Are Spyders Becoming Extinct At OPCs!
- Thread starter daro911
- Start date
I can't work out why the car at Sutherland cars (autotrader) priced at £37,990 hasn't sold. Good spec with lots of extras, only 12k miles, has the rare & expensive PCCB, buckets and PSE, granted it hasn't got Spyder wheels and it's black but looks good value to me. I'd be tempted if I was still in the market.
Yeah but don't forget the demand... Spyder is v niche. My mrs would far prefer us to have an electric hooded car with no wind noise, normal seats, comfy suspension, built in satnav and Bose, heated seats etc etc. Fortunately she allows me to indulge myself without complaint. 981 is multi award winning best of the best in its much larger niche. There comes a point when to many people an ultra low mileage 981 with bells and whistles at a lower purchase price is a far better proposition for them, particularly as a daily driver, than an older higher mileage Spyder? Not that many people can enjoy a Boxster as a second car and as an everyday proposition the 981 wins. Spyder market distorted by the power of the internet - it shares ingredients with Speedster or 964 RS but it hasn't taken 15 years for people to wake up to how special they are!ORIGINAL: daro911 If you want a 981 981S Coupe or Cabrio there are literally 100's out there right now if you want a Spyder or an R there are literally a handful [] Supply & Demand[8D]
But it's probably a different kind of person buying the Spyder vs the 981. Spyder - very few cars, very few buyers, but looking like slightly more buyers than cars 981 - very many cars, very many buyers, but looking like more than slightly more cars than buyers There shouldn't be so many 981s knocking around so soon as I doubt there are many buyers who have got bored already. Most of these cars are over-supply straight from the production line I reckon - spending a number of months as a demo vehicle so that they can be put onto the used car market as they are producing more new cars than there are new car buyers. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxoU23wkmCY
Not so sure. 70 981s on the approved used locator. 95 991s. There is a crossover point too. I do like my Spyder but if it is only going to cost a couple of grand to get a car with 1/10 of the mileage that cost £10k more new with at least 2 years warranty and some new tech (PASM/PDK etc) it becomes quite compelling when you need major service, warranty renewal, and that's before you factor in brakes and tyres. Surprised you not after one 6 ;-)
You have a good point for those like yourself for whom both cars appeal. As i'm not typically an open top car person, if I was going for an easier to live with mid-engined Porker i'd probably go for the Cayman S Black Edition for the PASM suspension. I still have a soft spot for the 987 []
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So lets say you went to the showroom were tempted by the younger model. You purchased a 981 and drove away. Yes you may have the younger model but she hasn't got the looks - when it comes to performance the 981 is never going to match the Spyder. What have you done - in probably three years time you see your new wheels depreciating so quickly that it has already gone below that of the Spyder had you kept it! You think about selling the 981 but find the market is full of them - your back to where you are above. OK so you had a bit of new technology and a roof that would close at the touch of a button but how much fun was that?
I think if your Spyder is a daily driver then trading up to the latest - greatest from Porsche is no bad thing at all and can see many more plus reasons to do so than negative ones On the other hand never forget under 200 Spyders in UK today, exotic looks for sensible money even when brand spanking new and the one thing you can't buy in any 981 rarity not to mention the 2 very famous German gentlemen who have added Spyders to their personal Porsche collection If your Spyder is a sunny day driver, sunny weekends only driver or even like our man Mr D track day driver then the positive sides to trading up from Spyder to 981 will never outweigh the kick in the wallet your latest and greatest from Porsche will be giving you every mile driven [
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I could not afford to own 3 cars which drop like a stone, it's that simple for me, if the Spyder would have been dropping like a normal 981 I would have got out of it. I mainly bought the R because they will be strong resale wise, like my last cars, CSL, GT3, Noble, Exige etc etc all have 1 thing in common, very slow at losing money. The CSL, Noble and GT3 going up in price in fact. buying new is a mugs game for the rich only, normal man cannot loose 10k on a car PA which is what a 981 will do after your 3 years is up. its never about affording the car to buy in the 1st place, it's always about how much it will lose with me, and Porsche have moved from 65% back after 3 years to less then 50% back, the markets flooded with 2nd hand Porsche. If some one offered 45K for my Spyder today I would have to think long and hard about letting it go, I am not a rich man by any means and to get 45k back from it would be tempting. I just know I would do some thing stupid and go buy that F430 and be even more skint though and while the F430 is not dropping in price, trade on them is 15k less than retail and you cannot shift these things private.
