modern equivalent of the S2 coupe

[DivineE]

IMHO

350Z = nasty cheap thing that looks like it comes from TOYS R US. Plus its a 2 seater and its not fast!

Rx8 = lovely but consumes more fuel than the US

TT = 2 seater

330 = Trying to be something its not. Its nice but not a replacement for a sports car.

Alfa Romeo brera 3.2 (4 wheel drive) = My pick of the bunch but heavy, slow, thirsty and don't let the waranty run out! (too much like my Mk5 Golf R32 that cost me £700-800 per month in fuel OWCH!)

So... keep the 944 or if you have to have something more modern thats sporty with 4 seats buy a 911[] problem solved!

Regards,

Ben

 

[mik_ok]

ORIGINAL: Fen

That makes the RX8 sound like a better car than anything I have believed about it to date.

It's a good car! []

It is however Japanese, and it is indeed thirsty (as mentioned). The scoob is our frugal car [&:] (and the 2.5 is apparently slightly thirstier than the old 2.0).

Wheels are crap (corrode from the centrcaps) ~ hence I had a new set fitted today under warranty. Need to think about some extra protection for this set though for the future.

 

[Fen]

Pah - 23mpg - might as well be a Prius []

 

[Justin85]

SWMBO has a RX-8 231 which would be a decent car at the £14k or £15k it will be worth when it's 18 months old, but not for the £23k her company paid for it. It's not slow and is quite fun to drive, with a decent gear box and brakes, but in my opinion is neither practical/quiet/comfortable as a decent saloon, or involving enough to be a great steer. It's also ropey inside in that unique way Japanese cars seem to be, and like her Celica before looked new and fresh for 12 months when launched, only to look old hat pretty quickly, although I think it looks okay in black. Oil consumption has really eased off now (9000 miles), but I still get barely 250 miles from 60 litres of unleaded when I "borrow" it.

I had a day in a 350Z just before the recent facelift, which I really enjoyed - really for the engine and sheer RWD-ness of it. Too many RWD cars nowadays seem to be set up to understeer.

Finding an equivalent to the S2 is tough, as things like 330Ci's etc are too ubiquitous, surely?

 

[sawood12]

Quite frankly I think the BMW 3 series coupe's do not qualify because the S2 was built from day with one destiny in the mind of the designers - to be a sportscar and nothing else. The 330 is a compromise as a sportscar as it is primarily a repmobile that has been modified to be a 'sportscar'. The RX8 and 350Z are far more comparable and dare I say it the Z3M coupe. I'm not a big BMW fan but I do like the Z3M coupe for some strange reason.

Similarly for the TT - it's a Golf in coupe's clothing and the 4wd version is not a proper 4wd. It utilises that Haldex hydraulic transaxel that basically proportions power to the rear wheels from a minimum of 0% (i.e. front wheel drive) to a maximum of 50%. The only true 4wd systems Audi uses are the ones fitted to the longitudinally mounted engined cars that employs a proper Quattro Torsen center diff and differentials ons the front and rear axels i.e. 3 diffs.

But the true successors to the S2 from a configuration point of view I think are the front engined Ferrari's and Masserati's as they have the front engine, rear transaxel layout and therefore will be more similar to an S2 from a driving perspective.

 

[knightma]

Probably get ridiculed for this one but in terms of overall architecture, I would liken the 944 to the current Aston Martin V8 Vantage. Both have a front engine connected to a rear transaxle by a torque tube giving balanced weight distribution. Both are designed as practical everyday sports cars with a rear tailgate giving access to a decent sized luggage area. Both are also very fine looking cars. I think it's a real shame Porsche did not persue this configuration and develop the 944/968 into a 350 bhp practical sports car costing about 50k today.

 

[sawood12]

The only thing about the AM comparison is that they spend more time at their local dealerships getting fixed which is most un-Porschelike.

 

[Neil Haughey]

ORIGINAL: Fen

I'm thinking there is a gap in the market - surely if proper (i.e. German) manufacturers can justify the tooling to make cars with 2 seats such as the TrulyTerrible but they are not a option to people in the target demographic in terms of age/social status with young children (and I appreciate I'm in the minority in not having any of those), then someone needs to make a coupe with middling performance at an affordable price that can be run as a daily driver but isn't a saloon with the back doors welded shut.

Even the Calibra, Probe/Cougar etc. are gone and unreplaced.

Funnily enough I though a little while ago that VAG with their brand engineering brilliance could resurrect the Wanderer brand and put it on a modern 944/68 type car. They have some great V6 engines they could use and a huge parts inventory to pick from.

 

[rob.kellock]

Ben is right...for modern 4 seater (sort of) sportscar look no further than the 996. At £35k you'd get a lovely one with a warranty although you'll never find a front engined one!

 

[Neil Haughey]

Can you get a bike in the boot of a 996, or a guitar amp and luggage, or a spare set of wheels and tools when on a track day,,,, no I didn't think so. 911's suffer from the same practicality downfall as all other modern sportscars. Its just that on the 911 it is not as bad as many others and the rear seat is usefull as a stowage area and sometime seating.

