Are Spyders Becoming Extinct At OPCs!

[DarrellWilson]

To be truthful it didn't stay as a PGB car for too long before it went to a private owner, so really two previous careful owners.....and just maybe a dozen hooligans [] Tyres actually look very fresh so no signs of a lot of track use (only has 9k on clock) and 111 check showed it had been driven correctly throughout it's life. Can't wait to get out on track, it was born for it! Had pencilled in Bedford for tomorrow but given the weather forecast I crossed that one out as I'll never beat the Evo time in the wet.......but determined to do in the dry []

 

[daro911]

Good luck with her and if you get a chance post some pics up especially on a new page []

 

[daro911]

I was told (12 months ago) this is the closest we shall see for a Boxster Spyder or Cayman R replacement Anyone here tempted http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/porsche/85293/hardcore-porsche-boxster-gts-and-cayman-gts-models-spied

 

[Andy Fagan]

I hope they perform better than they look [8|] The wheels are particularly awful on both, I presume they are just for testing purposes [&:]

 

[daro911]

ORIGINAL: Andy Fagan I hope they perform better than they look [8|] The wheels are particularly awful on both, I presume they are just for testing purposes [&:]

They should now both be 0.00001 quicker than a Spyder or R [] Wheels won't be an issue on the real deal http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2014/01/porsche-cayman-boxster-gts-models-spied-testing.html

 

[rob.kellock]

Mmm... Bit of a parts bin special. Will reserve judgement but initially I am disappointed. Surprised they have gone for PASM over sports suspension. No buckets. Standard leather interior to please Mr D. Seems a bit more of a GT in line with current philosophy rendering the Spyder all the more desirable to the hardcore fans!!

 

[jdpef356]

I wont be parting with my spyder to join the que for either one of those![]

 

[MillerIanF]

Always fancied the TR5 PI but it never came my way, quite rare I think. Had a MGC though and thought it was a great car, despite what the journalists said. No Lotus, only "plastic" car a TVR which I liked. E Types were great cars to learn to drive in, you either became proficient or they killed you. Huge torque skinny tyres, rubbish brakes and no weight, still my only front end slide which I have no desire to re-live. Going to be controversial now, could never bring my self to buy a car with the engine hanging out the back and still have no interest, waited for the 986. I think it is interesting the situation Porsche now find themselves in, they have an icon in the 911 which forces them to keep making it. People continue to buy the 911 when it is not as competent for them as a Cayman and costs more, just a status thing. Porsche can't stop making the 911, it is just to big a risk to take, the only option is to try and re-position it. This begs the question how do you fill the gap left if the 911 heads in the GT direction, seems possible that the 911 performance engines end up in something they can develop from their Cayman/Boxster experience. Forgetting model names there has been talk of a Turbo 4 cylinder sports car, I wonder might we have an entry level 4 cylinder car, a more expensive 3.8 mid engined car and a 911 GT car. I think Porsche have some big decisions to make, indeed it is likely many have already been made. Just some thoughts. With regard to the Youtube video of the Spyder versus the Audi R8, which 911 would you have needed to beat the R8 I wonder ? Porsche know they can't keep the mid engined cars back.

 

[flat6]

ORIGINAL: DarrellWilson Surfing the net to find interesting videos of Spyders, as you do and found this.  To my surprise it's actually the car I've just bought.  One previous careful owner [] [link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Im5BSKMd0Ss]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Im5BSKMd0Ss[/link]

Ah yes I remember that one. Reaffirms that a sorted chassis and less weight can overcome extra horsepower. Porsche stated that the Spyder is 7 seconds quicker around the ring than an 'S'. That's an age and it's down to developing the car more than the engine. Imagine if the Spyder had 400bhp, it'd be second in stature only to the GT3 in Porsche's 2010 catalogue [] Must be nice to see your own car in a review, well, sort of[]

 

[DarrellWilson]

'.......well sort of....' It certainly doesn't put me off that my car has been driven in this way, its what I intend to do and why I bought the car as there's lots of press coverage speaking of it being a fantastic track car. I've come from Caterham racing and having considered many different options nothing else seem to offer the all round road/track focused package........but I also understand others wouldnt take their pride and joy near a circuit.

