Something i have been working on!

[333pg333]

Not sure what mods you can do in your series? Can you go up to larger calipers and rotors? Are they solid rotors or other? What pads are you using?
I am getting some full floating front rotors with slotting next week. I found that while the cross drilled ones from the 965 really help in dissipating
the gases which in turn makes the long brake travel abate somewhat, they crack too easily. So I'm trying these. They will be lighter as well which is
a good thing too.

I found that the factory 40% LSD wouldn't stand up to trackwork and needed rebuilding pretty regularly. See how you go, otherwise there are options.

 

[MarkK]

My plan for the minute is just stick to standard and change the discs as and when, i really want to stick with sixteen inch wheels for the time being and bigger calipers means going to 17inch wheels,the discs are solids standard m030(Pagid yellow pads),they have done two track days,a test day,2 qualifying sessions,and two races,without mercy so for now anyway i am going to stick to these.Will be interesting to see how the diff holds up[8|]...

 

[333pg333]

Sounds like a good idea. With the lightness of your car and perhaps budget ([]) it's probably good to curtail the spending for now.

 

[Peter Empson]

Don't know how I missed the updates to this thread, but all I can belatedly add is congratulations Mark, what a great result! I had hoped I'd be able to get along to the first round to spectate but have been a bit too busy more's the pity. I'll try to catch up with you at one of the races, do you have a diary of the race dates to hand?

 

[edh]

Standard 030 brakes work really well with the right pads & good cooling - particularly with a lighter car

Discs are consumables [] - cheaper than pads anyway, and wear quicker than a set of pads if you use PF97's ...I was very impressed with the Sebro ones from Bert, which didn't show any signs of cracking after a year of road / track use when I swapped them for new last year

 

[u63af]

That would be amazing if you could. Cheers.

ORIGINAL: 944 man

ORIGINAL: u63af

Do any of you guys know the dimensions of where I need to cut the hole. I have never taken the torsion bar out so dont know if it comes straight out or whether it drops down a bit first. Dont want to cut holes in the wrong place. []

Yes, I have a pattern somewhere. When I dig it out I will make a copy and post it off to you, if you like? Be aware that I am notoriously slack though.....

 

[MarkK]

Thanks Peter[]The Classic sports car club website has a diary of race meets if you fancy coming along and want dates,there was all manner of racing going on last weekend from things like Ferrari classic,Ferrari open,Morgan Aero race series,plus all the stuff the Classic car club runs.Lots to watch a fun day out!
Thanks Ed,the guy that bought your turbo popped by and said hello this evening at Brands(there was an evening on)plus another guy off here aswell,had my bannana discs changed and like you say the pads were hardly touched (Pagid yellows) i have fitted a set of PF pads though just to compare and got to say i think i prefer them they seem easier to measure/modulate when slowing the car down?Just curious whether they hold up as well as the Pagids in a 40 min race...Anyone got any experience of these when racing?Changed tyres on right hand side aswell(lefts hardly touched), car ran nice this evening although i think i screwed the pressures up...Brands Indy seems quite technical,i can imagine its interesting in a race[&:]

 

[paulf968]

Mark hi.
Right decision to get off those Pagid yellows -- I am just ahead of you and I'm finding PF pads good myself. Using a set of 97's on the front, done 3 full test/trackdays and two 30 minute races - probably half worn, so they'll last your races no prob AND I am finding a lot less disc glazing and judder issues ie no issues at all. Probably go for them on the back as well soon.

What sort of tyre pressures are you aiming for? IMO never let them get over 30psi hot in my car, I think we spoke about this at Silverstone.

Any idea what sort of lap times you might be able to do when you go back racing at Brands? of course, you weren't timing this evening! NB fastest race time in the Club races at Brands last weekend was a 54.2 for Mark McAleer in a 968, my best was a 55.4

 

[MarkK]

[]Mr Follet sir!! I was hoping you would come along!Thanks for that! i find like you the yellows judder a bit and seem to destroy the disc...someone said something to me about the PF pads showering metal particles not being good for ABS sensors????I really like them,still got Pagid blues in the back,car seemed to like it,i was just worried they wouldn't stand the pounding but if you say they will that puts my mind at rest,are they ok when they get stinking hot?paddock hill bend is a bit hard on them...!?!Those are very quick times i need some weight to come off the car and sharpish!!running out of time...[&:]

 

[paulf968]

What else could you take out? Peter E is the resident expert on such matters!
3 thoughts:
-One thing might be a racing gel type battery eg from Braille. I think they are great, roughly speaking they weigh in lbs what an ordinary battery weighs in kg -- no problem starting the car even though they are so small, frankly I was surprised. I have mine in the footwell behind where the pass seat would be, so less cable required as well.
-Then its got to be a plastic rear hatch! assuming the regs for your competition allow it (NB cannot do it in PCGB though) -- could always retain the std one if a glass hatch is required elsewhere one day.
-Final thought for tonight is the exhaust, is it thin walled stainless throughout? if not a load of weight can be saved there.

 

[DivineE]

I was thinking about the alternator the other day. That's a heavy mother of a lump. Could a mini one be installed in its place? Or none at all if you trailer the car? < not sure about that though I like that your 944 is the arrive and drive type.