The roof would give me loads of fun - I would really enjoy showing off with it in traffic! I think it works at up to 40mph too. There is no meaningful performance disadvantage - AndyF has repeatedly shown me that a 2.7 987.1 is miles quicker round a track than a Spyder if you don't mind setting your brakes on fire [] The point I suppose I was trying to make is that the initial depreciation on an ultra low mile 981S makes it a compelling proposition (certainly relative to the cost of buying a new one) if Spyder values continue their upward surge this Spring. I'd take £40k for mine all day long - my wife wants a porch, 2 new bathrooms and the lounge decorating! If I'm going to have to spend £2000 on a major service, spark plug change, brake fluid change, warranty renewal in May and another £1500 on brakes and tyres and another year's warranty within the next 24 months on a car whose value seems to be very mileage sensitive, I'll end up in 2 years time with a 30000 mile Spyder that has cost me over £4k in maintenance, probably worth £30k on a good day and it will be 6 years old. An approved 981S would cost me nothing in 24 months in maintenance costs. Good job its not just about the money eh? []
] The point I suppose I was trying to make is that the initial depreciation on an ultra low mile 981S makes it a compelling proposition (certainly relative to the cost of buying a new one) if Spyder values continue their upward surge this Spring. I'd take £40k for mine all day long - my wife wants a porch, 2 new bathrooms and the lounge decorating! If I'm going to have to spend £2000 on a major service, spark plug change, brake fluid change, warranty renewal in May and another £1500 on brakes and tyres and another year's warranty within the next 24 months on a car whose value seems to be very mileage sensitive, I'll end up in 2 years time with a 30000 mile Spyder that has cost me over £4k in maintenance, probably worth £30k on a good day and it will be 6 years old. An approved 981S would cost me nothing in 24 months in maintenance costs. Good job its not just about the money eh? []
philnotts99
Member
Do you have OPC warranty on the car
?!What John said. Yes the new car is technically better in every way, but you would be trading in the 'exciting' drive of the Spyder's set-up, unless you found a car with X73 (as well as trading in the exclusivity and unique looks). That said, I know you know all that and you know what you'd get from the 981 that you'd enjoy. In a similar way I was considering a 997.1 turbo which would offer none of what the Spyder offers, but offers something else. It's an appropriate time to dig out your 981 review Rob, entitled 'The Money Shot' [
] Yes, we have a huge back catalogue of information on here and if we were a sub-forum, we could separate out the topics and make it easy to find. But alas, we are just a thread. The following is from pages 50 to 52 if you want to see the discussion that went with it with other Spydermen.
ORIGINAL: rob.kellock
Post #987... Firstly, kudos to flat6 - I hadn't got the face to take the side by side shots with the Spyder upon collection this morning. Spydermen, here we have the 981 Boxster in its purest form. Manual gears and a modest choice of options - 19 inch alloys, rear park assist, heated seats and, erm, I think that's it. Likes:- the roof, mamma mia, it's heavenly. No wind noise on the motorway and it goes up and down in 9 seconds when you're driving along. The sun came out, I put the roof down. The sun went in, I put the roof up. I didn't even stop! The interior is clearly of a higher quality. The electronic gauge in the instrument cluster is good and useful. The gear change is very sweet indeed and located like a race cars. The suspension in town driving is heavenly, ride quality over pot holes is leagues ahead of the Spyder. Exhaust sounds quite good when accelerating. It's quite nippy. It is all the sportscar anyone could ever need. It looks great too, the styling is a positive update of the 987. Dislikes:- dare I say it's too civilised most of the time? Driving the Spyder is an event. This is driving a very nice car. Perhaps it needs PSE, the exhaust note is synthetic. I kept finding my left knee naturally resting on the centre console and not being comfortable. The standard seats are not as good as the Spyder's buckets. The electronic handbrake switch is in a stupid place. The passenger seatbelt rattles against the door pillar some of the time. It doesn't steer like a Spyder (and neither does a 987 Boxster, not having a dig at electronic steering here) it doesn't go like a Spyder (and why should it, it's not even an "S") and even the 19" wheels look a little lost in the arches. I know we need to save the planet but the start/stop function was inconsistent and a bit annoying at times. I don't like the key either which is shaped like a Panamera and attached to a leather pouch with the tracker device in it and is just too bulky for my pockets. I took it on a little diversion on the way back to the office this morning on a couple of my favourite local roads and obviously it's not my car so I treated it very courteously. These are roads I would drive in the Spyder just for the hell of it early on a Sunday morning. It is a very good car indeed but it is a different beast ot the Spyder. With hill hold, stop/start, electric handbrake etc. I do wonder if it would be better with a PDK gearbox? It is a bit like a cross between the Spyder and a BMW 5 series so far. I'll update you tomorrow as I've only done 50 miles in it so far!
