Tial wastegate

[Vic Rattlehead]

Hi everyone.

Anyone on here running the 38mm (F38) Tial on their Turbos? I just snagged a good one, previously fitted to an 944T at a good price, and I'm suspecting my factory wastegate is fried.

Question is can this wastegate be run in single port mode? I'm fairly green when it comes to wastegates, but the intention is to eventually run the Tial in dual port mode along with a MBC, new exhaust and the obligatory wideband sensor.

But all these upgrades (bar the Tial) will have to wait until next year.

So can the Tial be run as a single port unit as a straight replacement for the original one? Factoring in the appropriate spring etc.

Cheers,

Russ

 

[robwright]

Yes it can just leave the top port open to atmosphere. There are digrams on Lynsey Racing. Just remember that the LR wastegate is the reverse of the Tial in terms of the ports.

 

[Vic Rattlehead]

Cheers, Rob. Thanks for the quick reply. The Tial was a steal and way cheaper than replacing like for like. Even when you factor in the adaptor plates for it.

 

[George Elliott]

Vic, I have run both in mildly modified cars. To be honest I would rate them both good units. I'd suggest you keep your original, in my experience it is fine but the propaganda would sometimes suggest the original is in some way inferior and they wear out like tyres, I don't believe it. If you are playing with the boost I would recommend a boost gauge good luck with it. George 944t

 

[Vic Rattlehead]

Thanks for the advice, George. I've already got a nice VDO boost gauge installed. It's in a lightly modified state of tune at the moment with a 3bar FPR, Promax chip and boost enhancer. From reading previous posts I was expecting somewhere near 15psi, but my gauge just touches 12. Now some have said the boost enhancer just brings on the factory boost earlier and that 12psi is correct. Others said I should easily see 15psi and to back up the latter, my gauge has in fact pegged 15psi on occasions. Some folks on here thought that the factory WG could be so tired that it is being overpowered by the exhaust alone. So when the Tial showed up at a very reasonable price I thought why not. If the old WG is tired then it'll be money well spent. If not then maybe I get a little quicker spool up and future proofing myself for future upgrades. It seems like there is confusion on whether the Lyndsey boost enhancers raise maximum boost, or just brings on the factory boost earlier. Cheers, Russ

 

[u63af]

My car was running ok on a standard wg but upgraded to a tial Dow about 3 yes ago. I noticed a big difference as mine must have been a bit weak but u would have thought most standard wastegates are pretty tired by now given the heat and mileage most cars have done and that they are over 20 yrs old. I certainly considered mine was well worth the money and if you are doing further modification then it's better for regulating boost. You are better getting an ebc. I got a greddy profec on eBay for 75 a few years back and it's great

 

[Diver944]

When I changed mine for a TiAL the difference was dramatic, no more rapid dropoff in boost over 4000 rpm like you get with an original factory wastegate. You won't regret replacing it and you don't have to suddenly run massive boost

 

[scam75]

I have been on the lookout for a bargain DPW as I intend to change at some point. However my original standard WG is allowing boost to peak at 18/19 psi and falls back to about 15 psi as you keep the foot planted and see 6k revs. I assume a dpw will allow me to maintain 18 psi almost to red line? What other benefits would a dual port wg offer me given the current performance of my standard one? Cheers Stuart

 

[u63af]

I doubt a standard k26/8 will hold 18 to red line regardless of wastegate. Sounds like your wastegate is probably ok if it's holding that boost to 6k.

 

[Lowtimer]

ORIGINAL: scam75 What other benefits would a dual port wg offer me given the current performance of my standard one?

Main benefit would probably be getting meaningful boost a lot earlier - both a lower boost threshold and reduced lag.

 

[scam75]

Thanks for the replies. Does a dpw make the boost spool up quicker then? I wasn't aware of that, I thought I would have needed a more modern turbo to do that. I always thought the dpw just held constant boost and didn't bleed off therefore making it a no brainer if your standard wg had a weak spring. Stuart

 

[robwright]

Stu it is because of the weak 20 year old spring that lag is increased. It starts opening almost immediately thus you start losing boost straight away. DPWs don't use the spring to control the boost. You have boost one side and regulated boost on the other side of a diapragm. Hence how it can be adjusted. You can get good results from your old WG by shimming the spring though.

 

[George Elliott]

Russ, your setup is very similar to my own previous one, the only missing element is a DV30 dump valve.

From reading previous posts I was expecting somewhere near 15psi, but my gauge just touches 12. Now some have said the boost enhancer just brings on the factory boost earlier and that 12psi is correct. Others said I should easily see 15psi and to back up the latter, my gauge has in fact pegged 15psi on occasions.

I'm going to suggest you look at replacing that as they are unreliable beyond a certain age (they do deteriorate) and either that or some fairly significant leak is causing the 12 / 15 variance you are getting. I too had a VDO on that car. Well done, a Tial at the right price will never go wrong. good luck George 944t

 

[robwright]

And it really is a thing of beauty!!! It's a shame to have to bolt to the underside of the car. I will amplify what others have said and would have mounted it on the dashboard if I could have!!!

 

[George Elliott]

Rob, you could consider a window in the tunnel[] George

 

[Vic Rattlehead]

ORIGINAL: George Elliott Russ, your setup is very similar to my own previous one, the only missing element is a DV30 dump valve.

Ah I knew I'd missed something. I'm running the DV30 already, George [] All of the go faster bits were already on the car when I bought it, so the original dump/re-circ valve was the first thing I replaced when in my possession. Sounds like we're running very similar set ups. If you don't mind me asking, what was the peak boost you saw on your VDO?

 

[scam75]

Hi Vic Sorry to butt in and the slight hi-jack of your thread earlier! I have a VDO boost gauge on mine and my spec is very similar if you look at my sig. I see peak boost of 19 psi dropping to 15 psi nearer the end of the rev range. That is with a standard wg right enough but clearly it's doing ok! I have a Forge re-circ valve and Turbo is standard K26/8 but I do have a MAF on mine. Cheers Stuart

 

[George Elliott]

Russ, Stuart, my last 944t was the same as both of yours, Promax also supplied me the kit. I ran at 1.2 Bar which I approximate to 18psi. When setting up, the Boost the Guage registered stupid 20+ values until I got it wound down to the correct figure. The turbo was a standard issue 1989 k26/8 with 110k miles. I generally would not rev the car past 6k, but the boost never seemed to drop away. I take it you have all the pipework connections and lines securely fitted, and also the hot-side - manifold / crossover and gaskets are good as you can lose boost on the hot side too. Is your car used regularly Russ, I always found mine was sweeter and more consistent when used errrrr..... thoroughly.[8|] George 944t

 

[Diver944]

ORIGINAL: scam75 . I see peak boost of 19 psi dropping to 15 psi nearer the end of the rev range. That is with a standard wg right enough but clearly it's doing ok!

It's your MAF that's giving you the extra benefit. It is so much more free flowing than the standard AFM so the turbocharger finds it much easier to suck air through, hence your higher boost and it can hold it longer.

 

[scam75]

ORIGINAL: George Elliott When setting up, the Boost the Guage registered stupid 20+ values until I got it wound down to the correct figure. Is your car used regularly Russ, I always found mine was sweeter and more consistent when used errrrr..... thoroughly. George 944t

Thanks George. I got the same on setting up, boosting up way over 20psi ! My car is used regularly and it does seem to run sweetly all the time as a result. They like the odd "Italian" tune up to keep them on top of their game![] Paul - Thanks, the MAF does seem to make a big difference. I have noticed reduced lag, quicker spool and now it seems holding bigger boost longer. A good investment! Cheers Stuart