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respray=quick "blow over" or full "windows out " job?

ORIGINAL: peanut
You can't have a hard and fast rule for every car. Its important to weigh up each situation.
I reckon this is where it is at. Look at the car, the owner, the bank balance, the likely use of it, and then see what the result is.

I'd never spend £4k having my S2 resprayed. The car isn't worth that much, and it's a daily driver. I know that having a fresh coat of new paint would look lovely for as long as it lasted, but it would be chipped within minutes. Which would devastate me. And all it would take would be for some scrote to run a nail down the side of it for me to be seeing red (with or without lacquer) ...

But I know that some people will think otherwise, and be able to afford £4k more easily. And if that's your bag, good on you and I hope you enjoy it. I know your car will look infinitely better than mine, and I will be jealous both when I see pictures and when I see it in the tin. But such jealousy will be a lot less painful when I see the absence of a £4k dent in my bank account.

Jason, one faintly useful thing I would add to the useless homily I've just written is that a job is always worth doing properly. If you pay a chunk less for a lesser job and it shows, you will always be kicking yourself whenever you look at it. Your mind may work differently, but I know I hate sub-standard workmanship more than I love a bargain. (If that made sense).


Oli.
 
Peanut,

Funny you should say that, one of my fav cars too, heres my S2 parked next to my pops mk2 at the Le Mans Classic last week, it looked great and everyone loved it in its racing numbers..[:D]

mortimer20100709l10lema.jpg
 
ORIGINAL: zcacogp


I'd never spend £4k having my S2 resprayed.


Oli you wont even spend £50 on club membership so hardly any surprise there...[:D]

Its true what you say, different people do things differently, some wouldn't warrant spending that much on their car, especially considering the relative low value these cars now have, others by contrast will spend their hard eaned dosh getting their car to how they would like it to be, irrespective of value because of the 'value' of having it how they like it...

Edd
 
ORIGINAL: Copperman05
Oli you wont even spend £50 on club membership so hardly any surprise there...[:D]
You know Edd, I was just about to post something nice about your dad's Mk2 Jag and the fact that you have racing numbers on your S2, when I scrolled down and saw your comment and decided I wouldn't! [;)]

My dad is a Yorkshireman. Which is my excise for being tight ... 'scuse me, I'm just off to make myself another cuppa. I'm sure this teabag'll do another 'round ...


Oli.

ETA smileys. In case Edd thinks that I really am having a go at him! (Actually, on second thoughts maybe I should take them out - I am having a go at him!)
 
Yeah car stickers are a Le Mans tradition it would seem (more for the regular 24hr than the classic), cant say I liked them on my S2 and Im glad they are gone now, they looked great on the Mk2 though...

Edd
 

ORIGINAL: zcacogp
I'd never spend £4k having my S2 resprayed. The car isn't worth that much, and it's a daily driver. I know that having a fresh coat of new paint would look lovely for as long as it lasted, but it would be chipped within minutes. Which would devastate me. And all it would take would be for some scrote to run a nail down the side of it for me to be seeing red (with or without lacquer) ...

But I know that some people will think otherwise, and be able to afford £4k more easily. And if that's your bag, good on you and I hope you enjoy it. I know your car will look infinitely better than mine, and I will be jealous both when I see pictures and when I see it in the tin. But such jealousy will be a lot less painful when I see the absence of a £4k dent in my bank account.

I've met you Oli, and know you're not the jealous type! I always think there is a subtle difference between Jealously and envy - Jealousy begrudges the owner of what-ever it is you covert, where as envy doesn't! Symantics - sorry.

The daily driver thing is very significant. My daily driver I would patch-paint for longevity, but not respray... but then I am privalidged to have a shiny weekend car.

I have also spent more money than we are talking about here on spraying a 924 of all things... That, is a hobby... and I have spent a few thousand on that hobby... there are plenty of hobbies where there is nothing to show for your money at the end of it - it has cost peanuts compared to a friends budget for playing polo for example.

There is another issue too - many people on here reckon on budgeting £1k per year to maintain a 944... what proportion of this should be set aside for bodywork? Not a realistic approach to it of course, as maintaining bodywork is a different kettle of fish altogether - but £4k on a car that you keep for four years... I would just bulk at doing it for some-one elses benefit - i.e., respraying it just before selling it.
 
they were awful for rust wern't they !

There were a couple of very nicely restored cars on ebay last month that went for under £3k one just need the interior trim put in and was a runner . Had completly restored and resprayed body and new engine. Poor chap had had a heart attack .......... probably due to the total expenditurel[:(]
 
that is simply gorgeous . Does he let you drive it ?

