996 Turbo

[sawood12]

996TT's or at least ones that sound worth it from the description, have only just dipped below the £40k mark. I've been watching with interest. So give it another 12 months or so and I reckon prices will depreciate further. I reckon 996TT prices are set to depreciate at a quicker rate than 993TT prices so if you think they are a bargain now, they'll be moreso as time goes on. 993TT's were made in fewer numbers and the 993 model is generally seen as the last of the old school 911's as it was the last air cooled model. That will always command an increasing premium as time goes on. 996's in comparison were mass produced so the basic rules of supply and demand will apply.

My experiances of Porsches in general is that milage is not really a consideration. The number one rule in all instances is buy on condition. I'd rather have a high milage car that has been well looked after over a low milage car that has been neglected any day of the week. I wouldn't automatically count out the £40k cars as a matter of course. They are at least worth a look - you never know, you might stumble across the bargain of the century. For example the asking price might be artificially low because the owner is worried there might be something wrong with it that might cost mega bucks to sort out - but if you are more clued up you might spot that it is a relatively minor and cheap problem to sort. The asking price is not an indication of condition - you still need to approach the expensive ones with as much suspicion as the apparently cheap ones.

Give it another couple of years of depreciation and hopefully i'll be in the market myself!! can't wait - they are an awsome car.

 

[Rintoul]

Sawood you may be right, only time will tell. However I do hope you predictions are wrong, because if you are correct and we see 996 cars across the range drop to similar levels of depreciation as most run of the mill cars (and some 996 models are getting very close) it could have several long term impacts on Porsche itself and ownership in general. Firstly the desirability of the 997 & future 998; as part of the attraction it is higher residuals (and therefore running costs). I am sure most new 996 buyers were hoping for residuals similar to past 911's. The fact that older 911's were still relatively expensive to other cars has maintained the kudos of owning a Porsche.If the 996 depreciates rapidly then the same must apply to the 997. Not wanting to sound like a rich snob (which I am not) but if we really do get to a situation where the flagship model can be bought for buttons then the whole cache of Porsche ownership changes as anyone can have one. Thus the desirability of cars like Ferrari, Aston and even Maserati become greater. Yes performance is important, but it is not everthing because if it was we would all be driving some Japanese hot rocket or a Noble. (The new Nissan at £60k looks like an absolute performance bargain... and with 3 years warranty). I agree it all comes down to supply and demand which to a great degree can be influenced by the motoring press. I had a new 944Turbo and lost a stack of money despite it being a brilliant car. In my opinion Porsche have pushed the GT3 and RS to the detriment of the TT that you now never hear about and yet if you try to by one of those cars they are generally not available. (Not when I tried to order one a year ago anyway). I had one guy come up to me at Knockhill as he walked around the car he admired it and said wow is it a GT3, he then saw the badge and said oh, its only a Turbo!I must say it doesn't encourage me to take a dive on my 2004 996tt to then pay £106k with options for a new 997tt if it is heading the same way. When you offer me buttons for it, say next year I may a well keep it and get a Nissan with the difference to change. Makes you think. However if the 997tt has also dived by then, I may be tempted (with a low mileage one).

 

[SCOTJC]

ORIGINAL: Rintoul
However if the 997tt has also dived by then, I may be tempted (with a low mileage one).

can't see how the 997 will be any different to the 996tt other than a little worse. The 997 turbo's not had as good reviews on tv/mags etc as the 996 had which was probably regarded as the best a to b car for a number of years. The gt3 seems to have stolen a bit of its thunder on the 997's with it being a bit more useable day to day and providing a better option for some at a cheaper price (also in limited numbers to help residuals!). But i do remember that 996 turbos were pretty steady residual wise until a few years into the run and then dropped heavily so next years a bit optimistic in my opinion for a 997 at realistic money when changing from a 996 eg paying roughly 60-65k for the new turbo. All imho[]

 

[Rintoul]

Hi Scot, I am sure you are right re next year as 997tt deleivery is currently at 12 months, but as soon as 998 announced??? Also to take into account of course is the Audi R8/ R10. I suspect audi will restrict supply and whilst there are cars at liittle over list there seems to be some people willing to pay £105k. ie in preference to a 997tt. Can,t help but think the R10 will blitz everything. All good for the Audi image and residuals.

 

[SCOTJC]

i know what your saying about the 998 being released but the turbo's, gt3's etc are quite a bit after the new models released so i don't think it affects them as much straight away. Whats the release date for 998's as i thought they were releasing a facelift next year so that would delay it too? Also the 996 turbo never had a facelift so it'll be interesting to see what they do with the 997 or not as the case might be and how it affects the residuals![]

 

[sawood12]

Part of me hopes I am wrong also but the part of me that despirately wants a 996 turbo hopes i'm right! It seems to me that Porsche is more interested in selling brand new cars and lots of high-premium options and extended warranties. They've obviously made the decision to go the mass-market route, which they probably have to just to survive and maintain the brand credability, however I can't see how they will be able to sustain the dual role of championing the enthusiasts cause with a mass produced product, as inevitably the higher numbers of the model will depreciate prices and there will be a greater proportion of 'brand seekers' owning them instead of enthusiasts. It might be the case that the thing that has the greatest effect on 911 prices is that the model is discontinued by Porsche in favour of the mid-engined Cayman. Although i've just comitted blasphemy, if that were to happen i'd expect prices to go through the roof.

 

[tallmat]

The comparison 993 -996 -997 is valid, and if you watched 993tt values as I did whille pursuing one, it plummeted after 996 was introduced then hardened again as it acquired a semi classic status being last of the air cooled turbos. Supply is finite and it now has a solid 'base value' with very low mileage examples correspondingly higher.

