That makes me feel better. Got quite into it once in a 997.2 GT3RS at the PEC low friction circuit but struggled when trying it there previously in a Spyder - which the instructor in the RS said reflected (positively) on the Spyder !? Drove this:ORIGINAL: Andy FaganYou only see the ones he gets right []
I have thought about visiting an Alfa dealer to learn more about it. I expect there will be none available for test drive. The turbo 4 doesn't concern me as the high torque in a car so light will make the in gear acceleration very rapid. Porsche has admitted to working on a 4 cylinder turbo but haven't said where it will be used and has dismissed rumours of it appearing in a Boxster/Cayman. It will be interesting to see where the marque is in 10 years time. They toyed with the idea of taking the VW Bluesport concept and re-badging it Porsche. It could have been produced with a VW stablemate alongside it. Doing that with SUV's is just short of damaging the brand imho, but if they'd have done it with a sports car... What is a Lotus? A car that would score badly on all things a Porsche is good at. The 4C the same kind of thing. You're right in what you say but the measure of a Porsche's attributes would not endear someone to a Lotus and likewise a 4C. I expect it to be as far from a Porsche as the F-type is, just in the opposite direction. The more you are making me think about it, the more I want to think about!
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Don't give up on that ownership plan just yet[ORIGINAL: flat6 You have substance behind your position. Can't argue with that[
] http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/new-cars-2014 January You can’t empathise fully with the new Alfa Romeo 4C, and the intentions of its creators, until you drive it. Proof of this is in the fact that people who haven’t yet slipped behind the wheel insist on making on-paper comparisons with the Porsche Cayman, a car with a very different character and purpose. I’d go so far as to say Italy’s new mid-engined coupé is one of the few cars today that has no direct competitors at all, although you could draw comparisons with the now defunct four-cylinder Lotus Exige. Let’s start by clocking the 4C’s points of difference. At £45,000, it’s the most affordable car yet to have a proper carbonfibre chassis. Consequently, it weighs only 960kg. Its engine is an ultra-light 1750cc turbo four producing 237bhp and 258lb ft — and Alfa has already let slip that more is possible from the all-aluminium engine. Look for 280-300bhp in the longer term. The gearbox is a paddle-shift, six-speed dual-clutch automatic, and it’ll do the 0-60mph sprint in under five seconds and 155mph flat out. Its lightness — and the benefits it brings — take the 4C on an entirely different path from the Cayman, a car that weights nearly 1400kg at the kerb. The 4C’s delicacy of handling is the thing that marks it out as special. Its steering can be unassisted because the nose weight is low and the tyre sections are modest, but it grips beautifully (a shade too effectively at the rear, some say, because the predominant handling trait is understeer and it is hard to slide). A special delight is how easy the 4C is to propel. There’s no feeling of it lugging itself away from rest, as with so many contemporary cars. The Alfa rolls easily as soon as you let in the clutch. Chuck in an inspiring exhaust note, a relatively spartan interior that emphasises the 4C’s competition connections, and styling to die for, and you have a car with Ferrari levels of desirability at a quarter of the price.
Looks like Jaguars accountants are from a different school of thought to Porsches when it comes to Coupe v Cabrio pricing[
] http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/new-cars-2014 March It almost looks like a bargain. Jaguar’s fixed-head F-type shaves £7300 off the convertible prices we’ve already seen, so the range now starts at just over £50,000. Jaguar is using the fixed-head model’s arrival to showcase a new £85,000, 542bhp R model that makes great use of the new coupé’s rigid body; it is reputedly the stiffest Jaguar ever. Sales of the R, which uses the same high-output supercharged V8 as the XKR-S and XFR-S, will begin in March. The R’s suspension is a little stiffer than that of other F-types, and Jaguar calls it “the most dynamically capable†production car it has ever built.