ORIGINAL: rob.kellock Flat6 - no, no PASM. Driven home via son's school GCSE option evening. Loving the cool LED lighting, not liking mesh wind deflector, what a retrograde step. Can't tell what's behind you! Worse on fuel than the Spyder (according to computer) with gentler driving but some traffic jams. Feels very slow at 30mph as so refined. Fits in the garage nicely.Lovely car but agree with everything Rob says. Better in every way but...
ORIGINAL: rob.kellock Usability is a big factor for me. This morning I drove to work with the roof down and as I backed into my space, the roof put itself back up. The Spyder would have stayed in the garage and if I had used it, the roof would have stayed on for the 15 minute commute. Mind you, for the commute, I'd want PDK, if I had PDK I'd want sports chrono and suddenly we're another £3k down... The car is certainly striking - I couldn't initially work out where a BMW had gone that had been rapidly undertaking the row of cars behind me - it had drawn up alongside and the passenger was taking photos on her phone! I have never experienced that before despite my handsome good looks! I'm going to take it to the police station now - its bound to impress my 12 year old burglar client if I can get him out [
ORIGINAL: rob.kellock Normal service has been resumed. Spyder is back, as is the large grin on my face! Had to clean Bolton's 981 for them, it needed a bit of love! At 2400 miles it was similar to the Spyder for stone chips but my Spyder has done nearly 6 times the mileage. Anyone who likes a 987 would find it hard not to be seriously impressed by the new car. I was a bit unimpressed with its fuel economy and re-set the computer as I pulled on the motorway taking it back this morning. At a steady indicated 80mph cruise and then a couple of miles of 50mph dual carriageway before arriving, it did 32mpg which was a bit better. Then after lusting over the 996 GT3RS currently taking pride of place in the showroom I drove back in the Spyder. I tried replicating the 80 lepton cruise - 28 mpg indicated - but the M61 was empty and I had the roof down and frankly I got a bit bored. I have to say, Rob was right, I have come home grinning like a Cheshire Cat! As my neighbour would say about his 3.2 Carrera, you can drive over a packet of crisps and tell what flavour they are, the steering feel is so good! 981 looks good on the drive:Wheel shot for Rob now they're clean:
Arty one!
Finally, the money shot:
Big E
New member
Isn't it interesting how many reviews you read of cars (professional and personal) where a new model is described as "technically better", "more refined"and having more toys but just not as exciting as the outgoing model. I had this with M3's, I had a 2005 M3 CS and moved to a 2009 V8, then 2012 V8 M3. The newer cars were certainly more refined and the figures showed they were faster but there wasn't so much thrill or feedback in driving the thing. That's why I ended up with a Spyder, I was originally looking at C2 GTS's but then I drove a Spyder and it was just what I was looking for, something that's a bit of an event to drive. The 981's are very impressive but the same things can be said, "technically better", "more refined" and has a nice roof, nice but slightly synthetic sound with the PSE. For a weekend car I don't want refined, luxurious or a car that on paper has impressive technical ability, I want a car that I am excited to get in and drive and when I get my foot down I can feel what the car is doing. That's why I do think the Spyder will be a future classic (to some extent), just like the other analogue cars whose values are rising, CSL, GT3, 360 CS.
I also had a late model m3 v8 competition and it was quite dull :-( only kept it 2 months. and while it looked the part in the pearl white, every carbon extra and the CSL wheels, it never excited. exciting cars are very hard to find.
the CSL was a hoot though and I sold that to quick :-(
I totally agree and the proof was in the pudding when I got out of my first ever 30 minute test drive in a 981 S and straight back into my Spyder Whilst I was having a great time in the all new Boxster and getting to grips with it's fantastic abilities, superb ride, amazing lack of drama even at ??mph it was only when I set off back home I realised the Spyder was so alive and delivering even more fun at literally half the speeds and whilst the ride, wind noise, and interior architecture were all somewhat old school the excitement and driver involvement were in another class I am sure the forthcoming GTS will push the driver involvement to another level but for me the uniqueness of the Spyder ticks all my boxes and for relatively little money compared to the next level up to achieve this sort of enjoyment[8D]
Good posts above. The Spyder forum. You do not have to say anything.... But anything you do say may be used in evidence against you. Flat6 clearly has the potential for a second career in CID []
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