What do I get for membership?

[zcacogp]

Chaps,

A contentious one here.

I'm not a PCGB member. I am, however, a heavy user of this forum.

What do I get for membership? I ask because I was in debate last weekend with a friend who owns a (non-functional) 928, who is a PCGB member but is in the process of cancelling his membership. He showed me a copy of Porsche Post, which he considers as the only plus point of membership although he has never been impressed with it. To be honest, I can understand why - sure, it was an OK magazine about Porsches but had very little of interest to either a 928 or a 944 owner. There was a 944 column, (well) written by Paul McNulty, but I felt that it was aimed at people of a different type to me. I seem to recall the advice was to clean out old leaves from scuttles and lubricate door seals, given the time of year ... while this is very good advice, it is one small suggestion to do things which I would be doing as a matter of course anyway, compared with the reams of good advice I get on this forum everyday.

So, if I was to sign up what else would I get? I'd be able to attend various Porsche Club events over the year, which I don't honestly think I have time for. I went on Frontrunner this time last year because we happened to be in the area and (to be brutally honest) I wasn't impressed. I'd be eligible for discounts from certain suppliers, but in my experience the suppliers I buy most supplies and parts from (Vauxhall Trade Club / Euro Car Parts / Frazerpart) don't offer discounts to PCGB members. I might get a discount on insurance, but I always use the same broker from year to year who always give me the best prices possible and who are always cheaper by a country mile than anyone else. And I doubt that a discount from a Porsche Specialist Insurer would suddenly make them competitive (unless is was very substantial.) PCGB organise trackdays but then so do many other people, and I'm not concerned whether I am on track with only Porsches or with a mixed bag of other cars. The London Region meetings happen on the other side of London to where I live, and I will not be spending nearly an hour and a half driving a route I detest, to go to a PCGB regional meet (particularly when there is a TIPEC one much closer, which is open to non-members.)

I can see that there is a point about supporting the organisation that provides this website, which is a valid one, but nearly £80 is a significant chunk of money for membership of a website.

I expect that this post will ruffle a couple of feathers; mods (and other members), please don't think I am out to antagnoise. It's just that every now and again I contemplate whether membership is something I ought to think about and each time I come up with the same answer.

No offence meant.


Oli.

 

[TTM]

If you feel like the club in its current form won't bring you more if you become a member, then it seems to me you might want to ask yourself what you could bring to the club so it could float your boat better.

 

[Peter Empson]

A warm glowy feeling inside []

Membership is £51 to renew via DDebit (I've just done it) but I guess it's more expensive to start out (£66 via card, I just checked). The magazine varies in quality, but does have some interesting articles covering most things over time. You get discounts on parts (which has paid for the membership several times over recently), events (which I understand we don't all have time for, but Silverstone and the one at Blenheim are surely must visit events) and so on.
Personaly I'd rather the club was simpler and smaller, with the option of an online magazine instead of the printed one, but as a member you can have your say.
I'd say try it for one year and see what you think, it's definately worth a shot.

Forgot to add you also get access to the special secret areas of the forum, the discussions there (gossip and bickering) are worth the fee alone []

 

[rav]

You get 10% off at all OPCs for parts.

 

[Black_JPN]

Ask not what the club can do for you but what you can do for the club - all I ever heard when this has come up before. Makes sense to me and someone will be along in a minute to say a club is only as good as it's members and rightly so. Sounds to me Oli like you've already made your mind up.

Damon (ex PCGB member - also never had time for the events, wish I had and my loft couldn't take anymore PP, nicely produced mag but content never floated my boat)

 

[John Sims]

Nicely said Damon.

I would think you would have to deliberately avoid the suppliers who give discounts to Club members to not get your subscription back each year.

Without trying the insurers that support the Club you will never know if they can do a cheaper deal or not - most are only brokers so it all depends on how enthusiastic, or otherwise, they are with their commissions. I have been very pleasantly surprised and get track day cover thrown in so I'm happy.

