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PORSCHE MACAN: TELL ME I'M WRONG

daro911

PCGB Member
Member
PORSCHE MACAN: TELL ME I'M WRONG

Given the warm reception the Macan's had quite a few probably will tell Dan he's wrong


"Some factual information for you. Have you any idea how much damage that bulldozer would suffer if I just let it roll straight over you?'" asks Arthur Dent's bypass-building council nemesis in the opening to The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy.

We took the Macan where most won't - off-road"How much?" asks Dent, lying in the mud in front of said earthmover in an attempt to prevent his house being demolished.

"None at all."

Swap bulldozer for Macan and that's me lying in the mud.

What a difference a few years make, eh? Back in 2002 the arrival of the Cayenne prompted howls of anguish from horrified purists, swiftly drowned out by the ringing of cash registers. It now outsells the 911 pretty much three to one. 500m euros of investment later and, alongside the Panamera and Cayenne, Porsche has the ability to build 50,000 Macans a year at the Leipzig plant. Which looks a pretty conservative estimate.

Beauty must be in the eye of the beholder Test the water

What is the PH stance on the Macan then? I get the feeling it's surprisingly generous and will now sacrifice myself to prove what I fear may be true - I seem to be the only person in the world who has a problem with the Macan.

To be fair to the Porsche it's here copping a wider prejudice I hold against its type. I'm sorry, I just don't get it. The whole SUV/crossover thing is the gated community mindset on four wheels, and just as (oxy)moronic as it is in bricks and mortar. But I'll try not to let generalised inverted snobbery get in the way and focus the argument at a practical level.

Many have praised the Macan - our own review included - for its ability to drive ... like a normal car. So why not just drive a normal car? It's true though, Porsche has taken the uninspiring basis of the Audi Q5 to create something of real dynamic brilliance and dare I say character. The Turbo is smooth and refined on a cruise yet savage and composed enough on a spirited cross country drive to leave you reeling. That's massively impressive, likewise the numbers.

Giant clamshell bonnet cool, contents dittoBut few have asked real questions of what was needed to make the Macan handle like a Porsche. In engineering terms it required dry-sumping the engine to ... lower the centre of gravity. That's got to be one of the most gloriously absurd automotive engineering decisions ever made, right? An entirely logical solution to a totally illogical design brief, dictated by fashion and a mindset that equates elevation over other road users to a sense of self worth.

Oops, sorry, I wasn't going to get personal. Stay on target, Trent.

So you get your dry-sumped engine as standard on your Macan Turbo, ditto your variable PTM four-wheel drive and PDK gearbox. What you don't get are the active locking rear differential and torque vectoring required to make it do the really physics defying things so bewitching of roadtesters and at the heart of many a glowing review. The pointless stuff like improbable power oversteer off slithery roundabouts. Which it does and is as ridiculous (and fun) as it sounds.

Q5 genetics most obvious in profileThat's £1,012 added to your £59,300 bottom line for Porsche Torque Vectoring Plus then, to which you can add the £728 for Sport Chrono to get your Sport Plus faster shifting and additional two tenths off your 0-62 time. Standard 19-inch wheels aren't really enough either, £1,942 21-inch 911 Turbo Designs really the minimum for keeping face at the school gate. There's another one to chalk up to the lazy SUV stereotyping bingo, for anyone still keeping count.

That's an awful lot of technology and engineering dedicated to making the Macan feel like something it's not, all the for the sake of keeping up appearances. Porsche being Porsche it's largely pulled the trick off.

But not without compromises. Name the most common justifications you hear for joining the SUV/crossover clan. I'll take bets they'll include 'oh but I like the visibility and confidence you get from being up high', 'you need the suspension travel for potholes and speed bumps' and vague notions of practicality. But the Macan, like many of its type, suffers from appalling blind spots, a belt line taller than most of the common obstructions you might have to look out for when manoeuvring (bollards, benches, children, other vehicles, etc) and therefore a dependence on sensors, bleepers and (optional) cameras in the absence of actually being able to see. Generously let's call it blind confidence.

