Anti Roll Bars

[John Sims]

They are marked with 3 grey blobs

So are my second hand ones, so at least I know I've got late Turbo struts, which is a great start.

Guess what, my Porscheshop springs didn't turn up today so I won my first bet. Why is it when people miss the courier at their end it is my fault (as far as they are concerned) and they don't think they should do anything to remedy the situation despite their failure. "I must have them by the weekend" seems a pretty unambigious statement to me.

 

[John Sims]

Are you going to re-install everything at the same time or in stages? I'd be interested to hear what difference just the 968 M030 ARB's make as that is what I plan to do this year

Sorry Paul it's all going on at once - assuming the springs turn up and fit. Still taking bets on that one.

All that said, I would think the most noticable change will be the ARB's. So I will keep you posted on what happenes there.

This whole exercise started with me trying to improve turn in, and because the car looked naff going round Copse in Ricks photos (perhaps I should have just gone slower). The ARB's should flatten the car out but I'm concerned that I may have ended up stiffening up the front more in comparison with the back so could have reduced turn in. Only time will tell - assuming it all goes together again.

 

[944Turbo]

ORIGINAL: 944Turbo

labelled with Porsche part numbers which when I checked PET where listed as S2, these were for larger diameter springs but on the euro car parts web site/catalogue were incorrectly listed as suitable for turbo.

A new Euro car parts catalogue arrived this morning and they seem to have rectified the error now listing a seperate part for the 90/91 turbo

Tony

 

[John Sims]

"I must have them by the weekend" seems a pretty unambigious statement to me.

Guess what, springs didn't turn up today. Not that they were going to as, after chasing up Porscheshop on the phone, they finaly admitted they don't deliver on Saturday. []

So having resigned myself to the fact that I couldn't pre-fit the springs to my struts, prior to Beaky going to Autostrassa on Monday, it was agreed that Porscheshop would deliver the springs direct to Autostrassa first thing Monday morning.....

Guess what, I then get another phone call...

"Terribly sorry Mr Sims, our couriers have miss directed your springs and they are currently in Sheffield. I'm afraid they wont be delivered untill Tuesday." Unfortunately for the young gentlemen on the phone I wasn't feeling at my best and he copped it with both barrells. I explained to him that it was either through his fault, or the fault of his couriers, that the springs hadn't arrived and consequently between them they would rectify the situation. I wasn't interested in how they did it, they could put the springs on a bike for all I cared, but one way or another those springs were to be delivered on Monday and they, or their couriers, would be footing the bill. He went quiet, I thanked him for getting things sorted and I put the phone down.

Thursday I had phoned them chasing the "next day" delivery, and also enquiring about the size of the springs. Of course they never phoned back with either information. I still have no idea what size the springs are but, following Tony's thoughts and details, I am almost certain that, if the blasted springs do ever turn up, the whon't fit any way. Another potential demonstration of incompetence on the part of the vendor.

 

[John Sims]

A new Euro car parts catalogue arrived this morning and they seem to have rectified the error now listing a seperate part for the 90/91 turbo

Perhaps you could let me have their details Tony, as I have little doubt I will be ordering some new springs on Monday.

 

[944Turbo]

Sorry John, that was the struts, AFAIK they don't do lowering springs, anyway www.eurocarparts.com ,
Tony

P.S. I hope I am wrong!

 

[937carrera]

Graham Goode Motors in Leicester can supply springs to any specification.

They need to know inside diameter, spring rate and spring length. I have had a number of sets from them for the race car.

The i.d is 3 1/2 inches, spring length, just measure a standard spring and deduct the amount you want to lower the car by. Spring rate ?, sorry, I'd rather keep that to myself, but road will certainly be softer than track.

 

[John Sims]

Spring rate ?, sorry, I'd rather keep that to myself, but road will certainly be softer than track.

Oh come on, that's the most important part []

Springs didn't turn up today [] I have been promissed them for 1st thing tomorrow though. They might even fit, as the springs on the second hand stuts are cylindrical, not tappered at one end as are the springs somewhere between here and Sheffield. [8|]

 

[John Sims]

Well Beaky is back home again complete with 1990 front struts, Porscheshop lowering springs and 968 M030 anti roll bars back and front.

Not had much of a chance to try it out yet, as the back was full of old bits on the way home, but it does feel a lot tighter just driving around.

