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PADM disabled message on my 718 GT4 - it seems Porsche still haven't sorted this out!

I appreciate that in most cases we are talking about fairly new cars here. But I have it on my 2015 car and from the various threads it seems I may be on borrowed time!

As the cars get older and out of warranty I wonder whether there is an option to junk the system and go back to solid mounts, a bit like changing PSM adaptive damping for a coil over set up.

 
JohnCRS said:
I appreciate that in most cases we are talking about fairly new cars here. But I have it on my 2015 car and from the various threads it seems I may be on borrowed time!

As the cars get older and out of warranty I wonder whether there is an option to junk the system and go back to solid mounts, a bit like changing PSM adaptive damping for a coil over set up.

2013 here John, from what I can deduce this is the 2nd time in its life that this part will have been replaced, it looks like the previous owner fitted a salvage part which lasted a few years. I think the issue you would have is with coding it out of the system to stop a constant fault indication but I am sure someone out there could do it. There is a fair sized control unit sitting in the rear wing on the drivers side for the PADM system.

 
I saw that in parts list and wondered what it was, given that all GT4s have PADM from the factory unless some markets don't for some reason?

 
US perhaps ... as link is $US and the ww.Manualslib.com owners manual I have shows - Dynamic Engine Mounting (PADM) On vehicles with Sport Chrono package

As you say UK has it as a standard part, my car`s manual only shows - Dynamic Engine Mounting (PADM)

 
JohnCRS said:
I appreciate that in most cases we are talking about fairly new cars here. But I have it on my 2015 car and from the various threads it seems I may be on borrowed time!

As the cars get older and out of warranty I wonder whether there is an option to junk the system and go back to solid mounts, a bit like changing PSM adaptive damping for a coil over set up.

John,

$700 vs $120 is a hefty premium for an active engine mount. I would expect that it would be a straight swap if you wanted to replace the active mount, with no dynamic downside, but some sort of terminator would be required for the cable connectors to emulate the mounts and not throw up a warning message.

Jeff

 
Its just another factor to consider in the ongoing ownership conundrum. If I were planning on keeping the car for myself and rack up the miles, I could be tempted by the 'sod it, mod it' approach, rather than replacing these expensive components knowing that there is every chance they have a limited shelf life. The same goes for PASM and some other systems which I believe are all interconnected through the ECU anyway. Salvage is another option but it comes with uncertainty. You would definitely need a Porsche specialist with a good knowledge of the systems.

 
I agree John.

I'm thinking if one goes after my 3yr warranty has run out I'll switch to a Manthey passive suspension package and non-active transmission mounts if they're available somewhere. In for a penny, in for a pound!

 
Chaps,

This sort of problem does throw up concerns for long-term ownership, but it’s common across the whole industry as vehicles increasing become more electronically complex. Manufacturers are only interested in short-term reliability during the factory warranty period; beyond that it’s the owner’s responsibility to take out an insurance-based extended warranty should they wish to do so.

Maybe there’s a good business case for electronics specialists who can cater for system repairs/upgrades?

Jeff

 
AndrewCS said:
Porsche Cayman GT4 (2016 - 2016) - Engine. Threaded joint. Transmission suspension. > Porsche PET Online > Nemiga.com (nemigaparts.com)

... shows two items with a significant price difference hence appears that a non active unit can be fitted ?

The PET file for the non GT4 cars is the same apart from some numbering

3 981 375 059 04 Hydraulic mount I140 ... active

(3) 981 375 049 02 Hydraulic mount -I140 ... non active

Italics ... my words and not from the file

I'm totally confused why a non-active part is listed on the GT4 PET file:

Active, $1240.93 "With gt4, with dynamic mount":

https://www.europeanoempartsdirect.com/oem-parts/porsche-hydro-mounting-98137505983

Non-active, $222.77, "Without active suspension, without active suspension. Without gt4, without dynamic mount.":

https://www.europeanoempartsdirect.com/oem-parts/porsche-trans-mount-98137504902

Madness! :ROFLMAO:

 
Motorhead said:
Chaps,

This sort of problem does throw up concerns for long-term ownership, but it’s common across the whole industry as vehicles increasing become more electronically complex. Manufacturers are only interested in short-term reliability during the factory warranty period; beyond that it’s the owner’s responsibility to take out an insurance-based extended warranty should they wish to do so.

