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944 vs 968 - Comparison

Chris,

As has been said, 944's and 968's are very similar animals. Some swear the 968 is light years ahead of the 944, some say there is little difference. I'd drive some good examples of all three (944 turbo, 944 S2 and 968) and see which you prefer. I'd wager that the 968 and the 944 S2 will feel most similar. The S2 vs Turbo debate will rage on for evermore, but they are very different cars and you need to choose the one you prefer.

Jonny, interesting. I understood that the Neckasulm plant produced better workmanship than the Porsche factory in Stuttgart (a point that is still relevant today - Stuttgart-built Boxsters are inferior in build quality to those made by Velmet.) The corrosion protection issue is more a matter of age and quality of steel; older 944's rust less than newer ones, and rust is becoming an issue with 968's as well as they get older. The 968 engine is a derivation of the 944 S2 lump, but the variable valve timing mechanism rarely works as it should and they very rarely deliver all the horses they did from the factory. That, coupled with the greater weight, makes them slower than the S2 (some say this was the case even when tehy were new.) In terms of residuals, 'prospects' needs to be caveated; if a 968 costs twice as much to buy as a 944, it can lose up to twice as much of it's value in monetary terms and still show a lower %age depreciation. However this argument is a bit academic as I don't get the impression that the OP is strapped for cash!

In terms of european touring, here is my S2 a couple of days ago. (Some may recognise the location as being Cabaret Rouge cemetery in Northern France.)

DSC_4122.jpg



Oli.
 
I also undertood that the Neckasulm produced 944's are considered better mad ethan the last of the line put together in Stuttgart, have no reason to suppose that this doesn't apply to 968's as well...

As others have said its all down to personal taste and choice. Personally the 968 has never done anything for me styling wise and seems a bit of a mish-mash. I also would advise not paying over the odds prices for the CS model which seems to command a daft premium over other 968's.

Fabulous picture Oli - did you have a fine tour ?
 
ORIGINAL: Jonny944CS

Boot space
- just ask Jeremy [;)]

<ahem>

yes I do tend to use mine for all kinds of things, as well as tip runs (always funny to look at other people's reactions) and my weekly Bike Ride around Grafham Water, I sometimes have to squeeze in the Daughter's hockey goalie kit with the Bike, but of course both the 944 and 968 can do this:

IMAG0551.jpg

 
ORIGINAL: Suffolk944

Fabulous picture Oli - did you have a fine tour ?
Thanks Jon. 'Twas a week in Northern France with family to celebrate my Dad's 70th birthday. My Dad and I took a day to visit some battlefields, Vimy Ridge and a couple of cemeteries (Cabaret Rouge and Bois de Noulette). It's something my Dad has a strong interest in, which I share to a lesser extent, and neither of us had done anything like it before. Yes, it was a fine tour, and we are thinking that Ypres could be a good thing to have a bash at next year, possibly.

DSC_4104.jpg


DSC_4113.jpg


Vimy Ridge

DSC_4139.jpg


Bois de Noulette


Oli.
 
Is something I have always wanted to do as have an interest in such things too - might have to be next year now as this year is already pretty well booked up !

(Apologies to the OP for the slight tangent within this thread - is one of the joys of such a busy and vibrant forum !)
 
Bringing things back on topic...

Having owned and driven many Porsches (amongst other things), if you do end up with a 968 and a 993 you'll definitely be wanting to use the 968 for the long journeys. It is a lovely, long distance, gt car. Which the 993 isn't, especially so with the sports seats.

The offset pedals on the 993 mean you sit slightly twisted. Which is made worse in the stiffer, more hugging, fixed back sports seats. Not comfy after an hour or so. So much so when I had a 993 as a daily runner in London I'd always get the Diablo out if I was driving to my office in Dorset. Two hours in the Lambo was heaven compared to the porker.

But put a sports exhaust on a 993 and go for country road sprint and it's great. Much more fun than a 968.

For what it's worth I'd recommend a 944 turbo (modified to reduce lag and add a little more go) for the long trips (as they are so much prettier and more collectable than the 968), and then keep a 993 for fun blasts.

Have fun looking!

And off topic slightly, if you want a bargain 996, I've just put mine up for sale.
 
Wow, lots to think about here then!

Not only a lot to think about, it looks like I am now considering a 944 S2, 944 Turbo 220 and a 944 Turbo 250.

I really do like the retro looks of an 86 944 Turbo with teledials, as well as the later looks of a late 250 or S2 with a bridge spoiler and Design 90 wheels (see I have been doing my homework!!!)

But I can also see the benefit of a the newer 968.. If only I could get a 968 Turbo, now then I would be happy!