I attach below the photo that prompted this latest upgrade (thanks Rick, I think) and the calculations/assumptions made to establish the original angle of roll.

I have scaled the side closest to us based on 3" from the base of the tyre to the rim, as messured when standing. This is probably a little short as, under cornering, the inside back wheel isn't weighted. The 60" is the distance between the the bottom of the left and right body trims.

 

[Diver944]

Well done John, keep us updated with your feelings compared to the old suspension.

Will you be arranging for Rick to take the same photo from the same spot at Copse when the 944 Register visit Silverstone again in the summer? I look forward to seeing you get your slide rule out and calculate the difference in lean angle []

 

[John Sims]

I look forward to seeing you get your slide rule out and calculate the difference in lean angle

You may well mock, but just wait untill I sail past you on the inside as you fight with that fine line that runs between getting round a bend and ending up in the Kitty Litter. (Which one of these smiley things is suposed to represent smug?)

 

[Diver944]

Overtaking is on the left at Silverstone and only on the straight bits with my consent []

If you take me on the inside of Copse you'll have Melindi to deal with [8D]

 

[John Sims]

you'll have Melindi to deal with

Oh I say! Rather!

When do we sigh up for the next track day?

 

[Fen]

ORIGINAL: Diver944
If you take me on the inside of Copse

I sincerely hope there'll be no taking each other on the inside of anywhere....[]

 

[John Sims]

Well, been out today and the car certainly sits flatter, and the general ride is far more "Sporty" shall we say.

I don't know if it is the harder set up but their seems to be a bit of a knock on one side []. It isn't easy to tell because of the general reduction in compliance -if that is the right word.

The only way to get any idea of how it handles on the road is currently limitted to going round round-a-bouts - when nobody is about - so not the best way to try things out. There still seems to be an initial tendancy to understeer but, although I could tighten the rear further, as it will push to oversteer under power and exiting roundabouts I'm inclined to leave well alone at the moment.

Whilst I would like to say that it corners like it is on rails I tend to be a bit hyper critical. It is without doubt far more planted than previously.

The possible knock is anoying me and could be down to having to use second hand top pivots. I now find that the pivots, as quoted by my OPC at £400 each, can be bought from the States at $39 as side. I have to admit to being sorely tempted, but will restrain myself for a couple of weeks as I need to jack the front up to change the discs. At the momement I'm trying to convince myself that it is the new set up bedding in, springs twisting in the seatings etc.

The anoying thing is, if the top pivos get swapped again, the geometry is going to have to be rechecked again []

Who was it that said "If it ain't broke, don't fix it..."?

 

[John Sims]

I now find that the pivots, as quoted by my OPC at £400 each, can be bought from the States at $39

Oh no they can't [] That was for the earlier models, Turbot, S2, late Lux etc $500 per side. Apparently they are only made by Porsche.

Looks like we could be up for race spec rose jointed camber adjustable top plates then at a mere $400 for the pair. Now how do I get this past Belinda? [8|]

 

[Fen]

ORIGINAL: John SimsLooks like we could be up for race spec rose jointed camber adjustable top plates then at a mere $400 for the pair. Now how do I get this past Belinda? [8|]

Well, they come anodised in pretty colours...

 

[944Turbo]

I would have thought that the top mounts could be refurbished by an engineering shop for around £25 per side - the bearings look fairly ordinary and should be available from a bearing specialist relatively cheaply, probably worth investigating anway.
Tony

 

[944Turbo]

One other thought - My car was set up with negative camber on the rear when I got it and the front as factory - I had it reset with some negative on the front which helped my turn in - I think for road use plenty of camber / castor adjustment is available with the standard set up.
Tony

 

[John Sims]

I think for road use plenty of camber / castor adjustment is available with the standard set up.

There is a fair amount of adjustment but it isn't easy to adjust incrimentally. The advantage of adjustment at the top of the strut is that you can mark several settings (Road, dry track, wet track) and swap them easily from under the bonnet.

Been out for another little run this evening, but being wet I couldn't try too many heroics. I am starting to think that the knocks and the like are just as a result of everything being that bit stiffer and the springs are still seating themselves in a fairly rusty looking strut spring cup.

You do certainly have to be much more carefull with the car in the wet with the stiffer set up, but then that is to be expected realy.