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Paint your car for 70 quid pro style !

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i've been thinking of repainting my car, so went a few places, and all I got was, oh.. is it worth it, your looking at 2000£... I paid 600 for the Lux...

so I searched around the internet and found this, for a budget of 50$ say 70 £ as everything is more expensive in uk, click on 50$ paint job, the corvair:
http://www.rickwrench.com/

if your sceptic, look at his pics and look at the orange Charger.

I thought I'd share this golden information with you lot


pjb

( 944 lux to be repainted ! )

 
My neighbour's a professional painter working for BMW Doncaster..paid ~£800 for a full re-spray in july..i were around to help him as well but have a look at the car.. http://pistonheads.com/sales/265811.htm
or check out my albums at www.axl.zoomshare.com ("1985 Sapphire Metallic 944 Lux 8V" and "Prepearing For Silverstone")

If you think she looks nice e-mail me or give me a ring on 07871457258..maybe i can sort that..
 


thanks , nice job but have u seen rick's cars ? 70 quid not 800 [:D]

thanks for the offer though

pjb

window is great, !
 
As with everything in life you are not necessarily paying for a few tins of paint, you are paying for the skill of the painter. In a £2k respray the cost of the materials is a small percentage of the total cost, it's the time taken to strip the car down and do all the prep work. If you are a skilled spayer you might be able to do the job yourself and get good results, however the environment is also a key factor. A decent spray booth needs to be clean and free from dust and airborne particles that can settle in the paint. A chap at work used to be a painter and he converted his garage to a spray booth. It cost him alot as he used proper extractors that ensure the air in the garage is of a clean enough standard. I suppose for the sake of £70 you can always have a go and see what results you get.

You can reduce the £2k costs considerably if you strip the car down and prep the body yourself, then once resprayed put all the bits and pieces on again. You could probably get the cost down to under £1k.
 

ermm, i did expect a more positive response here...

this guy is in a lot of forums, and his technique is describe from A to Z, and he shares it with every1 free, which these days is pretty honest and respectable. Other people have done it, and I must say, the result is, well the photos talk for themselves. let see the bright side. I enjoy every minute I spend fixing things on my car, that's part of the joy ( everytime I can do it myself which isn't all the time...)

you should read his post, here it is:

