996 Turbo

[Rintoul]

High, just to open the debate further,...Lots of 996 tts out there ,I agree, but actually not that many if you are a really driver.(ie who can gte 29k out of a set of front tyres???? I am lucky to get 4/5k out of rears and 7/8K out of fronts . Rule out standard automatic cars, ( see running reports, where car was only kept for a year and replaced by a GT3). As a driver I firmly beleive that the X50 kit is essential, same torque as GT2 (well basically same engine held back by ecu by 20bhp or so) and it definitely makes a difference, that is if you really want performance it does make a difference over a stanard tt[], ignore what other say there is no turbo lag when driving it as it should be. . (Or do they think the new GT2[8D] at 530 bhp makes no difference). Also you can (Ihaven't yet) easily boost the X50 up to that 530bhp at fairly low cost as it has all the bits already fitted. If you want more feed back and involvement also go for the sports suspension as it transforms the feel of the car, much sharper and more involved, less understeer/roll. Also go for the Aerokit, a bit impractial due to low clearance, but it does look the business and (apparently) gives greater stability at high speed. By the time you then list your colour choice, trim, age, mileage, full PSH and main dealer supply with warranty, you will find you choice is quite limited. Stands back as all the auto boys disagree[&:]

 

[SCOTJC]

heres some previous posts on them.
http://www.porscheclubgbforum.com/tm.asp?m=331930&mpage=1&key=&#333872
http://www.porscheclubgbforum.com/tm.asp?m=331913&mpage=1&key=x50&#332364

and mho from one of the links above.
"i recomend trying an x50 and std one as close together as you can. I didn't feel the x50 pack was worth that much more to me than a std car, although if a good x50 had come up i wouldn't have turned it down either if that makes sense! The x50's definately the way to go if you plan big mods, but imho theres not a huge difference between them, eg subarus with prodrive packs are more noticeable gains. Another thing to remeber is that x50 packs would have to be noted by your insurance company and this made quite a bit of difference in the quotes i got[]"

 

[Rintoul]

For insurance try Academy (who advertise in Porsche Post) no extra loading for me on any of the X50, areokit, suspension etc as they were all standard Porsche upgrade options. Also they have been really competitive on the other 2 cars that we have now moved to them as well. Obviously still open to debate regarding X50 or standard, but IMHO the extra mid range torque of the X50 is worth it (you also get a stronger gearbox) particul;arly when overtaking. Also only the ECU is limiting the bhp over the 485 of the GT2, the torque figure is the same, therefore an easy uprgarde if you need more power. I suspect that as with most cars over 400bhp there will not seem that much in it on a short test drive, until you get used to the car, on a road you know, when you can really use the performance. Adamcribben, whether it is absolutley standard or spec'd up, you will definitely not be disappointed. Just make sure you know what style of driving you prefer, GT or Sports, as modifications do alter their character, feel and response considerably.

 

[adamcribben]

Thanks

i am looking at a 02 std manual car tomorrow, low miles but has had a few owners. It will be interesting to see how it measures up. I had a 964 turbo 10 years ago and i though then that it was a very fast car, i think because it was the 1st time i had driven a turbo. Things have moved on and i am older now so it has to be a good car to impress. The x50 does give you a more, if i dont get the buzz from this i know ill have to look at an x50

 

[911turbo]

hi all, can i also get some advice on buyng a 996tt? the black/black car i am look at is great (has the 997 turbo wheels) and drives well (albeit all i have ever owned previously is a boxster and my old ferrari 348 was a totally different game altogether). car passed general inspection (from RAC, not OPC, as i could not schedule correct time with them) but not under porsche warranty. former owner told me that if the belt 'squeeks' a little (maybe every 500-1,000miles) then he always put some copper slip (or some other relatively heavy lubricant) on the belt. is this a 'legitimate' turbo owners tip, or was he simply disguising some larger problem? thanks for any help.

ps. also read here that the small, odd bit of smoke on start-up after cold is ok and probably means just a bit of oil in the turbo as not cooled down correctly after a good run. assuming it is just a bit of a puff at start up (and not every time), but does not persist after that initial puff, then this is ok too?

 

[beavercraig]

agreed. expect some smoke on start up. its just oil in the turbo's.nothing to worry about.

Also I would avoid an X50. Its not worth the extra cash and has alot more lag.
Best go for a low mileage standard car with FPSH.

ps
Mine is up for sale with 27k on the clock

 

[ChrisW]

Except that the X50 makes it a completely different and more focussed performance car.

I believe, better suspension, stronger gearbox, K24 Turbos and all the good stuff required to take the power up to 600bhp should that ever be of use.

Numbers are also far more limited, so values will be much higher --- in time.

 

[Rodney Naghar]

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

Except that the X50 makes it a completely different and more focussed performance car.

I believe, better suspension, stronger gearbox, K24 Turbos and all the good stuff required to take the power up to 600bhp should that ever be of use.

Numbers are also far more limited, so values will be much higher --- in time.

I believe the X50 was just a £9k option - bigger turbos and a re-map, 30bhp and more torque. The clutch plate might have also been different, but that's all. It also suffers from more turbo lag, so although you get faster acceleration above road legal speeds, it isn't any faster 0-60.

 

[ChrisW]

I don't believe this is correct.

 

[Rodney Naghar]

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

I don't believe this is correct.