Also whilst your on the brakes the standard M030 are seriously weighty compared with more modern AP racing type kits. Perhaps something like that would be a good option or ceramics 2nd hand from someone who's car came with them and they were put off by horror stories so swapped to steel disks when the ceramics were still fine? Not sure how much they go for though, even 2nd hand!

 

[Neil Haughey]

Great to here about the PF pads. I love the BHP XPS pads I have in mine but I recall sometime ago now they discontinued them to concentrate on race car only pads so I will need to move to something else when they wear out. The PF pads for my S2 cost about 1/2 what the Pagids cost.

 

[Peter Empson]

I have driven for 45+ minutes on track with my Porterfields (I believe very similar to the PF's and arguably much better value), and apart from a slightly longer pedal after about 30 mins I had no worries about fade (no brake cooling ducts either) and I was pushing pretty hard for a trackday. So I think you'll find them to be perfectly fine (there's a proper race version of the Porterfields which work even better at higher temps but are a little more tricky for road use, although they're certainly not unsafe).

I've been looking at the alternator as a good way to save a few kilos, I've not found anything off the shelf that is known to fit but have the details at home (if I can find them) of a firm that offers a huge range of lightweight models and I was planning to work through the catalogue to see what will fit this year. I'd be interested to know if this is within the regs of your series however as some seem terribly restrictive.

 

[Neil Haughey]

ISTR the 968 CS had a smaller lighter alternator. I also seem to recall that the stock 968 alternator is the same one fitted to the Ford Scorpio.

 

[MarkK]

Thanks for all the suggestions![]
Really like the battery idea,how many goes do u get at starting with it??
With regards to the plastic hatch how does the loss of weight at the back affect the weight bias of the car?I love this idea but someone has spooked me saying it can throw the balance off......?,whats the verdict Peter??
A cheap idea for the exhaust would be a de- cat so u lose the middle silencer weight but retain the standard look of the rear and not too noisy??
Problem with changing calipers are they need to fit under 16 unch wheels for now,budget has gone pretty much for this year,need to keep a couple of dollars back for repairs like this clutch[]
Anyone got any opinions on Anglesey,how easy is it to learn,straight forward or not??

 

[sawood12]

There was a guy on Rennlist who fitted an alternator off a Honda Civic or something like that. You need to strip alot of the electrical gear out as it isn't man enough to run alot, but the benefit was that it was just the right shape to fit in with little or no modification to anything i.e. the pulley was the right diameter and shape for the stock belt. Can't remember how much weight it saved.

Also GTS style headlights save alot of weight and cutting out the spare wheel well will save some also.

Moving to a 220bhp transaxel with an aftermarket diff and no oil cooler will save about 15kg's.

What about ditching the first exhaust silencer, cat and venting the wastegate to atmosphere to take some weight and complexity out of the exhaust system?

What about a modern smaller but more efficent radiator to reduce the size and weight of the rad and reduce water capacity?

I don't know what you've doen with the dash, but what about cutting it in half and ditching the passenger side of it. Wont look pretty I know, but if you're looking for weight savings you've got to be ruthless.

 

[Neil Haughey]

If no longer a road car I would just follow the pattern of most racers
- remove PAS gubbins and pack rack with grease then patch across the rack connections
- completely gut passenger door and pin up window
- remove headlights completely and use FG panel (the one with indentations to look like you have headlights when you don't), still road legal but daytime running only
- lighten exhaust system as much as possible as Paul mentioned, stock system is very heavy

if rules allow plastic rear hatch and side windows will save a ton of weight. The rear hatch is amazingly heavy.

 

[Peter Empson]

ORIGINAL: MarkK

With regards to the plastic hatch how does the loss of weight at the back affect the weight bias of the car?I love this idea but someone has spooked me saying it can throw the balance off......?,whats the verdict Peter??

I've heard this said too and in my experience I'd say it's complete loblocks*.

It does save circa 10kg, and it's located high up in the car but I'd guess that the position of the weight is centered towards 3/4 of the length of the car (unlike the battery for example, which as others have said is another good 10kg saving and from pretty far back). I had the car corner weighted many times and even with all the changes it's remained pretty consistent each time.

*I have only ever run the plastic rear hatch with the 968T spoiler. I do know that running without the spoiler is quite unpleasent, resulting in a real loss of stability when pushing on. There might be a downforce benefit with this spoiler compared to the standard one, which is making up for some loss due to a slight change in weight distribution. It seems unlikely to me, but might explain why people have said it (however I can't help wondering if it was started by someone who like me couldn't get the rubber spoiler to fit and ran without it and then came to the wrong conclusion...).

 

[lali]

Mark top job Sir!!

I was getting live text reports from Paz on the day and I've just got round to checking stuff on here.

With respect to to your weight saving during races.... I'd start with taking the passenger seat out!!! thats a free mod for you!

keep it sticky side down and I'll see you at Brands on the 8/9th.

 

[MarkK]

Thanks Lali[], I think there was a bit of luck involved,plus the car ran great thanks to hard work from the boys at EMC,and Alex was nothing short of brilliant on telling me what to do aswell,if he wouldn't have been there i would not have done half aswell -the pitstop went really well and i was not loooking forward to that,very chuffed... but its ancient history as Brands approaches and i have a feeling its not an easy place to race at[8|],so tricky when the track is empty so with a grid full of cars it will be chockablocka!Fun though,see you there[]