Turbo gets unique intakes to mark it outBelieve the hype

And practicality? The need to accommodate huge wheels means significant arch intrusion that robs boot space and pushes the rear bench forward, restricting rear legroom. And that fashionable roofline means a six-footer in the back of a Macan adds head against roof to knees against front seat.

The comfort over bumps question can swiftly be answered the first time 21-inch wheel encounters pothole and the spring and damper rates required to make a Q5 handle like a Macan send a shimmy through the body that'd make an old convertible blush.

Even without playing my joker of the £40K entry level Macan that carries the look - and 1,845kg weight - but is powered by a four-cylinder Golf engine I fear I'm wasting my breath. Even a cursory look underneath the Turbo reveals plenty of Audi-stamped components, proving even at this elevated level Porsche is just skilfully plundering the resources at its disposal to cash in on a profit stream it would be daft to ignore. Brand and image are king - just don't peek behind the curtain.

Abilities on the road are hard to argue withAnd that's my problem. I can admire the engineering. I can appreciate the way it drives. I'm just railing against the blind acceptance that puts material style so far ahead of function and substance. With, I fear, about as much success as Arthur Dent and his bulldozer.
 
So true-so true-though I've never driven one ,I agree entirely with the sentiment-In this house we hate "Chelsea Tractors"-here in Formby mainly driven by wives & other women for effect-some footballers (Steven Gerrard et alia only live 1/2 mins away)-& the rest probably by drug dealers[:-] And we suffer from "I'll park my huge 4 x4 next to that small Porsche deliberately left in the far corner of Tesco's carpark away from the morons so that my doors open onto it's bodywork" Trouble is -we are hypercritical here as our Daughter runs a BMW X3 -2.0D which has grown to be X5 size-mainly because she is a community Paediatrician in rambling & sometimes snowy & wet Northumberland-to my wife's dismay our Daughter drives it like her previous MG-TF
 
Just to add to my previous short question, I would suggest that without the Cayenne and Macan, Porsche is unlikely to survive from the sales of sports cars, the volume is not enough to sustain the R&D required to develop the 911, Boxster & Cayman in order to stay competitive in those market segments. 4x4s are here to stay its one of the fastest growing automotive market segments. As for inconsiderate parking it's not just drivers of 4x4s who are guilty. My Q5 was hit when just 3 weeks old and damaged by a moron in a Bentley Coupe opening his car door against mine. Unfortunately there are a lot of people irrespective of what they drive who have no consideration when it comes to parking plus of course they generally have no idea how to park [8|]
 
Adrian, One can't deny the business argument at all but despite the market forces & marketing hype,my wife & I are not persuaded to have a 4x4-although we run a BMW 530D Touring as our workhorse which I suppose is not many steps away from one & I am sold on such a vehicle for everyday use as even now there are only 2 of us,it is so useful when we go to our cottage on the IOM,or our Daughters in Northumberland where I am called on to help build a sheep shelter for example-it does however have its sports suspension set to the very minimum. However a rather different scenario to what the post above relates to & with. All of course my opinion.[8|]
 