You are right,my original source was obviously not as good as Stuart Martin (where is he these days?)
it is as follows:-

X50 £8,709.10 Performance kit (includes modified turbos, intercoolers, ECU and gearbox, 331 kW (450bhp))

 

[ChrisW]

But I also am incorrect if there are no suspension mods []

I love this dialogue []

 

[richard hall]

hi just to add to the mix
as you will all know when porsche quote hp figures for their modifcations they are always conservative

when i was looking for a 996 turbo s I came across these figures from Loren on Renntech.org
they are specific for the engine codes for the 996

m9670-642 420 hp standard car
m9670-643 462hp X50
m9670-645 483hp Turbo s and i also believe the GT2

you will find your engine code in the vin sticker in your service book
check out the link
http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=12027&start=0&p=75094&#entry75094

 

[beavercraig]

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

Except that the X50 makes it a completely different and more focussed performance car.

I believe, better suspension, stronger gearbox, K24 Turbos and all the good stuff required to take the power up to 600bhp should that ever be of use.

Numbers are also far more limited, so values will be much higher --- in time.

Buy a std turbo and spend the rest of the money on driving lessons!

 

[JBL930]

If you're buying a 911 turbo because it's the most reliable super car, and you want to enjoy it for what it is/should be, buy a manual X50 and nothing else.
If you want a 911 turbo to fanny around in and pose, get whichever one you want

 

[ChrisW]

ORIGINAL: beavercraig

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

Except that the X50 makes it a completely different and more focussed performance car.

I believe, better suspension, stronger gearbox, K24 Turbos and all the good stuff required to take the power up to 600bhp should that ever be of use.

Numbers are also far more limited, so values will be much higher --- in time.

Buy a std turbo and spend the rest of the money on driving lessons!

I am actually taking lessons from Tim Arnold and others, but in something much more track focussed than a 996 Turbo X50 --- though I'm still not sure what your point is ?

 

[adamcribben]

hi tony

sorry i have not replied, i have been away for a while

i bought a std 05 turbo tip

i have been using it for a couple of months and have just decided to sell as i do not like the tip box

i will now decide what i fancy next

 

[beavercraig]

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

ORIGINAL: beavercraig

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

Except that the X50 makes it a completely different and more focussed performance car.

I believe, better suspension, stronger gearbox, K24 Turbos and all the good stuff required to take the power up to 600bhp should that ever be of use.

Numbers are also far more limited, so values will be much higher --- in time.

Buy a std turbo and spend the rest of the money on driving lessons!

I am actually taking lessons from Tim Arnold and others, but in something much more track focussed than a 996 Turbo X50 --- though I'm still not sure what your point is ?

My point is, after two years of ownership my std turbo on 420bhp still feels frighteningly fast on public roads, it feels no slower than my 997 turbo even chasing a new nissan R35 the other day, and therefore spending extra cash on an X50 with an extra 60bhp or a tuned X50 with another 150bhp is of no real value in real terms unless your heading towards the track. If so then a turbo is the wrong choice of car anyway.

A few quid on lessons from an experienced racing driver cut my lap times the last time I was on track far more than extra BHP!
I have a friend with a Boxster S who is constantly asked what he has done to his car as he regularly stays with guys in alot faster more powerful cars on track. His answer is "nothing, I just learned to drive!"

 

[Zeroh]

ORIGINAL: beavercraig

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

ORIGINAL: beavercraig

ORIGINAL: ChrisW

Except that the X50 makes it a completely different and more focussed performance car.

I believe, better suspension, stronger gearbox, K24 Turbos and all the good stuff required to take the power up to 600bhp should that ever be of use.

Numbers are also far more limited, so values will be much higher --- in time.

Buy a std turbo and spend the rest of the money on driving lessons!

I am actually taking lessons from Tim Arnold and others, but in something much more track focussed than a 996 Turbo X50 --- though I'm still not sure what your point is ?

My point is, after two years of ownership my std turbo on 420bhp still feels frighteningly fast on public roads, it feels no slower than my 997 turbo even chasing a new nissan R35 the other day, and therefore spending extra cash on an X50 with an extra 60bhp or a tuned X50 with another 150bhp is of no real value in real terms unless your heading towards the track. If so then a turbo is the wrong choice of car anyway.

A few quid on lessons from an experienced racing driver cut my lap times the last time I was on track far more than extra BHP!
I have a friend with a Boxster S who is constantly asked what he has done to his car as he regularly stays with guys in alot faster more powerful cars on track. His answer is "nothing, I just learned to drive!"

Fair enough on the driving skill point - totally agree in fact..... however, once you've learnt to drive you'll then be in a much better position to exploit the extra kick of the X50 []

Not sure if you're tt is stock, but the stock 420tt's i've been feel significantly slower than a 997tt.... the x50 is laggier for sure than the k16 car but on boost it is as fast as a 997tt if my car is anything to go by. On two seperate dyno's its made over 470hp. Also, if you wanna tune it you do have a better platform, primarily the stronger clutch plate and GT2 intercoolers.

Finally, given the price disparity between the x50 and non x50 cars is now so little, i'm suprised this isnt a no-brainer already.

 

[ChrisW]

In fact, I was driving with a friend at Spa for the PCF days.

My car has an extra 40BHP over his Cup car, and he doesn't, generally, hang around.

His comment after I had overtaken him at some considerable speed difference out of Stavelot towards Blanchimont, was that my extra power was CERTAINLY showing.

Agreed however that the standard 996 Turbo is very accomplished on the road.

But then arguing against the X50 is like arguing against the 997 Turbo over the 996 Turbo.

Why did you buy yours --- if the 996 Turbo was doing the job ?