When I left home at 15 my landlord had 5-6 Jags in his garden. He used to wheelie them in every gear going up and down the road. God how I wanted one of those cars


ORIGINAL: Copperman05

Peanut,

Funny you should say that, one of my fav cars too, heres my S2 parked next to my pops mk2 at the Le Mans Classic last week, it looked great and everyone loved it in its racing numbers..[:D]

mortimer20100709l10lema.jpg
 
Any owner of a 944 is entitled to take the view that it's only worth a couple of grand so there's no point spending a lot of money on it. That's the normal course of events with used cars and in the end that's why almost every used car ends up in the crusher - it's just a case of when. If it's not the bodywork, it's a failure of the engine, or the gearbox that makes owners say "I'm not spending that much on a cheap car".

It's a fair point of view. I was one of the many who thought "I'm not spending that much on a cheap car" when I scrapped my three various Mark II Escorts, and my Manta, and when my friends were scrapping their Capris, back in the mid 1990s, fifteen years ago.

I now think I made a mistake and I'm not making that mistake again. If we'd had the foresight to spend the money then, we would not have lost out given what those cars sell for now, because although they used to be everywhere, now they are few in number.

Outside museums, there are only three categories of 944: the (presently) small number that have had big money spent on body restoration, and the majority which either need it now (most of which are getting scrapped) and those that will need it over the next few years (most of which will also be scrapped). In five years' time the supply of good 944s will be vastly smaller than it is today and most of the good survivors will owe their owners well north of five figures. Few owners will want to sell them at all (like Paul) and if they do, aren't going to sell them for peanuts.

Having started at the beginning of this year I am part way through getting a late 944 Turbo thoroughly overhauled and given whatever restoration it needs, including trim, glass, suspension, the lot. I am convinced it will cost a lot less to do it now than to do it in three or five years' time, and by the end of 2010 I will have the car in the condition I want it. Mechanical work by Hartech, bodywork probably by Daytona (whom I am seeing with it this Saturday). By then, including the original purchase price, it will probably owe me the price of a new Focus. Not a Focus RS, not even a Focus ST, but the price of an ordinary everyday model.

Some people might say that makes me a mug, that you can buy the best 944 in the world for £7,000, but I don't think that's actually the point. For one thing, the best 944 in the world isn't generally for sale. For another thing, most of the cars out there, even the very nice tidy ones, are still going to need the bodywork done at some stage. And this will still be a cheap Porsche, in the context of what it cost new, in the context of what it is still capable of delivering compared to, say a new Cayman, and better for me than any other car, (including an old 996 or Boxster, say) that is generally available for the same money. And my plan is to keep the car for ten years and then pass it on to my daughter (who is now 16 and will be taught to drive it properly). By getting everything done to the highest standard I can afford now, and then staying on top of the car, by knowing exactly what's been done, and by staying on top of it from a good starting point, I think the cost will work out pretty well over the medium and long term.
 

ORIGINAL: Lowtimer

Some people might say that makes me a mug, that you can buy the best 944 in the world for £7,000, but I don't think that's actually the point. For one thing, the best 944 in the world isn't generally for sale.

I think you can double the 7k for one of the very best, and if the price of a decent Cayman drops to 7k the only reason to pick a 944 over one would be nostalgia.
 
I think you can double the 7k for one of the very best, and if the price of a decent Cayman drops to 7k the only reason to pick a 944 over one would be nostalgia.

Very true, there are 944s with insurance values of well over £10K that would be hard to replace even then.

Nostalgia is a good thing, I'd rather have an original RS2000 than a Focus RS myself. I'd certainly prefer a Capri to a Probe or Cougar. And a 944 over a Cayman. I'm a bit odd, though. [&:]

The other thing to consider is the running cost of newer cars. I'm not sure that the sub-£7K Boxsters that are around will be good to drive without refurbing suspension etc., and the costs could be far more than on a 944. A £7K Cayman might only be a matter of time, but I'm not sure it'll be a good car to buy.
 

ORIGINAL: Lowtimer,

including the original purchase price, it will probably owe me the price of a new Focus.

For me you've hit the nail on the head, it's all about the cost to change to something else.

I will be spending that amount to respray my S2 at some point in the next year or so. It's a good one but not a mint one and I've been tidying up little bits of the bodywork as they appear, but there comes a time when it has to be done all over and properly if I want to keep it for the next 20 years and 200,000 miles (and I do).

I would much rather spend 5 or 6 grand getting the exterior perfect and then retrimming the interior than sell it and spend more money on a normal boring car that will depreciate by a similar amount in short order

We don't generally buy these cars for cheap A to B transport, they're special. [:)]
 
They Cayman ait the moment seems to start at around £20K or £21K, looking at the ads on Pistonheads. And of course there are plenty of Boxsters around for that sort of money, and less. And a £21K Cayman hasplenty of depreciation in it.

If you forced me at gunpoint to drive a car from the current-day Porsche range it would indeed be a Cayman rather than a 997 or any of the lumpy V8 stuff. But modern-era Porsches don't really do anything for me. and what I want is a really good 944 Turbo.

Some people want a Focus RS, some (including me) would rather have an old rear-drive RS2000... some would rather have prefer an old '80s Audi Quattro to a recent S5... same situation.
 
