, but unfortunately there's no way I'll make it for 12pm (I assume that is qualifying with the race later ??). Either way I'll look out for you.........
Budget-wise those are more or less the sort of numbers I'd come up with, though can easily see myself getting a bit carried away and spending more !

Jamie

 

[blaine54]

here's the time table

http://www.msvracing.co.uk/media/48868/timetable%2012%20nov%20issue%20two.pdf

I might go out in the tin tops as well, so I'll be around all day

Mark you racing in the club champs again next year?

 

[jon.b]

Neal,. I expect you have been in the same category as my mate's red Ford Puma which has run in past 2 seasons of the TDT? Simon has built that up for roughly £6k, I think the car cost under a grand.
I don't think he'll be running this weekend as he broke his ankle recently.
Jon

 

[DSCBoy]

I raced with Mark Fish in 1997-2000 in R5 Turbos and then Clios... great guy, as honest as the day is long which is massively rare in this business. Can't recommend him highly enough. Builds a safe car and will run it on a shoestring.
Never run a 16v Clio like yours though so can't help with driving tips, but loved the 2000 Clio car... great memories.

 

[vic cohen]

if i d known it was u i d have done far worse !

Best of luck with the Renault Jammie