Are Spyders Becoming Extinct At OPCs!
- Thread starter daro911
- Start date
It's true. The kart's 6hp is good for 55mph and there's a minimum race weight of 103kg. An older child racing at say 105kg will still be competitive and then a point comes at 'x' kg when a child is too heavy for cadet and moves up to junior. If 6hp can carry an extra 2kg (a Porsche radio) and be competitive, to have a feel good factor about radio delete on a car like the Spyder is just about the feel good factor.ORIGINAL: daro911I have driven back to back a bare bones Spyder with Ceramics and then a fat boy with Turbo 11 wheels radio air nav sports seats and couldn't tell any difference what so ever. My tutor that day confirmed the Spyder is about 2 things only the chassis set up and removal of the really important weight saving piece of kit the power roof everything else including the fabric door pulls is pure marketing hype. Around the PEC both cars are going to feel identical and against a stop watch there would be nothing in it. Armed with this information and my personal driving experience that day I no longer was in search of the lightest possible exampleORIGINAL: flat6 Yeah the Spyder isn't an Atom or Lotus alternative. Porsche doesn't make such cars. Even the RS cars are not of that flavour. The Spyder isn't an RS model either. Porsche doesn't market the RS models on "we even removed the radio". The brochure talks about the radio as a standard piece of kit in this car that is a combination of comfort and exhilaration. Heck, they don't even remove the carpets Yes the Spyder's main philosophy is saving weight and the laws of physics govern that any weight saving, however small will enhance the handling, acceleration and retardation. But to focus on any significance of the radio and AC delete as having a discernable difference to the on road experience would be to suggest that the engine is so weak as to show up an extra 15 kilos. Switch to sports seats and the returned weight total is 27Kg. Such a Spyder which is 53Kg lighter than a standard Boxster S vs a Spyder that is 80Kg less than an a Standard Boxster S is going to be minimal. I don't know what's the threshold point is to start feeling the weight addition but for sure a point comes when you'd feel it, but not 27kg I reckon. My son's kart has only 6hp and I had to put 18Kg of lead ballast on it to bring him up to the minimum weight for his MSA racing because he was so small. Yes it does make a difference to his lap times but not of a magnitude that I would expect the same 18kg to make a discernible difference to a 320hp engine in the Spyder. Makes a difference the kart's handling but thankfully to increase rear traction lol. But ultimately it's dead weight as you're supposed to shift your body weight around to optimise the kart's handling. Can't see that order of mass making much difference to the handling of a 1.275 tonne car. Otherwise the car would have to be riding very softly. Since changing cars i've had less focus on weight saving. I think i'd have to fill this car's cabin space with lead before feeling any difference in performance lol[]. At over 1.6 tonnes designed into the car, I think a very large mass reduction or addition would be needed to make a discernible difference to the handling as the car is already too heavy to pretend to be anything other than a GT car. A very good one at that though. I think a major part of the Spyder driving experience is the lowered suspension, just as with the RS models.
must have a VERY sensitive @rse[ORIGINAL: billy1Not as funny as your suggestion that you can feel each KG of weight Mr D!ORIGINAL: MrDemonCan you write that with a straight face lol. I laughed out loud , thanks.ORIGINAL: billy1All the time. Even on trips you know, it updates to the traffic incidents. Sadly not everyone lives backing on to great driving roads. Obviously you can also designate "non motorway" or scenic routes which tend to be more interesting. And you don't need to stop all the time to consult a map - you can just plug-in way points for a great day's driving. It's a £60k car new, and factory fit sat-nav is a must at that price point. You hardly want a Tom-Tom glued to the windscreen with wires trailing about. The weight argument is laughable as we all know - the PCM is what, 2kg? No-one can tell the difference with or without that small amount. Put in 2l less fuel if it bothers you! And the "standard" radio screen looks awful. At least that was part of my advert you couldn't "borrow"[ORIGINAL: DarrellWilson Does make me smile when I see Spyders with this selling point…... ''PCM Sat Nav (recently updated with 3D view and full postcode entry)'' Be interesting to know many times this is actually used. Given that the typical Spyder use is weekend fair weather driving (except for those few who do the European trips) around the best driving roads you know locally, why is this a selling point in a lightweight car? Isn't the pleasure just in driving, enjoying the car on open roads with no particular destination in mind, without technology telling you where to go? If you need guidance use a map, it weighs less. [
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Rocket Man
New member
that is what i am looking for to brighten up the interior. 2m of alcantara from UK hide at £65/m plus vat etc and a dable on the sewing machine should see done and still have enough left over for lower dash, and perhaps handles and center arm rest. will have to have a go over winterORIGINAL: Fire_2 I've got a price of having both seats done in red for around £400 maybe cheaper if we can get a few people in?