ORIGINAL: daro911 PORSCHE MACAN: TELL ME I'M WRONG
It’s difficult since the arguments are confusing and difficult to follow. But in the interests of discussion I’ll have a go. Criticism of large investment in the Panamera and Cayenne to make a healthy profit and expanding the plant to produce the Macan? - sounds to me like a recipe for a successful business. “Ringing of cash registers”? – maybe Porsche should run as a charity and go for broke (again)! Drives like a normal car? - one of the great virtues of Porsche sports cars is that they can be driven as normal cars. Based on another car? - skipping the well rehearsed VW type 1/356 and the 914/24 arguments, the current & previous Boxsters variants largely share the underpinnings with their 911 big brothers. Don’t like the look of it? - as you said it a personal preference, so what’s to be gained by forcefully telling folks who like/buy them that their cars are ugly? (Oxy) moronic? – ironic is a better choice, it’s more precise and less insulting. Not sure about school gates, inverted snobbery and the SUV/crossover clan comments but it looks like an unfounded criticism of possible users/owners that could just as easily, in the appropriate context, be applied to owners of “fancy” sports cars! You think that you’re the only person to have a problem with a Macan? - infinitely improbable ;). A Porsche with Audi/VW genetics? - you can’t be serious! Dry sump? – what’s wrong with a dry sump to reduce oil surge on a performance SUV with a high COG? Expensive extras that you expect to find as standard and ridiculous wheel options? – hardly a specific criticism for any Porsche. You find it fun to get “improbable power oversteer off slithery roundabouts” and complain about it! Blind spots – I assume that you have driven a Boxster variant with the roof up/down ;). Compromises, practicality, rear seat space & roofline? - no more so than any other Porsche. Take the 911, rear engine, large wheels and intruding wheel arches, how many compromises would you like to juggle? The 911 rear seats are very practical and the roofline makes sitting & getting into them very easy ;). Non-Porsche parts? - last time I looked, the current 981/991 was littered with non-Porsche parts. Is that a bad thing? On the positive side, despite complaining of its inability to cope with rough on-road conditions and fast exits from roundabouts, you appear to appreciate the way a Macan drives, think that its abilities on the road are hard to argue with, report that it’s composed enough, on a spirited cross country drive, to leave you reeling and that somehow it exhibits “real dynamic brilliance”. So what are you really saying? That the Macan is a compromise and shares some of the failings of other Porsches but is really quite a good stab at a general purpose or SUV type of vehicle? This seems to be something most could agree with and argue about. That you don’t like SUVs and the people that drive them is more difficult to deal with. SUVs are inanimate and are owned and driven by a wide variety and large number of people. That you find SUVs a problem/asset/lifestyle choice may depend on where you live (and park) but condemning their owners/drivers seems a little extreme. That the introduction of general purpose SUV type of vehicles into the Porsche clan is the end of the marque as we know it, confounded with claims that it is not a proper Porsche and that is a derivative/part box special from the VW/Audi clan are simply a lack of appreciation of Porsche’s history and heritage. Do you really think that parts bin stuff and shared components with VW/Audi are serious criticisms’ of a Porsche? With regards the SUV as an inappropriate vehicle within the Porsche range, how about Ferdinand and Ferry Porsche’s design and development of the archetypical general purpose vehicle in the form of type 82 (aka the Kubelwagen). Some variants were even half-tracked, that’s half a bulldozer for the uninitiated ;)[link=http://web.archive.org/web/20090730170305/http://geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/1167/evwtrack.html] Look here [/link] for an historical overview. Note the rather grainy picture of Ferry Porsche driving a half track and the acknowledgements to the Porsche archive. For those of a more technical bent [link=https://archive.org/details/TechnicalManualTmE9-803GermanVolkswagen]look here[/link] for a detailed breakdown of a type 82. Note the novel use, at the time, of the limited slip differential, that I think, was derived from the Porsche link with the pre-war racing Auto Unions (aka Audi). You could, I suspect, even weave a link via the type 182, 183, a winner of the Paris Dakar Rally, the development of the Audi Quattro drive and the present day SUV variants. Whilst I don’t own/drive either a Cayenne or Macan, take it or leave it I think that they are both proper Porsches. What was the question? FBR
 
That is an excellent response to the original article. Why don't you post it on Pistonheads as I'm sure a considered piece would lift the level of the usual dross http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1420218&mid=197575&i=120&nmt=RE%3A+Porsche+Macan%3A+Tell+Me+I%27m+Wrong&mid=197575
 
The trouble with Macan is that Porsche have hyped it up to be a sports car, in fact almost a 911! For heavens sake it is just a 4x4 estate car, albeit a jolly good one.
 