I agree with the whole bodywork thing and would spend the money having mine done once I was happy I was not going to do any more damage whilst working on it. I have already had my seats retrimmed by Southbound and they look amazing. The only let down I have found when restoring the interiors on these cars is that the carpets can only be purchased from Porsche and there is no aftermarket kit to OEM standard and to replace them costs in excess of £2k. Unfortunately my car has the light grey carpets which are more or less white so they do not stand the test of time too well. I have considered dying but its a shame no one sells a good after market kit like the ones available for 911's.
 

ORIGINAL: tref

I think I have only ever regretted what I didn't do, never what I did - i.e., on the 924T Cab, for the little extra work, I wish I had gone bare shell rather than rolling shell... Tatty edges around the rubbers, or worse, paint on the rubbers annoys the hell out of me - can you live with it?


No need for that simply run electrical wire under any flexible rubber. It lifts the rubber off the body so paint gets under and its easy to mask off. When done simply remove the wire and you cant tell its been masked................simples [;)]

Having said that..............if you intend to keep the car then its defo windows out, doors off (so the shuts can be done) front Pu and rear spoiler off too

You should get the nuts of a paint job for £2.5K so discuss exactly what they are doing for that kind of semolians.............
 
ORIGINAL: Hilux




No need for that simply run electrical wire under any flexible rubber. It lifts the rubber off the body so paint gets under and its easy to mask off. When done simply remove the wire and you cant tell its been masked................simples [;)]

.....

Nice tip paul [;)]
 

ORIGINAL: pauljmcnulty

well if we were talking about a Jaguar E type worth £20k I'd agree with you but I doubt any 944 is worth spending £4000.00 on a respray .
I've only seen a handful of 944's with a resale value greater than £4000.00 in the past year or so.
I love my 944S2 don't get me wrong but if I had that kind of money to spend on a respray I'd be looking for something more rare and exotic

It's an interesting point.

Personally, I'd rather have a 944 that I'd put £10K into than anything else I could buy for £10K. I'm not planning ever changing it, circumstances allowing, as I can't see what else I really want more. It's either old "classics", so read "rusty and broken down", or modern cars which have huge potential bills with all the electrical stuff alone.

£4K on a proper restoration, which isn't all that complicated on a 944 as they don't rot away like most cars, isn't that bad once every 20 years. I know plenty of people who blow that on depreciation every year on far less interesting machinery.


Here here Paul

I chucked £5000 down the drain on my XC 70 in 1 year in repairs and depreciation.

bought my S2 for £2.5 k a year ago and have spent the same again on it but dont consider that particuarly bad as it includes things like tyres shockers and decent battery oh yes plus an RS steering wheel xmas pressie to myself) THe front wings will need done in the next year or so and if I change them for new porsche items rekon on 2K to do the job right but will be worth every penny

Like Paul dont see me ever selling and plan to have the car on my retirement and thats still a few years away[;)]
 
Given that one can buy a boxster for similar money to a 944 or 968 these days I don't see the Cayman as a threat or an alternative. Every Indie I have been in over the past 2 years has had at least one boxster or 996 with a dead engine in at the time of visit. I make no apology for stating my belief that Porsche stopped being a manufacturer of quality vehicles more than a decade ago, now just look at the reliability index score on the boxster to see how gash Porsche has become compared to the rest of the industry which at the end of the day is the only comparison that matters. Therefore for me this question is more about would I spend the money to maintain an old Porsche that I liked or just chop it in for another car.

...and another thing, £4K for body resto or paint is small change compared to how much many spend restoring old 911's or 356's, or for that matter building a proper race car.
 

I also agree with others here that 4k is not an unreasonable price to pay for a good windows out full respray. I wouldn't consider a blow over no matter how cheap, it doesn't matter how well they prepare the car or mask it up it will always look what it is. This is assuming that we are saying they do not strip the obvious parts of the car such as bumpers, difusers,mirrors etc etc, there's more to it than just taking the glass out. I would also be against a bare metal job except on parts of the body that need repair. Once you strip to metal you loose the galvanised protection, yes this can be replaced with a zinc primer but this will never be as good as the original galvanised dip so be careful, only do it where needed, a good paint shop should advise you of this.
Back to the 4k price tag, I say this isn't that bad a price from experience having had a full windows out job done some 10 years ago now which cost me just over 3.5k. The car has done well in that time but when funds allow I do plan to do this again since I need a new front valance and small repair on nearside front wing. A word of warning though , unless you are doing a full restoration job do not expect a trouble free ride in the future. In recent years I have had a new nearside sill fitted and repare to drivers front wing due to slight showing of rust under the paint around the arch. These where issues that were not present when the car had it's respray 10 years ago of course..:)
Oh and if you hadn't already guessed I'm like Paul and intend to keep my car for life, the money I've spent on it over my 12 years of ownership would make most here say I'm mad.... perhaps I am?....:)


Pete
 

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