guys all i have to tell you is that i first painted a 85 honda crx at my cottage in 1 day, i had no money, i did like 3 coats with no sanding and it looked great, i should scan that old pic and show you!!!. The job only looks as good as the time and effort that you put into it. the paint is extreemly durable, think about it, it's used to paint over rusted metal on things like tractors, metal railings, ect... and stand the elements. it is formulated to do just that. the tequnique is critical, u have to have a "feel" for how much to thin the paint and u have to use mineral spirits, not paint thinner like varsol. I could not even imagine how well it would turn out if you sprayed it with a HVLP gun and wet sanded and polished. It does "self Level" on the sides just as it does on the flat level surfaces. Like i said before it is critical on how you thin the paint and how you apply it. i did the charger in about 3 days. i got sick of going to body shops and them telling me either they don't do classic cars and if they did want to do the car i need at least $5000 even though the car was stripped and prepped!!!! the auto painting industry is in my opinion a total rip off so if you want it done right and cheep, do it yourself!!! when the paint is thinned your barley putting on any paint with each coat, so you really need to do about 6 coats to get enough of a base so you can wet sand and polish. it took me a long time to figure out what steps to take to get awesome results. my 74 bug looks awesome even after 6 years the paint is still mint. looks like the day i did it. that paint dries FAST, so literally you can wetsand overnight. Keep in mind i know a little about painting, i've shoot a few cars with single stage enamel with professional results, but it's expensive and tedious. I used duplicolor paint, primer, reducer and primer sealer on this car:
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC00194.jpg
it looked like this before paint:
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/Picture1.jpg
that car was painted midnight metalic blue, and flips awesome in the sun. a very hard color to do cause it's almost black and shows every imperfection. but as you can see in the pic it came out awesome. but the materials alone (paint, reducer, primer, primer sealer) cost about $250 CDN, which was alot, never mind the work.
the "tremclad" paint is really a awesome alternetive, since your rollering it on there's no dust and you get a really clean paint job if you do it in your garage, where if you spray theres a battle with dust.
when i painted with the Tremclad i just use the paint, no primer, nothing, just the paint, right over bondo. like i mentioned before after wetsanding use a random orbit polisher and the cheapest POLISHING COMPOUND made by turtle wax, it comes in a paste in a small round flat container and it's white, allmost looks like hand cream and smells good too!!! I find that after thinning the paint with mineral spirits the paint "flashes" or dries really quickly, and after a overnight period it is completely dry, unlike automotive paint which takes up to 6 months to fully "cure" so litterally the next day you can sand, buff, polish, and wax the paint. on the charger the paint looks really good, i did not take a huge amount of time to perfect it because i really really wanted to drive it!!!. in the spring i plan on wetsanding and polishing it more, but yes it looks like the pics, really good. considering that it cost me about $50 i love it and i'm not paranoid about juicing it on a dirt road and going sideways worring about my precious paint job, i drive the car, hard and alot, after all is'nt that what they're made for? for $50 and a few days of work i can paint it again in a few years!!!! If your not good with your hands, and not a real detail person let someone else paint your car cause it can get ugly really fast!!!! if i had a shop, made a little paint booth and sprayed this stuff on and wetsanded and polished it, i'm sure i could paint show quality cars with $30 worth of paint. keep in mind this paint is really good, like i said bofore i bought a can 3 yrs later to repaint a fender on my 74 beatle and it was dead on for color match, that must tell you about the quality of the paint, i'd give you $100 if you could tell me which fender i painted on this car in person, and its' right out of the can:
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC00164.jpg
keep in mind that you must still prep the car as you would with any other paint job, prepping is all the work and reflects the overall result.
i did not block sand the car just wetsand progressivly finer paper by HAND, no machine, no block nothing. using any "block" to sand i found the paper got dirty fast and got all plugged up, so do it by hand and keep it really wet, using a spray bottle in one hand and a clean bucket of water and a shammy (dollar store!!!)to clean it off to see how it looks. i prepped the car with 80, then 100, then 200, finished with a 400, did all my body work, and painted. after 2 coats (about 4hrs work for the whole car) i wetsanded with a 600, then did 2 more coats, wetsand with 800, 2 more coats and sand with a 1000-1500 and polish, followed by wax, done......

enjoy
 
Now what ! ? [:D]
respect to this guy for sharing his experince for free, lots of guys would sell that on a silly dvd tutorial on ebay ...

pjb
 
here's a few pics of the charger done:
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC02764.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d13/69martin/DSC02769.jpg


ps: unfortunately, in this world, you don't always pay for what you get, it's about monopoly, . But that's a different debate.

No paint job is worth what they charge, they need extractors ,light, ovens because their paint takes too long to dry and to cure ( months sometimes ), as rick explains, that paint dries quick, its long lasting, it protects from rust and no need for primers ( but MUST be thinned with MINERAL solvents. I mean it's used on caterpillar tractors etc , just read his thread. As the guy explains if it was sold under the appelation automotive paint, it wouldn't cost £3.99... )

peace


 
Its true that the cost is to some extent is in the time spent and paying for the oven etc. My brother started as a sprayer then moved to body work repairs then he became a mechanic. Most of his friends did the same things and yes you can spray your car in your garage at home, one of his mates even sprayed two pack at home on a mini. I remember seeing him coughing up blood because he didn't have a respirator system there (it was his house garage after all).

Consider for example my brother telling me that he may use 60 litres of paints to respray a car i.e. full respray not a blow over. Just the cost of 60 litres of paint materials is going to be a lot of wonga especially for some wacky flip/flop or whatever paint finish like you sometimes see on hot rods or TVR's.

His mate worked for a company that specialised in things like restoring Aston Martins and yes that would be a 3 grand job (15 years ago !) but you get 3 grands worth of paint job with a back to metal respray with practically everything removed from the vehicle and then refitted. My brother and his mate reshelled a mini for a friend but even on a mini that was well over 100 hours labour, on a car my brother knows backwards.