 

[flat6]

ORIGINAL: MillerIanF Going to be controversial now, could never bring my self to buy a car with the engine hanging out the back and still have no interest, waited for the 986. I think it is interesting the situation Porsche now find themselves in, they have an icon in the 911 which forces them to keep making it. People continue to buy the 911 when it is not as competent for them as a Cayman and costs more, just a status thing. Porsche can't stop making the 911, it is just to big a risk to take, the only option is to try and re-position it. This begs the question how do you fill the gap left if the 911 heads in the GT direction, seems possible that the 911 performance engines end up in something they can develop from their Cayman/Boxster experience. Forgetting model names there has been talk of a Turbo 4 cylinder sports car, I wonder might we have an entry level 4 cylinder car, a more expensive 3.8 mid engined car and a 911 GT car. I think Porsche have some big decisions to make, indeed it is likely many have already been made. Just some thoughts. With regard to the Youtube video of the Spyder versus the Audi R8, which 911 would you have needed to beat the R8 I wonder ? Porsche know they can't keep the mid engined cars back.

Not at all controversial. We've mulled over the reality here a few times and share your view. It'll get harder and harder to product place the boxster/cayman behind the carrera. The 981 chassis engineers have probably deflated the engine engineers in that they have had to launch the 981 with less power than the old 987 spyder & R in order to reign the overall package into the right product position. Does 10hp justify the extra price & position of a Cayman and 25hp extra in the Carrera. Carrera buyers wouldn't care if there's a hot 981snapping at their rear bumper if they aspiring to a base 911 for GT sporty crusing. Personally I think rear-engined design is a marvel and they wouldn't have won so many races with it if its superior traction wasn't a great asset. But overall, the mid-engined layout is a more optimum starting point for neutral handling and Porsche knows that has virtues to, which probably has a wider scope of development too, given the weight distribution starting point. But, the 911 should live on as a unique masterpiece of engineering. So, where will they take mid-engined design? Personally I think the rumoured 960 or 961 to sit above the 911, to take on the 458 and with similar £250k price tag, is where you'll see the mid-engine be allowed to usurp the 911. Makes better business sense I.e. the car to eclipse the brand icon is a £250k supercar which leave the icon intact as still the best in its segment of the Porsche portfolio. Porsche will only need to re-address the boxster/cayman if the competition brings something in their price bracket that really blows them away. Currently you can out-handle and out brake many cars you might choose instead of a boxster/cayman and that's why some of us buy them - because they handle better than the aalternatives. (Just the other day a car came racing up behind me on a motorway that was ending and coming to a roundabout with traffic llights that were on green. I let him past but as the roundabout approached and he started braking I had no plans to brake for and age yet and I wasn't even trying. I went through the light on green cornering with an ease that would have rolled his car. He didn't make it through as the traffic light caught him on red an age later and I never saw him again.) But when you have to think about dropping a few gears to manouvre around a saloon car on a straight piece of motorway, I do wish they wouldn't deny us just a bit more grunt.

 

[Stuartelec]

I would like to take mine out on the track, but worry that i would run out of talent on a corner and break my toy. Never done track day before, is it work going out a few times as part of a school?

 

[rob.kellock]

Go on a PCGB track day. You will have one of the best days of your life! Early start for a comprehensive "classroom" style driver briefing. Everyone will be told overtaking is by consent only, on the left only and on the straights only. The assembled attenders will then be split up into 3 groups who will have to go out on track behind a pace car with an instructor in it demonstrating the racing line. The first lap may not even exceed 30mph! Grab a coffee, let everyone else do their sighting laps and let the keen ones get their first session out of their system. Then avail yourself of an instructor - £20 for 20 mins or so. You will learn more than you would expect. You will then be ready to enjoy the day on your own and put the theory in to practice. The Spyder is perfect for this task. You don't crash it when you go round a fast corner on the road so why should you on track? It's still your car with you driving it but on track you have no speed cameras or people coming the other way. Track etiquette on PCGB days has always been superb in my experience. Next one for me will be Anglesey on 17th May. Am hoping flat6 may be able to make it too subject to his carting team manager role!