Think you might have over looked the driver ability in that hypothesis!ORIGINAL: flat6It's true. The kart's 6hp is good for 55mph and there's a minimum race weight of 103kg. An older child racing at say 105kg will still be competitive and then a point comes at 'x' kg when a child is too heavy for cadet and moves up to junior. If 6hp can carry an extra 2kg (a Porsche radio) and be competitive, to have a feel good factor about radio delete on a car like the Spyder is just about the feel good factor.ORIGINAL: daro911I have driven back to back a bare bones Spyder with Ceramics and then a fat boy with Turbo 11 wheels radio air nav sports seats and couldn't tell any difference what so ever. My tutor that day confirmed the Spyder is about 2 things only the chassis set up and removal of the really important weight saving piece of kit the power roof everything else including the fabric door pulls is pure marketing hype. Around the PEC both cars are going to feel identical and against a stop watch there would be nothing in it. Armed with this information and my personal driving experience that day I no longer was in search of the lightest possible exampleORIGINAL: flat6 Yeah the Spyder isn't an Atom or Lotus alternative. Porsche doesn't make such cars. Even the RS cars are not of that flavour. The Spyder isn't an RS model either. Porsche doesn't market the RS models on "we even removed the radio". The brochure talks about the radio as a standard piece of kit in this car that is a combination of comfort and exhilaration. Heck, they don't even remove the carpets Yes the Spyder's main philosophy is saving weight and the laws of physics govern that any weight saving, however small will enhance the handling, acceleration and retardation. But to focus on any significance of the radio and AC delete as having a discernable difference to the on road experience would be to suggest that the engine is so weak as to show up an extra 15 kilos. Switch to sports seats and the returned weight total is 27Kg. Such a Spyder which is 53Kg lighter than a standard Boxster S vs a Spyder that is 80Kg less than an a Standard Boxster S is going to be minimal. I don't know what's the threshold point is to start feeling the weight addition but for sure a point comes when you'd feel it, but not 27kg I reckon. My son's kart has only 6hp and I had to put 18Kg of lead ballast on it to bring him up to the minimum weight for his MSA racing because he was so small. Yes it does make a difference to his lap times but not of a magnitude that I would expect the same 18kg to make a discernible difference to a 320hp engine in the Spyder. Makes a difference the kart's handling but thankfully to increase rear traction lol. But ultimately it's dead weight as you're supposed to shift your body weight around to optimise the kart's handling. Can't see that order of mass making much difference to the handling of a 1.275 tonne car. Otherwise the car would have to be riding very softly. Since changing cars i've had less focus on weight saving. I think i'd have to fill this car's cabin space with lead before feeling any difference in performance lol[
I suspect the point is that a competitive fat kid could still be quicker than a slow scrawny one (not that Maurice is either!) Whilst some seem to enjoy mocking Mr D ad nauseum, I defy anyone to get out of my fatboy Cayman S at a race track, get in his skinny Spyder and not immediately be overwhelmed by the joy of the experience. At Anglesey in May, my Cayman kept up when Mr D was out with an instructor - (PDK? [] )but, my word, the Spyder with ceramics is an absolute joy on track when the Cayman is a bit of a blunt instrument. 981 is fast but the Spyder is sublime and you can feel it from the passenger seat let alone the driving seat. Honestly.
] )but, my word, the Spyder with ceramics is an absolute joy on track when the Cayman is a bit of a blunt instrument. 981 is fast but the Spyder is sublime and you can feel it from the passenger seat let alone the driving seat. Honestly.