Porsche Post is only as good, or otherwise, as those that contribute. If people don't like what is in it then they could write something they want to see. If you want technical articles then write them - don't expect someone else to do it for you.

In addition to Register gatherings there are Regional meetings. Subject to the area these may or my not be to your taste. As far as Essex is concerned they are a great bunch and we have terrific fun together - again it is very much down to what you want to put in.

You aren't wrong that such comments make people tetchy. You say you use, and enjoy, this forum. Members money pays for this forum and members give up a fair amount of their spare time to try to ensure it runs smoothly. You aren't going to ingratiate yourself to people by saying - I love your forum but aren't willing to contribute to its upkeep.

Club membership is small money for what is available but it won't be handed to you on a platter - you do need to make a little effort to get a lot back.

 

[gresley]

For me it's worth it for the people you meet. I have belonged to a fair few car clubs over the years and I have never met such a friendly, encouraging and pleasant bunch. No stereotype leather patch bores, just people who love the cars and welcome anyone who has a Porsche whatever it is. The stock opening is usually "that's a nice car you've got there ".

Same wherever I've gone though I have to say the furthest south I've attended meetings has been Cornbury.

Just my opinion of course.

Andrew W.

 

[fhauser]

Hi Oli £1 a week approx give you loads of info and a lot of freinds.Get in before the goverment taxes it

 

[barrysmith]

ORIGINAL: gresley

For me it's worth it for the people you meet. I have belonged to a fair few car clubs over the years and I have never met such a friendly, encouraging and pleasant bunch. No stereotype leather patch bores, just people who love the cars and welcome anyone who has a Porsche whatever it is. The stock opening is usually "that's a nice car you've got there ".

Same wherever I've gone though I have to say the furthest south I've attended meetings has been Cornbury.

Just my opinion of course.

Andrew W.

I have to agree with Andrew, and that's a lancastrian , agreeing with a Yorkshire man.

 

[Peter Empson]

ORIGINAL: John Sims

Without trying the insurers that support the Club you will never know if they can do a cheaper deal or not - most are only brokers so it all depends on how enthusiastic, or otherwise, they are with their commissions. I have been very pleasantly surprised and get track day cover thrown in so I'm happy.

Just this afternoon I've had what seems a very good quote for the white car from Heritage, they even apologised it wasn't as cheap as was expected, but it still sounded pretty good to me!

 

[Suffolk944]

Everyones different I guess about what they want from a club. For the first couple of years I was a member I simply sat at home received PP (which I agree has limited interest for us 'umble types) and browsed here. To be honest was going to cancel as the fee really didn't seem worth it. Just before I did I decided I would give a regional meet a try and haven't looked back. Really enjoy the events scattered through the year and the whole social side of 944 ownership which I wouldn't get if I didnt participate. The Region stuff can be patchy but theres no need to stick to London region, I count Essex region as "home" even though I live in the wilds of Suffolk as its so much easier to get to for me than the Norfolk/Suffolk one. Maybe Essex would suit you better Oli ?

 

[peanut]

its a good question Oli but I think you have answered your own question really. PCGB membership is not aimed at the likes of us.
I stopped my family membership back in the late 90's because there was absolutely nothing in the Post or membershio for 944 owners . We were treated like lepers then and nothing has changed in the past 10 years. I wasn't happy with where my membership subs were being spent because it certainly never seemed to benefit any of the water cooled Porsche owners

I use this forum and others to keep in touch with other 944 enthusiasts and try to contribute what I can that way. Regretably there is nothing to be gained in membership for 944 owners as far as I can see but I am open to being persuaded otherwise.

We have always been viewed as the 'oily rag brigade' and now we are probably all seen as chavs by the 911 crowd.

 

[poprock]

I'm in the club for the regional meetings, drives and social events. I'm happy to support this forum a wee bit too.

£80 per year is too expensive for what I get out of it, but I'll pay it when I'm feeling flush"”I just can't afford to pay out automatically when renewal time comes around.