I actually moved house 3 times where the 44 was one of the main wagons used for moving stuff, it is amazing how much one can get in the back of a 44.

 

[DivineE]

ORIGINAL: sawood12

It utilises that Haldex hydraulic transaxel that basically proportions power to the rear wheels from a minimum of 0% (i.e. front wheel drive) to a maximum of 50%. The only true 4wd systems Audi uses are the ones fitted to the longitudinally mounted engined cars that employs a proper Quattro Torsen center diff and differentials ons the front and rear axels i.e. 3 diffs.

Sorry to correct as I know you do know your stuff but contrary to popular beleif (and I've heard lots of different rumours) the Haldex system is actually very good. It does put 80-90% power through the front wheels during normal driving to conserve fuel but will allow up to the same 80-90% rear bias when necessary to the rear. It is a strange feeling when your on the limit as you can physically feel it altering the power and the car wavers about a bit on the road but the really really good thing about it is that if it losses traction with all four wheels it alwals defaults to a rear wheel drive bias. [] I have many video's to prove this fact if your curious but I assure you that if you dump the clutch off the line in the wet it will fish tail wildly just like a good old 944.

 

[sawood12]

Well the % split probably varies from model to model and I know you can chip them to give them more rear bias, however I know that on the old model of TT the max that could go through the Haldex in standard form was 50% because it was in the glossy marketting bumf that my dad has from when he bought his TT. It is very effective, my dads TT grips like velcro and I still reckon it will give any car a run for it's money in terms of raw grip round bends, although it feels numb to drive. On balance I have to confess to liking the old TT model. I know the new one is supposed to be better to drive but it just doesn't have the same imact on me as the original one does.

Despite the tone of my previous note I agree it is a good system, especially for a normal family car or sporty hot hatch, but you can't beat proper mechanical diffs and the proper quattro system, and reading between the lines I think i'm probably right in assuming it was probably pinched by Porsche for the 911 4wd systems, i'm pretty sure it is in the 996. Audi got their own back though as they pinched Porsches PDK system from the 60's race cars and rebranded it DSG.

 

[333pg333]

How many of you use the rear seats? I've never had anyone sit in mine so could we not allow cars without rear seats for this comparison? If so, I'd vote for the Cayman, if not probably the 330.

 

[Diver944]

ORIGINAL: 333pg333

How many of you use the rear seats?

All the time. With two teenage boys and no other cars, the 944s have been the largest cars I've ever owned - I'd never have bought the first one if it didnt have rear seats and a boot.

However after two 8 hour drives down to Cornwall and back in the past fortnight I think we are finally succumbing to the realisation that next year with an 18 and 15 year old we won't be able to use the 944 [] (unless we take both of them [], maybe I'm being presumptious that the Turbo will be back on the road by then )

We spent the morning looking at Saab 93 Cabrios to replace the S2 but have now seen sense and if we do need a bigger car when all four of us need to go long distances we'll just hire one (it makes no sense to me to buy a large, sensible and boring vehicle when we only really need one a couple of times a year [&:])

 

[333pg333]

I don't know how you fit one of those boys in there let alone 2! Makes sense on hiring a car for those occasions Paul. I didn't think you could drive 8 hours in one direction in England. For us that's like going to the shop for milk and papers.[]

 

[Fen]

You can drive 8 hours to Cornwall easily. We nipped down there on Friday for a couple of nights; 3 1/2 hours to get just over 100 miles.

 

[Neil Haughey]

ORIGINAL: 333pg333

I don't know how you fit one of those boys in there let alone 2! Makes sense on hiring a car for those occasions Paul. I didn't think you could drive 8 hours in one direction in England. For us that's like going to the shop for milk and papers.[]

You would be surprised how long it can take to get around this small island. A few years back it took me 3.5 hrs to get from Worcs (where I was living at the time) to Builth Wells in mid-wales for some rallying. On a map Worcs looks like it is on/near the welsh border and wales is not that wide. It feels like driving across Europe trying to drive across Wales.

 

[sawood12]

My record drive in the UK was Derby to Aberdeen. Took just over 10hrs but actual drive time was about 7hrs. The remaining 3rs was stopping every few hours or so to feed the nipper who was only about 3 months old at the time. Cornwall is a 5hr drive for us - well North Cornwall at least (Padstow) which we do every year without fail. Never done it in the 944 though.

 

[333pg333]

Hell, the first time I drove my car was home. Adelaide to Sydney. 1000miles. Decent test drive.[] About 10 hours driving. Reached 240kmh (speedo)and it had plenty left. People in the outback have properties that would take a couple hours to cross!

 

[944Turbo]

ORIGINAL: sawood12

My record drive in the UK was Derby to Aberdeen. Took just over 10hrs but actual drive time was about 7hrs. The remaining 3rs was stopping every few hours or so to feed the nipper who was only about 3 months old at the time. Cornwall is a 5hr drive for us - well North Cornwall at least (Padstow) which we do every year without fail. Never done it in the 944 though.

Would you be impressed by Inverness to Christchurch in 8 hours then? wanted to stop half way but couldnt find a hotel.