Smokey Joe

[DaveyB]

I'll drain off a bit tonight,and save it to top up (due to the cost of mobil one ), and see how it goes. I'd much rather do the front discs this weekend than the AOS.!!

Thankyou

 

[DaveyB]

Drained off a litre by accident, dropped the sump plug, and I put back just over half a litre. So in reality I removed just under 1/2 a litre of oil. It showed one bar less than full on the electronic guage. I went for a very spirited drive (what a fantastic car).

This morning, started the car and .....


No smoke at all. Yippee!!!

So I can only assume the technician at Harston typed in the wrong values when setting up the oil fill at service. Just hope I have haven't damaged any seals or the CATs with this issue. The chain tension nut looks very oily at the moment.

But still, it looks like I can spend the AOS money on wheel refurbishment.[][][]

 

[DaveyB]

still getting a largish puff of smoke at start up now and again (everyother morning). I know peope,have said it happens. But can I do anything to reduce it? Coud it be an AOS on the way out, but not one that had failed.

I sorted the mega cloud because of over filling, but this smokey start up I don't like.

[]

 

[sulzeruk]

What grade of oil are you using and what are the miles on the car?
Alasdair

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

Can I assume the large clouds have gone completely, and it is a puff of blue smoke you are now getting?

What are the circumstances in which you last use the car before parking it up overnight? For example, I know that if I reverse my car out the garage, wash it, and put it back in, I can almost guarantee a puff of blue smoke the following morning. If, for example, you pull your car up to the garage, and leave it there for an hour or two before putting it to bed for the night, you will have a similar situation.

As Alasdair is suggesting perhaps, try a 5W-40 oil rather than 0W-40. I also found that made a difference on my 50k+ miles 996 C2.

 

[DaveyB]

Yes, it normally sits on the drive after I get back from work, then I put it away in the garage later on. Maybe at the next service I'll go for the 5w-40. The car is a 52 plate Targa, and it has done 73k. On that mileage it's only just run in!

I got a puff of whiteish/bluish smoke on start up, and then after about 5 or 6 seconds the exhausts clear and no smoke is visable. I have noticed sometimes that it is one side rather than both, and it's not always the same side.

One of the best views is looking out of the wing mirror and seeing the classic 911 wheel arch, just occasionally spoilt waiting for the puff of smoke on start up.

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

Just to humour me, try putting it straight into the garage when you get home, and see if it still puffs in the morning.

 

[DaveyB]

no smoke this morning. But tonight I thrashed the car back from the next village ( 4 miles), and then put it straight in the garage so will see what it's like tomorrow morning.

 

[DaveyB]

Yippee, still not a single smokey start up. I think I will still get the odd 'Flat Six' start up, but that I can handle (just). It was the huge clouds that bothered me. I will still follow advice though and use 5w40 at the next service. Thanks for advice/support from all!

So as long as I don't get it serviced at Porsche I should be OK...

 

[DaveyB]

Couldn't sleep most of last night. My car has had quite a few smokey start-ups recently. One of them, as I left work, continued as I drove down the road for about 200yds. So it got me thinking that maybe a should replace the AOS. I did the " remove filler cap while the engine is running", and noticed that the engine revs dropped and did not idle smoothly. Is this a sign of the AOS on its way out? Normally I'd get about 2 or 3 in a row every 5 weeks, but these seem to be more often.

And how much to replace? I looked through the Renntech article, and seems a bloomin long job for a diy'er. And I have to replace the coffin arms, drop links... And I'm not sure I'll have the time for AOS as well, unless I buy another car for work.

Would it be any cheaper when having major service which is due?

Worried Dave

 

[steveoz32]

ORIGINAL: adrian996

ORIGINAL: DaveyB
I started the car and a big cloud of blue smoke came out the back.

Hi Dave. Looks like you're relatively new to the concept of flat, horizontally opposed cylinders - as opposed to the traditional straight up and down type...?

These engines have something called an oil/air separator which can sometimes cause problems if they fail. But the result of this is more like clouds of white, oil-smelling smoke.

What I think that you have here is merely what is regarded as 'normal' symptoms of the positioning of the cylinders in your engine. I always get a cloud of blue smoke when my car has been 'at rest' for a few days or weeks. Its because small amounts of the oil in your engine finds its way past the piston rings when you car is stone cold. This is mainly due to the pistons laying flat and the metals being cold and contracted. It's also arguable that the standard 0/40w Mobil 1 oil viscosity (or lack of) doesn't help here either - the stuff is like water. This small amount of oil then ends up in the combustion chamber which then mixes with the fuel that you add with your foot and........BOOOM! Puff of blue smoke out of both tail pipes on start up which then fades pretty quickly(?).