I have to admit I am going to study what this guy does though and pass on the details to my bro, it looks genuinely interesting.
 


bio colour is odorless and outdoor painting resolves the fume problem and all sorts of poisoning

and this rick guy painted his cars on his drive, he even shows on a photo how he sands out bugs from a door LOL did you see the quality of the finish of the black beetle ? thhe corvair is pretty cool ( the paint, not the car lol )

pjb
 
Fair play, the paint job on the corvair does look very,very good.
Is the "rustoleum" paint similar to smooth Hammerite?
 
I don't think anyone is being overly pessamistic here, just making sure we debate the potential pitfall, pro's and cons of something new and untried by anyone on the forum, that is afterall the point of a forum like this. Even though Rick seems to have got fantastic results I don't think anyone is suddenly going to hack into their pride and joy with wet and dry before applying paint with a roller without spending alot of time understanding what the process entails. He does afteral comment on his website that the long term longevity of this product is unknown - even moreso when driven through a British winter with salt on the roads. I still have reservations about painting your car in the open air on your drive. This is the damp UK and not sunny dry California and moisture is the number 1 consideration of any half decent bodyshop. I'm sure if you take the plunge yourself and the results are spectacular then you may have discovered a fantastic new process and others will follow your lead. Keep us posted if you do decide to give it a try.
 
As a craftsman myself (a joiner in my case) it does frustrate me when untrained people dive in to practical projects with the attitude "That's easy, I could do that." A craftsman will make a job look easy because he knows what he is doing.

Many of us, I am sure, have undertaken practical projects that we have no formal training in. Results are often variable (not in my case [;)]) but the jobs often aren't time critical. If it goes wrong we can do it again. That isn't possible commercially.

Paint shops don't spend £1,000s on extraction, filters, air line dryers and interceptors, drying areas, baking facilities and 1001 other things just to up the bill. They do it because the only way to get a good consistent finish is with all that stuff and with skilled operatives doing the job. Aston Martin spend as long in man hours spraying their cars as they do assembling them, and they won't trust the job to robots. I've done a bit of spraying myself, and paid for a good number of spray jobs, and can appreciate the art of a true craftsman. When you see some of the poor results achieved with all of the kit listed above what is the chance of a top notch result without?

Painting can often produce reasonable short term results if you spend time between coats denibing and buffing out runs, impurities and other inclusions. (That is assuming you can get an even coating and don't end up with stripes). But if you are going to spend hours with wet'n'dry why bother spraying? You might as well put the paint on with a brush or roller.

However, paint is funny stuff. What looks great after two weeks can look a complete dogs dinner in 18 months when the paint finally hardens and shrinks back. It is strange how orange peel seems to grow after a period of time and previously invisible sanding marks grin through the paint.

We have all used spray cans to touch in a scratch/rust spot/filled dent at some time. The finished job looks great.....at the time.

IMHO a car sprayed on a drive is going to look like a car sprayed on a drive - maybe not immediately but give it six months.

The above doesn't necessarily mean when undertaken by the likes of Chips Away. These guys are trained professionals doing the job day in day out but.......they also use a special medium which behaves differently to the paint you and I might use.
 
Hadn't looked at the guys site previously - I think I mentioned a roller above. [:D] I love the 3D shots BTW

It strikes me there has been an awful lot of buffing subsequent to the paint job - perhaps as indicated in the white starting to grin through the blue on crest of the bonnet central ridge.

And white hides a multitude of sins.
 
From what my brother tells me the biggest problem doing DIY spray jobs in reality is going to be dust. This makes spraying outside an absolute no no, coupled with the fact that even the tiniest amount of wind is going to mess things up. His mate sprayed a couple of cars at home but first he started by jet washing the garage and then painting the floors, ceiling walls everything to get the place spotless. Even then ISTR he still had problems which meant rework.

If it is in the summer time then the heat on the garage could provide enough of a bake I guess, I certainly don't recall my brother or his mates doing any 'at home' spray jobs in the winter.
 

ORIGINAL: John Sims


However, paint is funny stuff.  What looks great after two weeks can look a complete dogs dinner in 18 months when the paint finally hardens and shrinks back.  It is strange how orange peel seems to grow after a period of time and previously invisible sanding marks grin through the paint.

Just look at practically any 6 month old BMW, they seem to develop horrific orange peel.
 