Same will happen to 996 - Sawood I doubt it'll get much lower unless there's some global oil crisis like in the 70s. The car has a huge following and there's nothing else you can get for the same money that delivers the same combination of astonishing performance and everyday useability. Any Ferrari or Lambo of the same age / price is a bold step unless you've very deep pockets... Look how the 456 values has fallen because of it's mega running costs.

James, I think it's wise to lift your budget to mid forties, go for something which has documented provenance and get peace of mind.

 

[John_Ward]

Not really a contribution to the debate, but at this years Silverstone Classic ( July ) I met a 996 turbo owner who had just bought his example through an OPC for £45k. Sensible miles, nice colour, and a warranty as well.
If you keep your eyes open there are bargains to be had - and for that money, a 996 turbo takes a lot of beating in the performance stakes.

 

[PGAdamopoulos]

996tt (X50) is one of the best supercars around and the best value for money.
The only problems I ever had was with the cooling system, 3 rads and the hose after eaxpansion tank.
Consider a LHD, even if you are not going to keep the car for ever.
Bench-mark values at: http://www.mobile.de/home/index.html#0
[][][]

 

[beavercraig]

I have a 997TT on order and I'm not worried. I have been told by a number of sources that Porsche are to reduce their overall build numbers for 2008 in order to protect current residuals and profits. They also want to make sure they have enough capacity for the Panamera. Also there is still some need to balance 993tt prices with 996tt prices. I really can't see prices falling any more without hitting 993tt prices. Its still a fantastic car with few, if any faults.

 

[sjd]

I can add little other than to say that at a visit to Bob Watson he had a 996T in for a minor water leak - this had turned into a major strip-down job to get to the pipework. He also described a previous situation where he had to do an entire engine-out to get to a leaking water-pipe. This just made me think that if I did ever consider any 996 I would probably want a good warranty...

Simon

 

[Gordon Attar]

As mentioned earlier the 996 T is still suffering a bit on the depreciation front compared to the 993TT which is actually appreciating. I got into a bit of bovver recently on Piston heads posting that the 50 to 70k MY2000 models were trading around £30k give or take a grand or two, so they probably bottom out at about £33-5k retail, which isnt to disimilar to where the 993TT bottomed out, though there is quite a lot more of them in circulation!

Like all Turbo's the car are so over engineered that they tend to be the most reliable model in the range, though the whole 996 range has a radiator weakness as PGAdam... mentioned and Turbo's tend to go through clutches a bit faster c50k. Just make sure the car has a FSH, have it PDI'd, for safety take out the Porsche warranty for protection against a big bill watch out for cars that have been excessively tracked over modified (go for X50 if your likely to get the upgrade twitch, we all do), bucket seats are a bad sign, as well as several clutches.

 

[Rodney Naghar]

I got into a bit of bovver recently on Piston heads posting that the 50 to 70k MY2000 models were trading around £30k give or take a grand or two,

I read that thread with great interest....a real pack of wolves on Pistonheads..u did well there! []

 

[Gordon Attar]

I was only telling the truth....... havent told them yet that it was sold for and it was well under £30k!!! but it will need a new clutch and some paintwork for chips as its a dark met colour. I'm waiting for it to appear at a traders and I will update the thread!!!!! as there was some absolute pr%ts on the thread and Henry Firman was being a bit of a twit, he would have this car up for over £40k.

Personally have absolutely no problems with 996TT, hell of a car for the money just prefer the looks of the J-Lo model.

 

[Grant]

Lots of sensible advice already, personally I'd try for an 02 MY (C16 - RHD UK spec) onwards purely because it has a few extras as standard & any early niggles (the car was introduced 2000 MY) are ironed out.
The cars are very reliable without any major issues, but are very expensive should things go wrong, best ensure a full Porsche check over & add an £850-ish years OPC warranty... money well spent for peace of mind!
I had nearly 4 years of fabulous fun with my 996TT & early £40ks will get one fabulous 02 car, grunt, grip & go, but also a good GT with all the toys!
Go for it!

 

[Guest]

Thanks for all the advice!

I have definately decided that this is the correct car for me. If anyone has one that fits the bill that are thinking of selling, now may be a good time to make themselves known to me

I have my eye on a couple, though at the mo my only other conundrum is tiptronic or manual.

The manual would be my first choice, though the tips seem to be a lot cheaper to buy in the first place - this could allow me a slightly newer car.

JJ

 

[h20mrv]

hi all,

i have had my 996 turbo for 4 months now and am loving every min! i went to orkney via john o groats from my home in edinburgh and lust loved every min i was behind the wheel the overtaking was just amazing!! and the grip on the twisties is superb! mind you i have fitted gt3 brakes with pagid yellow pads / aeroquips / dot 5.1 as i was not happy with the std brakes,
i did have (and still have in the garage) oem gt2 wheels and tires, but i have now fitted 997 turbo wheels and tires (ps2s) and love the look and feel of the car !!

go buy one!! you wont regret it!!

 

[whoisit]

I definately wanted & bought a manual. While i was looing there were many tips about. I would not be surprised if tiptronic was the majority transmission during the cars life cycle? I now have a B&M ss kit fitted and the shift is great.

 

[Guest]

John - you were looking for volunteers for the GT Porsche article - I have a Nov 2004 996 Turbo S - pic attached. I love the car - any use for the mag?

 

[John_Ward]

ORIGINAL: bobfletcher

John - you were looking for volunteers for the GT Porsche article - I have a Nov 2004 996 Turbo S - pic attached. I love the car - any use for the mag?

You needed to liaise directly with them, but I think that you'll find they are past their copy date now.