So, pretty much normal behaviour for your engine (and all other 996's/997's). Only a problem if the smoke is white, you're using oil and she looks like a steam engine when she's under acceleration / power.

I've heard a lot of people say about that, but my 996.1 with over 100k never did this no matter how long I left her for. Always a clean smoke free start up, although she did have that rattle / vibration noise for about a second on every start up no matter what the circumstances were.

 

[924nutter]

ORIGINAL: steveoz32

ORIGINAL: adrian996

ORIGINAL: DaveyB
I started the car and a big cloud of blue smoke came out the back.

Hi Dave. Looks like you're relatively new to the concept of flat, horizontally opposed cylinders - as opposed to the traditional straight up and down type...?

These engines have something called an oil/air separator which can sometimes cause problems if they fail. But the result of this is more like clouds of white, oil-smelling smoke.

What I think that you have here is merely what is regarded as 'normal' symptoms of the positioning of the cylinders in your engine. I always get a cloud of blue smoke when my car has been 'at rest' for a few days or weeks. Its because small amounts of the oil in your engine finds its way past the piston rings when you car is stone cold. This is mainly due to the pistons laying flat and the metals being cold and contracted. It's also arguable that the standard 0/40w Mobil 1 oil viscosity (or lack of) doesn't help here either - the stuff is like water. This small amount of oil then ends up in the combustion chamber which then mixes with the fuel that you add with your foot and........BOOOM! Puff of blue smoke out of both tail pipes on start up which then fades pretty quickly(?).

So, pretty much normal behaviour for your engine (and all other 996's/997's). Only a problem if the smoke is white, you're using oil and she looks like a steam engine when she's under acceleration / power.

I've heard a lot of people say about that, but my 996.1 with over 100k never did this no matter how long I left her for. Always a clean smoke free start up, although she did have that rattle / vibration noise for about a second on every start up no matter what the circumstances were.

Another factor in this random smoking, if, as has been suggested by more knowledgeable people than myself, the Air/Oil separator is not on its way out and overall the oil level is not higer that the maximum mark and the engine is in good order, the position of the piston rings on their relevant piston can contribute and is nothing to worry about or anything that can be adjusted. When I used to assemble flat four engines when working for a respected VW engine builder in Surrey we used to start off by putting the gap in the oil control ring at say 4 o'clock, the lower compression ring gap at 8 o'clock (or vice-versa) and the gap in the top ring at 12 o'clock. That way you would have to have serious volume of oil pooling in the barrel for it to be able to find its way past the rings. With the best will in the world you have to think that over time the rings would rotate around the piston and at some time line up just right, then just when you least expect it you get the smoke; then you start the engine and they move again so it can't happen. I am no expert on how much, or whether at all, the rings shuffle around the piston, but it is at least plausible. What I do know is that if you don't position the piston rings as described, the engine smokes like a bar steward when you are bedding it in.

 

[Richard_Hamilton]

ORIGINAL: DaveyB

Couldn't sleep most of last night. My car has had quite a few smokey start-ups recently. One of them, as I left work, continued as I drove down the road for about 200yds. So it got me thinking that maybe a should replace the AOS. I did the " remove filler cap while the engine is running", and noticed that the engine revs dropped and did not idle smoothly. Is this a sign of the AOS on its way out? Normally I'd get about 2 or 3 in a row every 5 weeks, but these seem to be more often.

And how much to replace? I looked through the Renntech article, and seems a bloomin long job for a diy'er. And I have to replace the coffin arms, drop links... And I'm not sure I'll have the time for AOS as well, unless I buy another car for work.

Would it be any cheaper when having major service which is due?

Worried Dave

Was it difficult to remove the oil cap - i.e. a lot of vacuum on the filler tube? if so, it could be the AOS. I'm still not clear what colour the smoke is. Blue, black, or white? Does the smoke feel oily when you put your hand next to the exhaust? Is it coming out of one exhaust, or both?

 

[DaveyB]

It's more towards white than black. I'll film it when i start it in the morning. I can then share the film. And the filler cap wasn't difficult to remove, but it did make a difference. And it's not always equal out of both exhausts.


Ahhhh, I know I'm going on, but I only have a finite budget before the Mrs hits the roof. And I need to pick a choose the jobs I can do. I am still waiting for the right time to do the coffin arms a drop links.

The plan is, roof open and a nice blast down to Reims, and retune with a couple of boxes of fizz in the front! So I need to get all the issues fixed.