I know they made a 968 Turbo RS, about 4 of them I think, but I keep finding references to a 968 Turbo, but can not find any data or information. Do these ever come up for sale (maybe a question for the 968 area I guess)

Thanks for all your help so far!
 
The 968 Turbo S was a sales disaster and there were very, very few built. In total there were only twenty turbocharged 968s, plus prototypes (16 'S' & 4 'RS').
 
What kind of money is a 968 Turbo S and a 968 Turbo RS worth?

Are they still six speed? an LSD gearbox? what kind of suspension?

Does the Turbo S have a bonnet like an RS? (Scoop/vent and 2 naca ducts?)

All pie in the sky, bet they are worth silly money
 
RSs dont really have a market value, being so rare. The last one that I read about sold for over a third of a million US dollars. The Turbo S has a par of NACA ducts, but it doesnt have the radiator vent.
 
Thought as much.

Have you ever seen a 968 Turbo S on the market? Or would they be worth the same kind of money?

What is the difference between the S and the RS?
 
I've seen examples of the Turbo S for sale. In fact there's one here:
http://www.968turbo.de/968turbosforsale.html

There's no price here but I would expect it to be priced in the late five figures (sterling). It's a collector's item only: if you want a proper 3 litre 300 to 350 bhp 944T or 968T to actually clock up serious mileage on the roads, it would cost far less, and be far more sensible, to go down the well-established big-capacity 3.0 to 3.2 litre conversion route for a 944 Turbo, or to put that sort of engine (large capacity 944 Turbo conversion) in a 968 Coupe. All the factory production 968 Turbos were 8v cars, LSD, six-speed box.

The four examples of the 968 Turbo RS that were built were not a road cars: race only. They produced around 350 bhp in Le Mans trim. Frankly, with modern components, if you build a 3.0 litre 944 Turbo, your main problem is keeping it down to 350 bhp.

The factory 968 Turbo S was "only" 305 ps, call it 300 bhp, and did 175 mph. Frankly these were extraordinarily conservatively built cars - one might almost say timidly developed. as usual there was internal political pressure not to outshine the 911 flagship. A 3.0 litre 944T in its most basic form - standard boost, standard exhaust, standard turbo etc - delivers the same 300 bhp as the 968 Turbo S, and with only the lightest fettling you are well past the 350 bhp of the Turbo S.

A 944 Turbo runs out of revs in top gear shortly after 160 mph regardless of how much power you put in, and with 350 bhp the car would be capable of more than 170 mph with the right gearing. So if you wanted to do proper warp speed in this sort of car, i.e. unlimited Autobahn cruising with speeds of up to 170 mph, your best bet would the 968 six-speed transaxle with a bit of juggling with final drive ratios.


Going back to your shopping list: in your shoes I would look at examples of all of them, and simply buy the very best car in the very best condition that I could find, regardless of which model it turned out to be.
 
All the genuine 968 Turbo S were left hand drive and as Simon said there weren't more than 20 ever built. I saw one advertised on German Ebay last year for about 30,000 Euros if my memory serves me. There used to be one knocking around the UK trackday scene over 5 years ago, but I haven't seen it for ages, it was a dark metallic blue. There must be over twice as many 3L conversions around the world now and most of them blitz the factory figures with all sorts of modern bolt on go-faster goodies [8D]

The factory cars were woefully underdeveloped at 305bhp and 270lbft from a 3 litre 8v engine at 0.8bar boost. When Barry Hart dropped a 3 litre engine into a 944T but kept the boost at standard 0.8 bar he made 300bhp and a whopping 350lbft. My own 3.2L Turbo made 337bhp and 420lbft using the standard AFM and the Klaus Hoffman chips at 1bar of boost so there is huge potential out there.
 
Theres a white '968 Turbo RS prototype' for sale in America. The ad states that its a pre-production car - no price though.
 
ORIGINAL: Diver944
There used to be one knocking around the UK trackday scene over 5 years ago, but I haven't seen it for ages, it was a dark metallic blue.

I saw it today near Stuttgart. It now lives in Münich. Nice car...
 
So a 968 turbo s or rs is out of the question. thought as much anyway.

Ewan, I have heard people saying the right hand drive 993's were a little uncomfortable and the left hand drive ones did not have the side saddle driving position, is this something you can confirm?

TTM You often in Stuttgart? This is where I will be working for one week every month for the foreseeable future, been there three times so far while going through the hoops to get the job, will be popping back in the next week or two to go shopping an apartment there and exploring. So interested in any recommendations of places to stay in the short term and good places to eat or drink in the long term.

 
Sorry, I don't know much the city, have never spent any real time there. I just happen to drive through every once and then.
 
If I were you I'd stay in the Golden Leaf Hotel Stuttgart Zuffenhausen, its right next to the Porsche Museum in case you get some downtime for a visit?


Edd
 

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