The answer for RMS problems?

[Guest]

Would the OPC still have to repair the RMS outside of warranty even if the car had been serviced according to the service schedule but by an independant - aren't there some new EEc rules about servicing outside the dealer network. I am also very concerned about residual values if this is going to be a recurring issue which becomes widely known. Does it affect 996 engines to the same extent as it appears to affect boxsters

 

[Mark_Bennett]

Does it affect 996 engines to the same extent as it appears to affect boxsters

According to a tech at Reading - 996's are affected, but for some reason not to the same extent.
Maybe it is something to do with the gearbox orientation? The engine is after all the same.

 

[Guest]

I think I will have to do a formal survey of members to present a convincing picture

Hi Nic,

Good to hear that the club are considering action. The key points that I have gleaned from the many posts on the subject are that it's a fundemental design issue with the main crank, it's a non-serviceable component which calls into question the importance of an OPC history on this item, a repair does not mean a problem-free future and nobody has voiced an opinion that it is tough luck if the seal fails.

When I took my car in for the geometry adjustment, I mentioned the magic letters RMS and the OPC chap's expression was "ooops, he's done his homework". Porsche are painfully aware that this is a real problem that detracts from their brand values.

Looking at the wider picture, Porsche have little room to respond on this other than to....

a) Continue "as is" i.e. cars under warranty - situation unchanged so free repair
b) Have a policy for cars out of warranty of either free, cheap or full cost repair.
c) Declare a total recall and engine swap
d) Devise a cunning plan to fit a new type of seal at the next OPC service.

c) is not an option given the numbers of cars on the road as Porsche did not react early enough to change the engine design or manufacturing process to eliminate the cause of failure.

I think the club should push for option d).

cheers buddy and thanks for your (and diggers') efforts on this.

 

[NicD]

a) Continue "as is" i.e. cars under warranty - situation unchanged so free repair
b) Have a policy for cars out of warranty of either free, cheap or full cost repair.
c) Declare a total recall and engine swap
d) Devise a cunning plan to fit a new type of seal at the next OPC service.

Brian,

Option D is the best, but doesnt seem possible - will be interesting to see if addressed on the new 987. failing that. I hope for a and b to be formalised. But it may have conditions such as OPC servicing. Will have to wait and see.

 

[GreigM]

I would like to see b) without the condition of OPC servicing. As this is effectively what UK law already states it would be a shame for someone to have to take it through the courts just to prove that.

 

[JCB..]

Having clocked up 64k I would like a (C) please.

I am actually waiting a response from Customer Relations regarding the RMS issue.

(Also not holding my breath)

 

[NicD]

Guys,

RMS survey went out yesterday to members registered with Boxsters.

Thanks to Sophia and Angie for doing the hard work!

Lets see how many come back in

 

[JCB..]

James

You are in the Register with a comment "Assistant - North".

We could certainly do with a "Friend in the North"

JCB..

 

[Guest]

ORIGINAL: JCB..

I am actually waiting a response from Customer Relations regarding the RMS issue.

(Also not holding my breath)

John

Just for interest has a response been forthcoming?

 

[Helen Goff]

ORIGINAL: JCB..

James

You are in the Register with a comment "Assistant - North".

We could certainly do with a "Friend in the North"

JCB..

John now i've been ousted as moderator off here and got rid of as an R/O i have nothing better to do. im happy to help in any way i can.

 

[Andy Cooke]

Things seem to be a bit different in the US.
A special Porsche tool part number 9699/1, came out over a year ago. Its purpose is to fit around the end of the crankshaft and into the RMS housing. The leaking oil seal is removed and then you try to push the tool into the housing. If the tool does not slide in then the crankshaft has moved out of alignment and is not centered in the middle of the seal. If the crankshaft has moved then you can replace the seal 100 times and it will do not good.
The M96 engine has a unique design.
The crankshaft does not spin directly in the crankcase, but inside a bearing case, which some people call a cradle. The cradle is held in place by being clamped by the two halves of the crankcase like a vise, should be a very strong design. However could it be possible for the cradle to move, which would then cause the crankshaft to become off-center just a bit. May be it has to do with the coefficient of expansion of differing metals? Surely it's not the way the engine was put together at the factory; it must be the nature of the design!
In the US if the tool does not slide on to the end of the crank then you get a replacement engine since the seal is not the root cause of the problem. Here in the UK, they just replace one seal after another. One assumes that Porsche GB receive the same TSBs from Porsche as the rest of the World.


Information and pictures courtesy of Jeff Lopez (Tool Pants)

 

[Guest]

Andy

Thanks for the above - it all helps in the quest for a better understanding of the RMS problem.

It is my hope that at their meeting with Porsche our 'side' are able to establish the true cause of the problem and secondly, the extent of the issue across our marque. Once that is known we can then start the process of working towards a resolution that will satisfy all parties.

BTW does anyone know the date for the meeting, who will be attending and has an agenda been prepared that we might see beforehand?

 

[Guest]

ORIGINAL: Nigel Cooper

BTW does anyone know the date for the meeting, who will be attending and has an agenda been prepared that we might see beforehand?

Testing, testing is there anyone out there or have I gone deaf?[:-]

 

[Helen Goff]

tumbleweed wofting by........................................................

 

[tim court]

RMS survey went out yesterday to members registered with Boxsters.

996ers suffered as well.... at least this one did!!

Any thoughts of extending the survey???

 

[Helen Goff]

the 996 R/S was asked if he wanted to take part in the survay but he declined.

maybe you should your own

 

[NicD]

Nigel,

I am on vacation in Dubai this week, so limited access to the Internet.
We have a meeting arranged for the 29th June. David Newton, John Bond and myself will meet with Geoff Turral.
I will present the results of the Club's Boxster RMS Survey and ask for Porsche Cars reaction and plan for dealing with the issue over the next years.
Note that I will not make the results of the Survey public before the meeting, as a courtesy to Porsche Cars
For sure, this meeting will be the start only and I dont expect to make big strides immediately.
I will also broach the subject of using Club members who own the current vehicles as a focus group for feedback on the vehicle and OPC performance. I hope this will be of interest to Porsche Cars.

 

[JCB..]

Nigel

It's nice to get a rapid response when posting but not everyone spends their life on the Internet so please be patient and show some consideration.

JCB..

 

[Guest]

Nic

Ideal response which covers points of concern to me - enjoy your hol's.

Nigel

 

[Guest]

ORIGINAL: JCB..

Nigel

It's nice to get a rapid response when posting but not everyone spends their life on the Internet so please be patient and show some consideration.

JCB..

John

As someone who is also 'pushed for time' I appreciate your thoughts and accept that I am somewhat impatient - but - when you have a minute perhaps you will oblige with a response to mine which I posted 7/6/2004 9:42:25 (approx 9 messages prior to this)

Keep up the good work that you do but can we also work towards being transparent in all that we do. There are numerous messages on this Forum from me that are still awaiting responses and when nothing is forthcoming, from anywhere, I do tend to think it is another one (for whatever reason) that has 'fallen on stony ground'.

keep well

Nigel