I've never received any discounts on anything as a PCGB member, and I don't think much of Porsche Post"”there's nothing wrong with it, it just isn't my kind of magazine.

I get nothing out of the main club events because they're all way too far south for me. I'd love to take part in the big shows, trackdays, etc "¦ but there's no way I can from up here in Scotland. Too expensive and too time consuming. What counts as a day out for most members would be an overnight stay for me at the very least.

 

[berg944]

£1 a week approx give you loads of info and a lot of freinds.

I can see all points of view here.

I have been a member of the Norton Owners club for 30 years. It has everything PCGB has plus a spares scheme that commissions the manufacture of parts that would be unavailable. Their own videos, manuals and technical information for novice to professional mechanics and even a members help team if you break down.
It makes no distinction between the model of Norton you have or its colour[]

Just paid the £17 subscription

Mike[:'(]

Standing well back from the monitor in expectation of large fonts in bold[]

 

[gresley]

Thanks for that Barry - it was good talking to you and Chris at Oulton.

In fact Oulton was a good example of what I am talking about - great atmosphere - everyone getting on whether its air or watercooled - just a common enjoyment of a shared enthusiam.

Andrew W.

 

[John Sims]

ORIGINAL: peanut

its a good question Oli but I think you have answered your own question really. PCGB membership is not aimed at the likes of us.
I stopped my family membership back in the late 90's because there was absolutely nothing in the Post or membershio for 944 owners . We were treated like lepers then and nothing has changed in the past 10 years. I wasn't happy with where my membership subs were being spent because it certainly never seemed to benefit any of the water cooled Porsche owners

I use this forum and others to keep in touch with other 944 enthusiasts and try to contribute what I can that way. Regretably there is nothing to be gained in membership for 944 owners as far as I can see but I am open to being persuaded otherwise.

We have always been viewed as the 'oily rag brigade' and now we are probably all seen as chavs by the 911 crowd.

I was going to say something relative to the manufacturers of shoes []

I can't see how you can make that assumption when you aren't a member. FYI 3 out of 7 Board Members own a 944, another owns a 924 and another a 928 so 5 out of 7 own water cooled front runners. What ever your previous experiences they are out dated. The Club is very different now - or perhaps it is all perception.

 

[peanut]

ORIGINAL: John Sims

Nicely said Damon.

I would think you would have to deliberately avoid the suppliers who give discounts to Club members to not get your subscription back each year.

Without trying the insurers that support the Club you will never know if they can do a cheaper deal or not - most are only brokers so it all depends on how enthusiastic, or otherwise, they are with their commissions. I have been very pleasantly surprised and get track day cover thrown in so I'm happy.

Porsche Post is only as good, or otherwise, as those that contribute. If people don't like what is in it then they could write something they want to see. If you want technical articles then write them - don't expect someone else to do it for you.

In addition to Register gatherings there are Regional meetings. Subject to the area these may or my not be to your taste. As far as Essex is concerned they are a great bunch and we have terrific fun together - again it is very much down to what you want to put in.

You aren't wrong that such comments make people tetchy. You say you use, and enjoy, this forum. Members money pays for this forum and members give up a fair amount of their spare time to try to ensure it runs smoothly. You aren't going to ingratiate yourself to people by saying - I love your forum but aren't willing to contribute to its upkeep.

Club membership is small money for what is available but it won't be handed to you on a platter - you do need to make a little effort to get a lot back.

I reckon I contribute far more than i receive from this forum although I appreciate the opportunity to share my Porsche interest with other enthusiasts from around the world.
I'd be happy to support the forum by an annual donation if someone could tell me what it costs to run and how much each forum member should contribute to meet their share of that cost currently met by members.
I'd also be more than willing to assist with moderating or contributing to the faqs etc .However I do not feel that PCGB membership has anything to offer me personally as a 944 owner .

I am a member of 10 or so forums that cover a wide range of interests that I have. I don't expect to have to contribute to their running costs although if asked I might choose to do so.