I have done quite a of karting with those shitty twin engine things , you just get beat by 8 stone kids. Not sure how much weight is needed to change a 2 stroke result , but normal karts you are screwed if some pro kids turn up. ESP at Miltonkeens up the back hill .
Sounds like you are definitely a potential candidate for the 981 Spyder come 2015 November launch[ORIGINAL: rob.kellock Whilst some seem to enjoy mocking Mr D ad nauseum, I defy anyone to get out of my fatboy Cayman S at a race track, get in his skinny Spyder and not immediately be overwhelmed by the joy of the experience. At Anglesey in May, my Cayman kept up when Mr D was out with an instructor - (PDK? [
] I was mightily impressed by the 981 GTS Sport Chassis I had the pleasure of at PEC this summer and according to the instructor their is an improvement on real roads over the Spyder/R set up which I assume is down to the brand new chassis
I reckon. I am what marketeers call an "early adopter". I think I had the 2nd Spyder in the Club back in 2010... []
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philnotts99
Member
!?!Sounds like you are definitely a potential candidate for the 981 Spyder come 2015 November launch[
I nipped out [ORIGINAL: jdpef356Did you have to nip out to the garage to look Brian or had you already noticed?ORIGINAL: kitchens mine are the same must be special to the red ones [
][] would never have noticed to be honest despite the number off times I have cleaned themLol[] You've missed my point entirely, so i'll be blunt. I'm not making any point about driving ability. IMHO, anyone who thinks the Spyder is light enough or sufficiently lacking in power for a 2Kg radio to make any discernible difference to it's performance is kiddiing themselves. IMHO, anyone who thinks the Spyder is light enough and fast enough for a 2Kg radio to make any discernible difference to it's performance is kiddiing themselves. Have a read how many hundredths of a second per lap a kilo of fuel affects an F1 car's lap time. The Spyder doesn't go that fast to show up those sorts of performance difference per kilo. Get to multiple tens of kilos and then there's something to talk about. PCCB is a good way to save weight because of where it is saved and so improves handling. I don't expect a car with the passenger seat removed and steel rotors won't handle as well as a PCCB car even if they weigh the same. As a side thought, Porsche said the Spyder is 7 seconds quicker around the Nurburgring than a Boxster S. Yes, it's a very long lap but, I wonder how much time a Boxster S would shave off that deficit if it had the Spyder's lowered suspension. I.e. how much of that time is down to the suspension and not the weight. Put some PCCB's on the Boxster S to save unsprung mass and test again (and compare to the Spyder lap time on steels). Remove the Boxster S's roof and roof motors and test again. Remove the radio and test again[8|][]
] You've missed my point entirely, so i'll be blunt. I'm not making any point about driving ability. IMHO, anyone who thinks the Spyder is light enough or sufficiently lacking in power for a 2Kg radio to make any discernible difference to it's performance is kiddiing themselves. IMHO, anyone who thinks the Spyder is light enough and fast enough for a 2Kg radio to make any discernible difference to it's performance is kiddiing themselves. Have a read how many hundredths of a second per lap a kilo of fuel affects an F1 car's lap time. The Spyder doesn't go that fast to show up those sorts of performance difference per kilo. Get to multiple tens of kilos and then there's something to talk about. PCCB is a good way to save weight because of where it is saved and so improves handling. I don't expect a car with the passenger seat removed and steel rotors won't handle as well as a PCCB car even if they weigh the same. As a side thought, Porsche said the Spyder is 7 seconds quicker around the Nurburgring than a Boxster S. Yes, it's a very long lap but, I wonder how much time a Boxster S would shave off that deficit if it had the Spyder's lowered suspension. I.e. how much of that time is down to the suspension and not the weight. Put some PCCB's on the Boxster S to save unsprung mass and test again (and compare to the Spyder lap time on steels). Remove the Boxster S's roof and roof motors and test again. Remove the radio and test again[8|][]
I bet we weren't the only ones to nip out and have a look Brian.[ORIGINAL: kitchensI nipped out [ORIGINAL: jdpef356Did you have to nip out to the garage to look Brian or had you already noticed?ORIGINAL: kitchens mine are the same must be special to the red ones [
] The others are just keeping stum!
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