 

[flat6]

Rob is 100% right on everything he's just said and if you are new to track days then you shouldn't worry about wear or tear either unless you're a very good driver, which I'm not as I'm quite new to it. On my 2nd club track day in the Cayman, my tyres were at 3mm tread so I thought it a shrewd move to do the track day wear on the old tyres but keep an eye on the wear and still drive home just above the LEGAL limit before changing the tyres. Well, I had a great and drove as fast as I enjoyed but when I looked at the tyres they looked no different to a trip to the shops. No doubt the tyres and brakes if they could speak would say "Is that all you've got I'm still bored."[] I don't expect I take my car beyond 5 tenths of what it was designed to entertain. Yes if you're a skilled driver you can put some wear on your tyres & brake pads and boil your brake fluid but if you were that good or had that mindset I guess you wouldn't be asking the question and plan accordingly. A higher level driver could put some tyre wear on a 987, working at the limits of adhesion & a bit of tyre screeching when at the edge, but that is talent. Tyre smoking drift fests are what PCGB track days are not. The rest of us, like Rob says, drive like we do on the road just that it'sone way, can exceed 70mph and use the full road width for a good smooth line (smooth lines go easy on tyres and don't screech either). Running out of talent would have to be a premeditated careless mindset just like it would be on the road. And a novice driver going as fast as to screech the tyres probably is going to run out of talent. Before someone says they are comfortable screeching their tyres, your're not a novice by my definition[]

 

[Stuartelec]

Thanks Rob and Flat6, that's really good to know, That was just the sort of advice i required, i was worried about being a novice and causing problems for the more advanced drivers. Who do you use for insurance ETC? Definitely food for thought now. Will have to see if Geeforce is up for a day out .

 

[flat6]

ORIGINAL: DarrellWilson '.......well sort of....' It certainly doesn't put me off that my car has been driven in this way, its what I intend to do and why I bought the car as there's lots of press coverage speaking of it being a fantastic track car. I've come from Caterham racing and having considered many different options nothing else seem to offer the all round road/track focused package........but I also understand others wouldnt take their pride and joy near a circuit.

I hear you and Porsche agrees with you[] (sorry to the regulars who've seen it a few times before) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kh3A1ERsvY4&feature=youtube_gdata_player I think the old classics deserve to get reserved for concours duty after they've done they're driving in earlier years ( I think someone told me their car suffered problems by not being driven enough. Has anyone else heard that?). But the modern cars still have plenty of thrills to offer from behind the wheel before they spend more time driving at 2 tenths

 

[DarrellWilson]

Good advice from Rob and Flat6. Many track days do run in 20 min sessions of 3 groups - beginners, intermediates and advanced so as a beginner you would be out on track with a group also feeling a little cautious and not looking to break any records. You would also be surprised about how much time you can spend out on track with no other cars around you as with track number limits and lengths of circuits there's plenty of space. All you need to do if a quicker car approaches is move aside, signal for the driver to pass and you have your own track space again. Anglesey is one of my favourite circuits having had one of my very few podium finishes there so May 17th is on my calendar, I'm sure I'll be going at a steadier pace in the Spyder as the general rule with the caterham was 'drive it like you stole it'. I've been trying to find the 2014 track day calendar for PCGB but at the moment it still only shows 2013's calendar, anyone know of other track events/dates?

 

[ralphmusic]

ORIGINAL: DarrellWilson I think the old classics deserve to get reserved for concours duty after they've done they're driving in earlier years

I would not say that too loudly, lots of guys on here drive, track, race and rally their older cars (those before the 9x6/7 series)

 

[VvrooomM]

ORIGINAL: Stuartelec Thanks Rob and Flat6, that's really good to know, That was just the sort of advice i required, i was worried about being a novice and causing problems for the more advanced drivers. Who do you use for insurance ETC? Definitely food for thought now. Will have to see if Geeforce is up for a day out .

Only ever insured my cars on a track day once, think I drove closer to the cars ability which was above my own and therefore not the best idea as a result. A tow to a ditch a few miles away has always been my plan if something went wrong, probably due to another drivers error. Took my bmw's to the ring, spa, Bedford, silverstone and had a fantastic time at all of them. Spa probably topped them all and for me The Ring is now just too dangerous, not likely to get insurance for it either due to all the accidents.

 

[ralphmusic]

See the Club Track Days section where the following was reported a few days ago: "We are having a Motorsport Board meeting on Fri 24th Jan, whence the track day dates will be confirmed. As you have noted Anglesey will be on Sat 17th May followed by "Porsches on the Prom" at Llandudno on Sun 18th."