What I particularly resent is someone telling me how I get all the benefits of the forum for free whilst members have to pay for the privilage of providing the forum for me.
I think someone needs to be reminded that a forum is a community first and foremost and that that community is the forum. Without the prodigeous input from non club members this forum would'nt exist.

If certain members feel that they would rather their subs do not contribute to the support of this forum then I suggest they raise the issue at the next AGM

 

[peanut]

ORIGINAL: John Sims

ORIGINAL: peanut

its a good question Oli but I think you have answered your own question really. PCGB membership is not aimed at the likes of us.
I stopped my family membership back in the late 90's because there was absolutely nothing in the Post or membershio for 944 owners . We were treated like lepers then and nothing has changed in the past 10 years. I wasn't happy with where my membership subs were being spent because it certainly never seemed to benefit any of the water cooled Porsche owners

I use this forum and others to keep in touch with other 944 enthusiasts and try to contribute what I can that way. Regretably there is nothing to be gained in membership for 944 owners as far as I can see but I am open to being persuaded otherwise.

We have always been viewed as the 'oily rag brigade' and now we are probably all seen as chavs by the 911 crowd.

I was going to say something relative to the manufacturers of shoes []

I can't see how you can make that assumption when you aren't a member. FYI 3 out of 7 Board Members own a 944, another owns a 924 and another a 928 so 5 out of 7 own water cooled front runners. What ever your previous experiences they are out dated. The Club is very different now - or perhaps it is all perception.

the club may well have changed but it still has nothing to offer me. You cannot force your perception of what makes a good club onto others . You may well enjoy the facilities that the club offers you that doesn't necessarily follow that that is what every Porsche owner wants from their club.
To interest me there would need to be a radical change in the club's policy and aims. As far as I can see the club consults no one about how their subscriptions are spent or what is provided for club members . I do not intend to become embroiled in an argument about the club because the glib answer that is always thrown back is 'the club is what you make it' or ' you should look at what you can offer the club'

 

[sawood12]

Well for me this forum is the best Porsche/944 forum of any I have looked on and contributed to. It is not full of aggressive and cowardly D-heads who'd slag you off on the forum but be nice as pie to your face, it's not full of egotistical know-it-all power maniacs who'd be better off with Evo's and Scooby's than a 944 and there is alot of traffic on the forum so is never boring. Also I like the way you are not bombarded with pro-active and aggressive marketting - I get sick enough of that in my day to day life and this forum is just about the only place you can get a rest from all that twaddle. The forum alone is worth £51 in my view - it has certainly saved me far more than all my annual subscriptions in the quality of advice over the years.

I'd love to attend more club meets but simply cannot find the time at the moment.

The magazine is very proffessional, though I think the content could do with a bit of a shake up. If I lead a more interesting life or did something particularly interesting to/with my car i'd definately contribute with an article or two. I think it is a bit too politically correct with respect to Porsche itself and i'd like to see alot more content from actual car owners especially from owners with cars at the less expensive end of the spectrum. I'd also like to see a return to some form of technical section in the mag (I believe it used to have one) as i'm one of those sad people who can quite easliy read the Haynes manual for a car i've never owned or never will own (i've read my dad's Dolomite Sprint, Escort MK2 and Fiat 126 manuals).

I'm a bit dissapointed in the Porsche organised trackdays. I'd love to attend one but they seem so very expensive compared with other trackdays. I'd have thought that this is a perfect vehicle for the club to provide some real value for its membership. I don't really want to pay a premium for something that is already a very expensive.

The thing about this club is that it is run properly and very proffessionally and for me it has credability and at £51 a year , barely the cost of an annual subscription to a magazine, is pretty good value. But ultimately if you can't see the value in it then I guess you've answered your own question as to whether or not you personally think its worth it.

 

[barrysmith]

Peanut, are you a paid up member of any thing?. would be very interested to find out what floats your boat.?