Time for more power, where do i start?

[mr brightside]

I keep hearing on this forum of varoius modifications people have made which sound easy to do and would give good value for money power gains, the same ones keep coming up all the time and i would be grateful if someone could advise me as to how much of this is compatible with my '86 924s (ISV not supplementary air valve) and what else is available and easy.

The car has already got a Dansk exhaust and a K&N filter and i don't want to start with porting and cams yet just ancillary components, the things that i've noticed cropping up regularly are:
Vitesse MAF
Promax chip
64mm? Throttle body

Thanks in advance for any help, i believe in asking when in doubt.

 

[edh]

Very little that's easy & cheap I'm afraid - although I'd be following various forum members forays into DIY engine management. Vitesse kit is mainly aimed at turbos.

If you did some work on the engine (cams, ECU, head) you might liberate an extra 20-30 hp - I believe race 2.5's can push 190hp if you're really lucky.

Other than that, losing weight is a good place to start - (if you're into that sort of thing)

I have an unused Blitz chip I bought many years ago for an '86 924S - might be worth a try. I also recall my '86 having shorter gears than my '88, but no-one at the time could shed any light on that one.

As usual, the cheapest route is to sell the car & buy a faster one....[]

 

[zcacogp]

I think the general rule is that N/A cars (like yours, presuming you are referring to the 924 in your sig) are not really the ones to modify - there's not much out there, and not many horses left on the table to be claimed.

The turbos on the other hand are very receptive to having a few grand spent on them. (They then become nearly as good as the S2's, which are so good as to not need modifying. [] )


Oli.

 

[mr brightside]

ORIGINAL: edh

Very little that's easy & cheap I'm afraid - although I'd be following various forum members forays into DIY engine management. Vitesse kit is mainly aimed at turbos.

If you did some work on the engine (cams, ECU, head) you might liberate an extra 20-30 hp - I believe race 2.5's can push 190hp if you're really lucky.

Other than that, losing weight is a good place to start - (if you're into that sort of thing)

I have an unused Blitz chip I bought many years ago for an '86 924S - might be worth a try. I also recall my '86 having shorter gears than my '88, but no-one at the time could shed any light on that one.

As usual, the cheapest route is to sell the car & buy a faster one....[]

How much do you want for that chip edh? Did you quote the serial number of the ECU when you bought it because it may matter?

cheers

 

[edh]

You can have it for £20 + P&P - it's serialised to me, but should be same ECU so no problems using it.

 

[barks944]

Im considering changing the cam on my lux. Pipercams will re-grind a factory camshaft to fast road profile for about 150. The cam profile on the lux is a bit like a tractors, the intake valve doesnt open until the start of the intake stroke. I think a new cam, "chipped DME and MAF conversion" or megasquirt and you should have a reasonable improvment to the lux engine and if you chip it rather than convert to megasquirt you are only looking at around the 200 mark.

I fitted the later injection system to my 84 lux yesterday and the fuelling is much better now. It makes me wonder if somthing was wrong with my original early injection system. Any recommendations on who to get a chip from? 9tuning do one for 80 quid and theres a few on ebay.

 

[mr brightside]

ORIGINAL: edh

You can have it for £20 + P&P - it's serialised to me, but should be same ECU so no problems using it.

I suppose for 20 quid it'd be worth a shot, would you accept it back if it didn't make a difference over a timed run?

 

[zcacogp]

ORIGINAL: mr brightside
... would you accept it back if it didn't make a difference over a timed run?

Cheeky! []

I like your style ... []


Oli.

 

[edh]

ORIGINAL: mr brightside

ORIGINAL: edh

You can have it for £20 + P&P - it's serialised to me, but should be same ECU so no problems using it.

I suppose for 20 quid it'd be worth a shot, would you accept it back if it didn't make a difference over a timed run?

no - I'd just blame your driving technique [] - having done a few timed runs with a gtech, you can see how they can vary quite significantly in the same car, on the same day.

The chip raises the rev limiter by 500rpm, and is mapped for super unleaded. I guess any new chip will want you to use SUL.