How the hell Porsche get away with that with the Cayman remains one of life's great mysteries to me! Autocar review lacks credibility when it talks about letting the clutch out... of the Alfa's PDK gearbox... [8|]ORIGINAL: daro911 Looks like Jaguars accountants are from a different school of thought to Porsches when it comes to Coupe v Cabrio pricing[
I have to agree on both your points and when I read the clutch comment I thought typical bloody journo's writing Ed Balls stuff again[ORIGINAL: rob.kellockHow the hell Porsche get away with that with the Cayman remains one of life's great mysteries to me! Autocar review lacks credibility when it talks about letting the clutch out... of the Alfa's PDK gearbox... [8|]ORIGINAL: daro911 Looks like Jaguars accountants are from a different school of thought to Porsches when it comes to Coupe v Cabrio pricing[
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v6 manual with 300BHP , I am there, as it stands not a chance. I am not sure I could live with the Lotus style lack of luxury either. One of the main reasons I made the Switch from Lotus to Porsche was to try and get the feel of a sports car with a bit more comfort.Thanks daro. Still worth a read even if a lazy use of the term regarding how the car moves away from stationary. The car has mustered conversation on here for a couple of pages, and not for the first time[ORIGINAL: daro911Don't give up on that ownership plan just yet[ORIGINAL: flat6 You have substance behind your position. Can't argue with that[
]. What is typical with this type of car and from this type of marque in particular, is that it grabs the attention of some people who find it hard to ignore but need a strong reason to curtail the fact that they are paying more attention to it than they feel they ought to. Not saying that is happening here, we're having good debate. The paper based review of it takes deep thought (better to go drive it, but to remove temptation to drive it you need some give yourself strong reasons. That's human nature. They could be valid reasons or, simply having no like for something at all.) But there must be a reason why we're not discussing the Mazda MX5 or Nissan 370z vs the Porsches but we are the 4C. Hairdresser's car. Well, how do I respond with substance to a statement that lacks any? Is it the same definition of hairdresser that was levelled at the Boxster (before the Spyder came along of course!). Have never seen the Boxster as a hairdresser's car myself, whatever that means. The Spyder was called a marketing gimmick by some. But on paper, some might see it that way. On paper, I didn't see it that way and it pretty much lived up to my on-paper expectations when I drove it. A VX220 owner for example considers a Boxster Spyder and gets told that it's 'just the same hairdresser's poor man's Porsche but with a few marketing gimnmicks'. He either needs to read enough on paper to convince himself to go test drive a Spyder (or not test one), or he just needs to go test drive one if he's interested enough in the general concept. Engine. Let me get nostalgic. My gen 1 Cayman's engine was the only car who's engine I thought had a sound that captured my interest (haven't owned many special cars to be honest). It had a sound that had a metalic rasp about it,a bit like the older cars. The engine vibrations into the cabin gave a sense of the 6 cylinders oscillating back there. My new DFI engine is much smoother and refined and whatever its doing back there doesn't grab my attention at all. Such is progress. I don't mind, I drive the thing and get my thrills that way, as I always have. Engine sounds have always grabbed me a bit more than exhaust sound, so PSE is not quite the substitute for me. I'm pretty sure that based on what i've read on paper, the Alfa would be faster IN MY HANDS, ON THE ROAD than my Spyder. With the Nissan GTR vs 997 Turbo S, the GTR might put in a quicker lap time in the hands of some reviewers on track but someone who buys one really needs to decide whether they will enjoy how it drives ON THE ROAD and whether they will enjoy running one, because on the road they would find it hard to split them, performance-wise. Hanging onto the Nurburgring lap time is hardly any satisfaction whilst 'putting up' with owning one if owning one didn't prove enjoyable for them personally. I'm pretty sure that based on what i've read on paper, the Alfa could not be a daily driver like my Spyder is. Far too raw. I'm also pretty sure i'd have to take it to the track and really thrash it to expose where it is not better than my Spyder, performance-wise. On the road I would not run out of grip in either car so the Alfa WILL be faster IN MY HANDS, simply because it is faster in a straight line (i.e. between corners), in any gear and I probably don't run the Spyder to the edge of it's grip so wouldn't exploit any advantage it has (unless the Spyder's brakes give more confidence, for example, but I am hardly going to choose a car based soley on its brakes, unless they were made of paper). Everyone else would make their own minds up differently. So I wouldn't personally compare the 4C to my Spyder, it would be a choice because I wanted one. Unlike the Spyder it would only have one purpose - going for a blast and would no-doubt be tiresome driving it over some of the distances I have driven the Spyder. Have never bought a brand new car and its and itch i'd like to scratch. To scratch that itch with a sports car and something exclusive would be nice. To try to buy a brand new Porsche, with the options i'd want it to have (as it would get driven more than a 4C), it just would not happen. Nor would it be as exclusive. A brand new 2.7 981 with a few options, or a brand new 981S with no options wouldn't excite me to scratch that new car itch. When they bring out a V6 4C or change the headlights, or hairdressers come out and vote that they prefer a Boxster[], then people will need new reasons to take their mind off it[]. Maybe the old Alfa reliability issues will be resurrected as the new excuse, despite the new Alfas being as reliable as other cars on the road[]
Has the side stripe and R looking wheels, but you can see the rear spoile if you look carefully. It's deffo and R [
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Again rubbish report quoting such tat like this "The inevitable comparisons will be with the Boxster Spyder and Cayman R" As I said on pistonheads, they are nothing like the Spyder and the R concepts , and are just optioned up cars like the Cayman S sport and Spyder RS60 were. But now every model has a GTS range it makes sense to add a GTS Cayman and Boxster and offer a higher spec level for less money than all the options would cost.
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