Maybe there’s a good business case for electronics specialists who can cater for system repairs/upgrades?

Jeff
I think there is something in there being insufficient volume for specialists to invest in solutions, and also in Porsche's natural desire to retain everything within the company and network. Replace rather than repair is a better business model if the market is sufficiently well funded to support it. These systems are not designed to be fixed. So a sensor within a PDM module necessitates replacement of the whole unit, just as a slipping clutch pack requires a new PDK box.

 
Just to note that PADM uses the magnetorheological fluid approach rather than the electronically activated valving used in PASM:

Porsche Active Drivetrain Mounts are filled with magnetorheological fluid containing microscopic iron particles. Each mount contains two chambers, with a circular slot that allows the fluid to pass between the top and bottom chambers. At the centre is a doughnut-shaped electromagnet, which is used to control the fluid’s viscosity.

At low engine speeds, the fluid flows freely to provide a more comfortable driving experience. However, the voltage that reaches the electromagnetic is controlled by the ECU, with the map based predominantly on engine speed.

As the engine rpm increases, so does the electromagnet’s voltage, creating a stronger magnetic field. This increases the chains of aligned iron particles, decreasing the fluid’s viscosity. Eventually, these chains render the mount solid.

This technology has been used for many years in suspension dampers which you’d have thought experience a much more punishing environment than engine mounts, although the latter probably will be subjected to a wider frequency range of inputs. If the electronics are external to the mounts (via the ECU and a PADM electronic module) there’s not much to go wrong within the mount other than a coil or associated wiring failure … but maybe I’m missing something?

Jeff

 
Nope, I suspect the coil/wiring shorts out. I assume it's much finer than that in a shock absorber given that the PADM mount is so much smaller?

 
An interesting thread. Sorry to hear about your PADM problems David.

Regarding the "spirited driving" element, both my 718 Cayman 2.5t cars were tracked fairly frequently and subjected to very spirited driving without any PADM issues. Both were PDK, not the manual gearbox versions. I used manual shifting mostly and zapped the gear shifts at maximum revs during my many track day laps at Knockhill.

I would also find it hard to accept that spirited driving had anything to do with the PADM issue, more like a sudden torque jolt overloading of the units under certain dynamic conditions. Be interesting if this fault applies to manual cars rather than PDK versions.

I hope you get your problem sorted out ok before the track day season commences.

Brian



 
Twinfan said:
Nope, I suspect the coil/wiring shorts out. I assume it's much finer than that in a shock absorber given that the PADM mount is so much smaller?
I would have thought that the hydro-mount diameter is greater than the arrangement in a damper Dave … it’s quite a big unit.

Anyway, it is what it is and hopefully the replacement is more durable. All very annoying though.

Jeff

 
Cheers guys, interesting tech talk [:)]

I'll report back on Monday once my OPC have diagnosed the problem...

 
Not a lot of people know this…. but when writing Active Supension (DSC) maps for Bilstein (PASM) dampers,

you’d reduce the voltage to get harder damping e.g.

Normal ride mapping range softest 1500mA to hardest 500 mA

Sport might be from 1000mA to 450mA..

whereas

the “engine” mounts run softest 500mA to hardest 2000mA

One hopes the factory hasn’t gotten confused…

 
Yeah I spotted this while programming my DSC controller. Its why the shocks go to rock hard if the system fails. I would have thought that all thats needed to block out the PADM units is a suitable resistor to match that of the coil, would be interesting to measure a failed one and a new one.

 
As I suspected, it's an internal failure of the transmission mount on the driver's side - the pressure sensor signal is going to ground. This is apparently the usual diasgnostic message given when these parts fail.

Should be a quick fix tomorrow once the part arrives, it's all covered under warranty and I'll have the car back for the Easter weekend. Awesome [:D]

 
Thats good news that the car will be sorted in time for Easter ! Hopefully this is the last time the PADM issue raises its head for you.

 

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