 

[mr brightside]

No worries about not accepting a return i understand your reasons. Do you know what octane fuel it is set for? shell is 98 and all the others are 97 sometimes it can matter and i don't like the owners of my local shell! Also does it have any serial numbers on or with it so i could check my DME number with the manufacturer?
cheers.

 

[edh]

no serial nos, but it's a 24-pin chip, so for '86 924S, not later ones (with 28 pins)

I believe that Promax bought out & re-badged blitzchips

according to promax website http://www.promaxmotorsport.com/promaxchip.htm - the ECU should be 0 261 200 077

 

[mr brightside]

That's it yes, thanks for doing the legwork for me. Do you have a paypal account?
cheers, Luke.

 

[edh]

email sent

 

[333pg333]

A larger throttle body won't be of much use unless you augment the rest of the components and increase the VE across the board.

 

[mr brightside]

ORIGINAL: edh

email sent

cheers Ed payment sent. I work at an electronics outfit so i'll probably use an esd wristband just to be on the safe side.

Do you know if the chip is programmed for 97 or 98 octane fuel?

Delivery address:
Luke Appleyard
RTK Instruments
St James Business Park
Knaresborough
HG5 8PJ

Thanks again for your assistance in this thread, luke.

 

[edh]

Posting today....

I'm pretty sure it's just SUL , so 97RON

 

[944 man]

Shell V-Power is 99RON and far better for normaly aspirated cars than Tesco/Greenergy 99RON. Most other SUL is 97RON, although Total Excelium may may be 98RON (the same as Optimax used to be).
If you dont want to really change anything then theres little to be had: although the engine has a good deal to give.
Heads are very nice but theyre throttled by the inlet manifold and the cam is pedestrain. I honestly dont know about the exhaust manifold but matching it to the ports and wrapping it wont do any harm, even if its good. The original barn door type airflow meter is terrible, but there little point trying to replace it, because the DME isnt paying attention over 4,000 rpm anyway. My personal view (which I can substantiate) is that money spent on Vitesse and similar mass airflow meter kits is wasted on virtually all cars (I used to like the AMD hot film kit, although that had the same failings).

Having recently seen somebody fit throttle bodies to a 924 then this route tempts me: Im happy to replace the camshaft and ditch the DME too though, and if you arent then youve probably reached the limit with Ed's chip. Have you fitted it yet?

Simon

 

[Peter Empson]

ORIGINAL: 944 man
My personal view (which I can substantiate) is that money spent on Vitesse and similar mass airflow meter kits is wasted on virtually all cars

If you're only concerned about the dyno plot (which is fair enough given the OP's thread title) then I'd probably agree, but the MAF completely transformed the way my car drives. It's a completely different animal now.

 

[944 man]

SO much money though Pete... I appreciate your point but my money will be spent on an ECU and MAP: itll cost less and hopefully return far greater benefits.

To the OP: your car has low compression pistons too, further limiting your options.

 

[sawood12]

Clearly it all depends if kits like Vitesse are compatable with your car, but if they are then since when was a Vitesse kit significantly more expensive than a standalone? Complete Vitesse MAF kit $1200 which is roughly where decent standalone ECU's start, then you've got all the other stuff to buy to make them work and then tune it. Vitesse uses MAF and MAP which is the optimal solution, is plug and play - no faffing, and will give you almost all the benefits of standalone with none of the hassle. The only benefit of Standalone is if you want to utilise some of the more modern features such as coil on ignition, fully sequential fuel injection etc. How can it be that if one of the biggest restrictions of the engine is the AFM then go on to say that MAF is a waste of time. It is pointless removing restrictions down stream of the AFM (i.e. free'er flowing manifolds) unless you are going to change the AFM to actually get the extra flow or the AFM will continue to be the weakest link in the chain.

MAF's don't give you more horsepower par se. They are a sensor and provide the ECU with better and more accurate input. Any benefit a MAF alone gives in relation to increased power is in removal of air restriction and flexability to get better engine tune.

Clearly for cars where decent MAF piggy back kits are not available then stand alone is the only option if you want to remove the AFM. It is certainly pointless spending BIG cash on cams, manifolds and exhausts and retaining the AFM. That would be like transplanting Lance Armstrongs entire cardiovascular system into your body then attempting to ride the Tour de France whilst breathing through a straw.