ORIGINAL: pwebb That is an excellent response to the original article. Why don't you post it on Pistonheads as I'm sure a considered piece would lift the level of the usual dross
Paul, thanks for the compliment and the link. I don’t subscribe to Pistonheads and rarely visit. I assumed the comments were posted by daro911 rather than an article penned by Dan Trent - aka daro911? The threads look too much like a bun fights for my taste but help yourself, unless daro911 really isn't Dan Trent and feels up to the challenge ;). FBR
 
Daro911 is our resident media watch guru and keeps us up to date with stories - sometimes before they've even happened [:D] I won't post your words on my PH account as they'll think I'm more intelligent than I actually am. Peter
 
ORIGINAL: dereksharpuk The trouble with Macan is that Porsche have hyped it up to be a sports car, in fact almost a 911! For heavens sake it is just a 4x4 estate car, albeit a jolly good one.
.. and you've now damned it with faint praise - I'm definitely not buying one ;). I've just noticed what happened to your very lovely 981?
ORIGINAL: rob.kellock I did say...
Sorry, you must excuse me, in my dotage I assumed that daro911 had penned the original missive on Pistonheads and re-posted it here but I failed to comprehend difference between an article and a forum thread. Thanks, I now understand. FBR PS Small edit, it was my miscomprehension not daro911's. Flat6 nice to "see" you, pleased you are enjoying the loud pedal, motorway flashers are not a problem up here ;).
 
When you have a company that has a history of consistent and high quality marketing, then it should be no surprise that the myriad of products in the range are stacked in the way they are. It's no secret that the direction of the business is not driven by the engineers but by the marketeers. Since the late eighties onwards there has been a pretty standard look and feel to the advertising, which has now crossed over to the digital media, and relies on a steady stream of new cars to give to the media to test and back up with advertising and PR. If the next Cayman came out with more power and performance than a base 911 the media would be over it like a rash and the game would be over for the 911. So each model is carefully positioned to suit the sales and marketing boys, not to stretch the capabilities of each line as soon as possible. The Macan is interesting as it is positioned as more performance biased than the Cayenne, but again, the engines are carefully calibrated to make the next rung up the ladder look attractive and to leave room for more options in the future.
 
ORIGINAL: pwebb Daro911 is our resident media watch guru and keeps us up to date with stories - sometimes before they've even happened [:D] Peter
Peter is correct I am merely the carrier of a message for others to ponder yonder and do what they will with it ... bit like the interesting views expressed here in a very reasonable and user friendly fashion unlike other forums [;)]
 
One can therefore imagine the perplexed minds in Porsche's engine design dept as they struggle over this proposed new engine range of 4,6,& 8 cylinder boxer engines-mind you nothing's new is it-my 1st experience in a our 1st family car way back in the late forties was in a Jowett Bradford van powered by a 2 cylinder boxer engine-0-60 in/well I don't think you could wait that long-after Uni,one of my friends had a Jowett Javelin with a 4 cylinder boxer engine-that was pretty quick for it's day but the 2 of us were always stripping the sandcast aluminium engine down & rebuilding it-everything warped all the time![&o]
 
Firstly I don't think Porsche *have* to be making the Cayenne or Macan in order to "survive" - they still make many more sports cars than they ever did. Instead I think they are setting higher and higher production targets and have simply found that a bit of badge-engineering (ok, in this case it's a bit more than that) turns out to be highly profitable and will therefore keep doing it regardless of what the sports car drivers think. Incidentally I have recently found myself - for the first time - looking at Chelsea Tractors, specifically the Discovery 4. Not because I have a kid to take to school (which something like a Fiat 500 would to totally adequately) but as a tow car for my Porsche race car! I understand it can tow 3.5 tonnes! Chris.
 

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