I can speak from experience and say a really good top quality paint job can be done in a home garage. I have painted my car in the garage and acheived top results. It all boils down to quality of products used and the prep work done before hand.I used Sikkens 2 pack paint products and 3M finishing system i.e. compounds/polishes etc. Let me say also, you will NEVER see a show winning paint job come straight from the gun. The gun, by its nature, will produce a shiny coat of paint but it WILL leave an orange peel effect in the paint. To go beyond this and bring the paint finish to a much higher level it must be wet sanded back and polished out, thats where the real magic happens and the paint becomes super smooth and glass like.

Contrary to what others may think on this forum, a poorly executed/finished paint job will ALWAYS stand out, regardless of the colour
m11.gif
.

John Daly.

FCD338F39A4A4FA699646F09BF934C3A.jpg
 
ISTR there is or was some form of legal requirements over here to do with 2 pack paints which meant in effect it was only sold to the trade, or if you happened to be a pro and knew your local suppliers then they would just sell you the stuff anyways. I may be wrong of course.

ISTR hereing that the new water based paints are much easier to work with, less hazardous but unfortunately will not last as long, again I could be wrong again.

You are 100% spot on about the finishing be the really critical stage. My brother did a repair on me mums metallic blue VW Polo using a spray can from a local motor factors. The match is perfect the only problem is that the lacquer is new and doesn't sit quite right compared to the old lacquer on the rest of the car in his opinion, in all honesty when I looked at it the only thing noticeable is that like you say whilst shiny it isn't as flat and mirror like as the other panels because he hasn't yet borrowed me orbital polisher.
 

nothing can't be learned and mastered in repairs, my mate who's a body repairer told me that, it will just take a little longer than a pro.

Every1 told me I wouldn't be able to fix my destroyed wing... garages were asking for 500 quid, Porsche for 700 for a new wing plus labour on top: One morning, I got up, and I DID it, MYSELF ! it took me 5 hours with a hammer, a piece of wood and a shamy leather... and lots of elbow grease.


of course, all the body repair people will tell me the job isn't good enough, there a little mistake there and there, and i used the wrong tools... AT the end of the day I look at the result, not the way it was done: example

england beat us french, but they played rubbish ... result: They will probably go on and win it . ( even though Im french i'll support northern hemisphere rugby thus England ) [:(]

not only I fixed my wing and I saved 500 quid, Now Im gonna repaint the whole car, and post photos, and save 2 grand, and learn something new, extremely rewarding. I looked at photos of the black beetle rick did... faultless from the photo, and for 50 dollars. Then I ll do a website dedicated to that technic if the result is high standard, and then , everyone can do it... then i'll probably have half the country's body people trying to top me AHAHAH... oh well ( like the time i did a website about my golf 4 tdi 110bhp running on chip fat oil from my mates snack, filtered with a tshirt, car runs perfect, gave it to my parents ! and yes it worked faultless, you know the story ) ( save the planet, save your wallet )


regarding HAMMERITE, im not sure i went on rustoleum website uk, and here it's called COmbi Color. again it seems the mineral solvent solution is extremely important. ( personnaly I will stick to that when repainting Lux )

enjoy

pjb


ps: ... painting outside is a no no ... Have you seen the charger, have you seen the beetle... ? old wifes tales...like when people ask me if my 944 as a bedford engine or vw ...... [;)]

for longevity, have a look at the corvair photos afetr 1 year, and as mentioned in the thread, for that price, i'd paint may car every 3 years, and in a different color , just for the sake of it... ( now now Im getting carried away... )

ta la
 

ps: lovely job from the photo 422 bhp. !! bravo

ps2: combi color doesn't need to bake, & can be applied on prep'd body with temperatures as low as 5 celsius.
Of course if one uses a so called automotive paint, rick's technic will NOT work, as in that case, you will need an oven. Funny that, I BET you guys the people who manufacture the Ovens are the same ones that do the paint ! or the contrary... [;)]

ps3: the preparation of the body work is of Course of utmost importance.

2.5liters of that paint ( ill stop mentionning the brand, i DoNT want ppl to think i work for them ) is 22£. That will do 7 coats of paint, which is the requirement for a pro like job. Each layer will be very thin, therefor very short drying time. paint, sand, paint sand paint sand 7 times, or 6 then buff. voila !

pjb.
 

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